Iva-Marie Palmer, CHRISTMAS PEOPLE: A Novel

[1:34]Zibby Owens: This is Zibby Owens, and you're listening to Totally Booked with Zibby. Formerly, moms don't have time to read books. In my daily show, I interview today's latest best selling, buzziest, or underrated authors and story creators whose work I think is worth your time. As a bookstore owner, publisher, author, and obviously podcaster, I get a comprehensive look at everything that's coming out and spend my time curating the best books so you don't have to. Stay in the know, get insider insights, and connect with guests like I do every single day. For more information, go to zibbymedia.com, and follow me on Instagram at Zibby Owens. Iva Marie Palmer is the author of Christmas People. She is also the author of numerous books for children and teens, including the highly acclaimed you rom com, Gimme Everything You Got, and the Jules Verne prophecy series with Larry Schwartz. Before turning full time to writing, she worked as a web editor and writer for the Walt Disney Company, as an award winning reporter, and up close and personal with many a Christmas person as a Hallmark store employee. Iva Marie currently resides in Burbank, California with her husband and two sons. Christmas People is her first adult novel. Welcome, Iva Marie. Thank you so much for coming on Totally Booked to talk about Christmas People. Congratulations. Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here. And I had so much fun at the event at your store back in September before the book was out. It was so good to see you. It was great. I was so happy you were there. Okay. Tell everybody now that we're in full swing of the holiday season, tell me about your book and where you got the idea. And before all that, how do you feel about the holidays?

[3:21]Iva: Okay. Before all that, how do I feel about the holidays? Let's start with that. You know, I love the holidays, like, when they are in their finished state.

[3:33]Zibby Owens: Meaning meaning after

[3:35]Iva: the holidays, you love them. Yeah. When we're when or, like, in the pictures or in the, like, oh, that was so nice, the memories. And I don't hate the holidays by any means. I really loved the holidays as a kid, and, like, it was so exciting and so magical. And, you know, all the family together and all these, like, traditions and beautifully wrapped packages and lights or whatever. You know? And I know everyone has different traditions, so I'm not trying to exclude anyone here. But, you know, just all the the hubbub and the food and the dressing up and everything. And now I'm like, oh, wow. Someone had to do all that. It's really natural when you're a child. And then, like, once you have to do it, it's you know, it definitely you know, especially when you're trying to juggle a job and parents and children, you know, it just feels like you can't I always say I wanna get it done early so that I can, like, enjoy it. And that never happens. Like, I'm still I'm like, I'm gonna be up till the minute, like, you know, buying buying gifts or making food or whatever. And that's just is what it is. But I think in in retrospect, when you look back, like, you you try to tap into, like, those moments where you, like, got something right or really delighted someone. And so, yeah, I'm half Scrooge, half, like, whatever is the opposite of Scrooge.

[4:52]Zibby Owens: Okay. Okay. Good. It's good to have that context as we talk about Okay. Your So

[4:57]Iva: Chris and Seifold, tell everyone what it's about. Sure. And, you know, tapping into that Scrooge thing, and I did not figure this out until, like, the book was published. Oh my gosh. She's Lady Scrooge in, like, the worst possible environment for Lady Scrooge, which is like a world that's like her own, but Hallmark movie ed up. Like, if if you were to go to, like, your most familiar back like, place in your from your past and and then, you know, they just I I call it, like, balls out Christmas. Like, it is, like, you know, over the top, like like, right out of a Hallmark movie. You know, she's she is Jill is a character. She is not feeling the holidays. Her life has not really gone in the direction she's wanted since she moved to LA kind of to escape a bad breakup. And after three years of kind of avoiding going home for the holidays, she finally succumbs to her mom's guilt trip. And it's like, okay. I'll go. Knowing she might bump into her ex, but really trying hoping not to. And, of course, she does. And that kind of sets things in motion for her to get into this alternate reality after, like, a bad night of drinking too much, you know, where where it's, like, her town and all the people she knows and her ex plus the guy she liked in high school who, you know, married someone else but is a widower now. She finds herself in basically, like, the hallmark movie of her life. And we call it heartfelt movie in in my book, but you know? And and she realizes, like, in order to get back to her life, much as it's not a fabulous life to get back to, she has to, you know, be the star more or less of her own Hallmark movie or heartfelt movie. So, you know, but it's but it's but she's not the ideal heartfelt heroine. Even if even if she's got, that city girl vibe, she's, you know, she she's really, like, feeling down on herself in the holidays. She's she's a sad sack. I'll admit it. But she's, I hope, funny and observant and all of the things that we want in a in a lead character.

