Brooke Shields, BROOKE SHIELDS IS NOT ALLOWED TO GET OLD: Thoughts on Aging as a Woman
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[0:45]Brooke Shields is the author of Brooke Shields is not allowed to get old, thoughts on aging
[0:50]as a woman.
[0:51]This was an event at the Temple Emanuel Striker Center.
[0:54]I was supposed to moderate this event and have been really looking forward to it, but
[0:59]it fell over the time period where I have been canceling events due to the immediacy
[1:04]of the LA fire and its impact on me.
[1:06]And so Jessica Shaw, who is a serious XM star, took over an interviewed book on my behalf.
[1:15]Either way, here is the conversation, which I hope you will enjoy.
[1:19]FYI, I listened to the entire book of Brooke Shields is not allowed to get old on audiobook
[1:25]while I was in LA.
[1:26]The Dewey's before the fire, and I will never forget driving through the streets listening
[1:31]to Brooke as she helps me laugh and feel good about aging and being a woman and so much
[1:38]else.
[1:39]And I am a huge fan.
[1:40]This is one of my most anticipated books of 2025.
[1:43]A quick bio, Brooke Shields is an actress, author, mother, and wife.
[1:47]She is the author of two previous books, Down Came the Rain, and there was a little girl.
[1:51]She resides with her family in New York City, where she was born.
[1:54]Thank you, Brooke.
[1:56]Thank you.
[1:57]There's so much to talk about with Brooke about this book that we were just already getting
[2:01]into it.
[2:02]Welcome, everyone.
[2:03]I'm Jessica Shaw.
[2:05]So thankful to Brooke Shields for being here to talk about Brooke Shields is not allowed
[2:11]to get old, which I gobbled up in one evening, and it is still...
[2:17]It's not check off.
[2:19]Listen, it is so thoughtful, and there are these moments you read it as you all will,
[2:24]where you just say, yes, yes, Brooke.
[2:27]So I'm curious when I think about the books that you've written, when I think about Down
[2:31]Came the Rain, which you wrote about postpartum depression.
[2:36]To me, it segues so perfectly into this book as far as honesty and talking about your
[2:43]life, but also talking about your life in a way that reflects what so many other women
[2:47]are going through, but so many of your friends are going through.
[2:51]So was there a specific moment or impetus that you thought, this is what I am writing
[2:56]next?
[2:57]It actually happened upon me.
[2:59]I was in the midst of starting my own company, which is called Commence, and I was building
[3:07]this brand, and we were really growing, and my agent said, why don't you write a book
[3:13]about becoming a CEO in your late 50s?
[3:17]And that's not a whole book, but as I was going through the process, it was such a new
[3:23]world for me to be in, and there were so many struggles, and I had to learn so much so quickly
[3:29]that I thought, okay, maybe it's a good jumping off place, because first of all, why is
[3:34]it so unbelievable that a woman could be this old and start a company?
[3:41]It was shocking that a woman this age could actually start something new and had something
[3:46]to offer, and so then I started getting mad, and that's helped me write the book.
[3:52]And I said, but rather than it just being sort of a self-indulgent analysis, I've written
[3:58]about sad things and drama and overcoming obstacles like that, but I didn't want this to
[4:05]be sad book about, oh, this is the end of the line, I wanted it to really be a celebration
[4:13]of what this era in a woman's life really means.
[4:16]And I said, oh, let it rip, it's all good, but I wanted to include statistics and research
[4:25]and all of the numbers that when you hear them, you cannot believe what's happening to
[4:31]women and the representation in marketing and advertising and all of it.
[4:36]And I thought, this will be an interesting correlation, say, this is why this is happening,
[4:40]this is why this is happening.
[4:43]The research is extraordinary, and you cite so many studies, and it's fascinating the
[4:49]way that the trillions of dollars that women over 50 kind of control and are in charge
[4:56]of the fact that I think one of the statistics you cite that one in four Americans is a woman
[5:02]over 50.
[5:03]I mean, it's so, now the millennials are turning 40, so it's just getting bigger.
[5:09]There's one millennial right here, a pause for the millennials, but there are numbers
[5:15]are getting bigger and the demographic is getting bigger and even more diverse.
[5:21]Yeah, and it's one thing, you know, I imagine that you have these thoughts and then another
[5:26]thing when you then go and dig into