[6:57]Zibby Owens: And I love how you just have her, like, run like, realization moment sort of, I don't know, however far into the book it was where that is actually what was happening. And she's like, okay. So here's this, like, Reese Witherspoon almost lookalike with a different chin. And and what is going on? And, like, why is the tree back to normal? The whole thing. And she's just like, what is happening here? And then she slowly realizes it. It's so funny. I mean, just the way you capture her unfolding emotions and all of that. It's almost like

[7:28]Iva: if, like, a Melissa McCarthy or something was, like, stuck in a movie. I don't know. Somebody like that. Super funny. No. I I love that you said that because, yeah, it was that was such a fun part to write was because how like, heartfelt movies, Hallmark movies are you know, they're they're not quite like, they're they're fun to watch, but, like, there are all these things where it's like, okay. Like, you could have put a little more time into that. So, you know, it's it's funny to note, like, those things. Like, everything looks perfect, but, you know, then there's, like, the the actors are just, like, they look kind of like people that are really famous, but they're not quite famous. You know? Yeah. So it was it was a lot of fun for her, like someone as sharp as Jill to be like, what is going on here? And then know exactly what was happening.

[8:12]Zibby Owens: I found it really sad. At first, didn't know that Cory was a widower and then that eventually came out. And that was like I was like, oh, no. You know? When you think that everybody has, like, this perfect life, because that's another sort of theme, I feel like, that everything looks perfect on the outside, but it is not perfect. And I feel like that was one of the first reminders of that. Yeah. No. And that was really fun, and I'm glad you caught that. Like, it's I so often think about that, like, how how

[8:36]Iva: frequently all of us look at other people's lives and assume, like, you know, it looks it it feels just like the pictures and the the perfectly staged family photographs. And and I just thought that was a lot of fun. And she also has another moment later with someone she kind of regarded as, like, an enemy, Fiona Leonard. And I don't wanna give anything away. But, you know, she Jill definitely goes around, I think, because she's so unsure of herself, like, thinking, oh, everyone figured everything out, and I have screwed up royally. And I I just think that's an important thing to play with, and I like to think about that in my work a lot. Tell me about these sticky cookies.

[9:12]Zibby Owens: Sticky Santa cookies. Oh, like a messy Santa. I'm sorry. Messy Santa cookies. No. It's okay. They are sticky. They are sticky.

[9:19]Iva: So yeah. I mean, the messy Santa, like and I don't know if you've read the whole book yet or not, but they were sort of it was it was a bit it was that writing magic. I I was telling a friend, you know, they were like, did you plan that? Because I wrote you know, I I was picturing this chaotic scene Yep. With sticky children having made, like, the most disgusting cookie you've ever seen, which is sort of what happens when, like, my kids and I make cookies. Like, some of them look okay. Like, I have no decorating abilities, but but then there's also just, like, a child's tendency to be like, why would I not use every possible ingredient on the top of this cookie? And so I was just imagining this, like, horrifying cookie that her niece and nephew are presenting to her and calling the messy Santa. And then, you know, later on, she's in a baking competition. And this isn't a spoiler, but, you know, it's it's one of the ideas that resurfaces. Like, what if, you know, even in this very perfect reality, we tinker with the cookie and make it feel a little bit like the chaos of the holidays? And I don't wanna get I don't wanna give too much away. Okay. Okay. I shouldn't have brought it up. Nice. It's always so nice as a writer when, like, something that you write early on in the book, like, later feels like it was meant to be. I just had that experience with the book I'm following this up with. And I was like, oh, this is this is like what you do it for. Like, you know, there's all the hard And then once in a while, there's that bit of magic that happens. And I think that's what keeps you going as a writer to be me. Wait. Give us a preview of your next book. Oh, sure. So my editor wanted, you know, a a new year concept. So what I can say is like, it doesn't have a title yet, but I just turned in the draft. It's about two rival news people in Chicago who both are vying for the anchor position of, you know, like, the local Chicago news show, but it's still a pretty big deal. And on New Year's Eve, they get trapped in an elevator together as they're trying to go to the station owner's penthouse to pitch themselves. And, you know, after arguing in the elevator, they they wake up, and they find they're married and they're co anchors. And they have no idea how this happened. They solve the mystery of, like, their own success and whatever they did to get this job and be together. So it's a lot of fun to write, but it's it's in revision. So I don't I don't wanna say too much because some things could change.

[11:46]Zibby Owens: So That sounds really good. Lot of fun. So talk a little bit also about how you morphed from writing for younger audiences to adults, and how do you feel about that? How did you get your start writing for people who don't know?

[12:02]Iva: Oh, sure. Well, I actually started as a ghost writer with Alloy Entertainment. I worked on some of their books, like, from the early two thousands. I won't say which ones because I still feel like, oh, I'm not supposed to tell. You don't have to tell. You don't have to tell. I won't tell. But I, you know, I wrote several young adult with them. And and then I got into like, after I sort of went on my own, I I did some middle grade, and I still write middle grade. I have another middle grade coming out. I hope soon we're in revisions with that as well, the sequel to the Jewels of Iron Prophecy, which I wrote with Larry Shores. Mhmm. That should come out, I hope, in 2027. But the transition to adult, like, I I actually was talking to Elle again, and I said, you know, I would love to do an adult book. And I feel like I'd like to do it with you all because they really know the market, especially in the the romance, the rom com field. Mhmm. So, you know, we started hashing out, like, what would we want this what would I want this to be about? And I said, you know, I love, like, stuff with the holidays, but not anything that feels, like, too cutesy. Mhmm. And I I also love, you know, rom coms, but I I feel like some rom coms tend toward, like, softer humor, and I really wanted to write a broadly humorous rom com. You know, probably, like, you know, maybe a little more it's almost, like, retro in a sense because I feel like rom coms have really softened in a lot of ways, like, in the recent years, and I I miss some of those, you know, more brazenly, like, laugh out loud romantic comedies. So I I wanted to do something with them, and that's kind of how this was born. How I feel about it, you know, it's it's not that different. It's, you know, I I I read so much across all genres and age groups that I felt ready. I mean, it's it's been more exciting in some ways because you can definitely connect with readers better than you can on the middle grade or the young adult side. Like, you know, it's it's hard unless you're a book talker for a young adult to, like, really reach reach teens. Mhmm. And and middle grade, you know, you just you hope that parents will find it, but they're not really talking to you. So this is great because I'm really hearing from readers who loved it, and I get to meet readers at these events. And, you know, and and there's such a big community around romance that, you know, you're just you feel like you're really part of something, and that's been exciting. So I'm I'm happy to be here, and I hope I can stay in this this realm, like,

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[17:25]Zibby Owens: Tell me a little bit because we're talking about holidays and, I mean, loss and all of that, and I know that you've lost your mom, and I'm so sorry. And you write about that, of course, in the acknowledgments, and I know that this time of year can be so stressful. And, you know, that whole messy middle of it all sandwich generation.

[17:41]Iva: How is that all going? Sure. I mean, my mom, you know, she she passed away in 2012, and I think that was, like, one of the biggest shocks. She she, you know, she died in September 2012. So, like, right at the cusp of all the holidays. And she'd been sick for two years. She she got sick right as I had my first son. And then the first two years of his life, she was battling her scleroderma and a host of health problems that it caused. That was really she still was really committed to doing Christmas or, you know, and Thanksgiving. She was trying, you know, and I would help her, but she was still like had the energy or mustered it to like do the holidays. So it was a shock when, you know, that first year, I was like, well, I better do this. Like someone you know, we're out here. My family's from Chicago. But when my husband and I moved here, my parents came, like, about a year and a half later. And my brother is out here because he works in the industry. So, you know, it's a smaller family than what I grew up with. Like, I have aunts and uncles in Florida, and I still have, you know, family in Chicago. So it, you know, it was like, if we're staying here for the holidays, like, it's going to be small, but I can't let it feel inconsequential. Like, I have to, like, uphold that legacy. But it really is, like, taking on a lot, and then you realize, like, how important it all was to you. You know, like, my mom, you know, and her mom made so much food on Christmas Eve. We're half Italian. And, like, I tried to maintain, you know, as many of those recipes as I can. And she just went all out for, like, gifts and, like, with just thinking of things, her thoughtfulness, like, in her ability to find something you weren't expecting or didn't know you needed. And I don't know that I'm as good at that. Like, that's where I'm literally like, oh. But, you know, you miss that and you miss, like, even just, you know, like, I don't get to, like, go shopping with my mom or, like, you know, go cook with her. I cook with my dad, which is great. Like, we he really carried it on and he's not a big cook. So, you know, but that that was important to him, like, to carry on her memory, like, by by, you know, making out like, trotting out the recipes, which was crazy in the year after because my mom had all these scattered notes, and you kind of had to to collate, like, okay. What do we need here? This seems like it's part of the recipe with this. And, you know, it it really also shows me how how important it is to, like, hand down memories to the next generation and to to make sure they know, you know, what like, they're not scrambling to figure out the traditions and the recipes and all that stuff. Yeah. So I know that's a long answer, but it's it's hard. And, like, those are just the practical level parts that are hard. And then it's just like, you know, seeing your kids grow up and think like, wow. They my mom would have loved them. You know? Yeah. It probably hits a little harder at the holidays. So, yeah, it's it never really ends. It it morphs and, you know, and it's nice that we're able to memory like, celebrate her memory through traditions.

[20:50]Zibby Owens: Oh, it's, like, bittersweet as my mom my mom would say. My grandmother used to make this amazing, almost like a a sponge cake with, like, shaved chocolate and this, like, inch thick frosting, and it was, like, the cake she made for every holiday. And I found the recipe, which, again, like yours, was, like, cobbled together in a box, like, ribbed from a magazine with, like, things crossed out and all this stuff. And my mother-in-law, who also has now since passed away, was is a was a baker. And she was like, I could do this. Let me figure it out. And she's like, no. No. No. This doesn't sound right. Wait. Let me try this. And she tried it a couple times, and she, like, recreated the cake, and we had it, and it was amazing. It was amazing. And it was, like, bringing my grandmother back to life. And now right after like, soon after that, my mother-in-law also passed away. So I don't know. These tastes of the past that, like, come through all the sensory experiences and through these traditions, and that was around the holidays as well, which is why I brought it up. It just I don't know. It just hits such a nerve. It it really does. And I'm really glad that someone was able to recreate that cake. Did your mother-in-law write that down for you so that you can She wrote her own little notes on the recipe. So I'm like, I can't make heads or tails of this whole thing now at all.

[22:05]Iva: Yeah. No. I think that's the worst part or the most disappointing part. There are some things, like, that I have tried to recreate, and they just don't work the same. Fortunately, our Christmas dinner has worked well just through, like, research and whatever. But but, you know, just things my mom like, these cookies. Like, my uncle I have an uncle that ask me every year, like, do you know how your mom made these? Like, they were, like, these chocolate cookies, and she would use do you know the Play Doh thing where you push the Play Doh through? Yes. Yes. She would use that. Like, it was specifically just for these cookies. Like, so it didn't have light on it. But I'd watch her make them every year, like, fascinated. My mom was using this Play Doh thing, but she pushed the cookie through and make, like, a log shape. And then each end was dipped in this, like, chocolate frosting. But for the life of me, I can't find a recipe. I can't figure out what kind of dough it was because my attempts, it, like, never works. And my uncle asked me every year, like, those were so good because my mom would make so many cookies, and she'd mail them to her brothers and, like, mail them across the country. And I'm like, I am so sorry. I don't think you're ever getting that cookie again because I really cannot, you know, replicate it. And I feel like even if I did, it wouldn't be the same for him because it's it's just you have these memories of food and and things people did with love for you. And it's you know, there's there's maybe a little piece that's just not quite the same. I don't know. But I think that's special. Like, that's where you can say, like, that's how they made it special, and that was their special thing. Totally.

[23:35]Zibby Owens: Well, I'm sure that people listening around this holiday season are having all all the feelings surrounding surrounding this time and and the food and everything and books like yours that poke fun at some of the traditions, poke fun at some of the the family chaos, the imperfectness of it all, and yet the love that courses through everything. I mean, I feel like all that just can make this period of time imbued with a little bit more meaning. So I'm truly grateful that that you've added that to the world.

[24:06]Iva: Thank you. Yeah. And it was important to me that I didn't make it feel like I was mocking the holiday. No. No. No. Not at all. Realization that it was And no. No. And you you you totally get it. Like, I think it was trying really hard to say, like, look, some of this stuff, we are ridiculous. And some of the things I worry about even now, I'm like, you know what? That's not what my kids will remember if, like, they got x, y, or z or, like, you know, some of those big things. The things I remember are these very specific, like, small, thoughtful moments that, you know, that you carry with you. So it's or, like, times with your family or, like, crazy, you know, things that even went wrong. Like, I'll never forget, like, a Thanksgiving where, like, something our plumbing, like, broke. And I'm with my dad and uncle walking through, like, a hardware store looking for a plunger, and I'm like and it was just so nice and cozy and, like, to be with two people who love me and were like, we're gonna do we're gonna take care of this ourselves because we're not calling a plumber on Thanksgiving. You know, it was you know, there's all these things, like, that are just like, the moments that you remember aren't necessarily the ones that you tried to orchestrate it. It can be the chaos, and it can be, like, you know, the things that are a little off. And so I really wanted to capture that in the in the book. Amazing.

[25:27]Zibby Owens: Well, Iva, thank you so much. Thanks for coming on, and thanks for this lovely, meaningful conversation. I really appreciate it. Thanks so much, Zibby. And I appreciate

[25:36]Iva: you having me on and and supporting books and, you know, everything in general, the book community.

[25:42]Zibby Owens: Thank you. Well, happy holidays. You too. Okay. Okay. Bye bye. You for listening to Totally Booked with Zibby, formerly moms don't have time to read books. If you loved the show, tell a friend, leave a review, follow me on Instagram at Zippy Owens, and spread the word. Thanks so much. Oh, and buy the books.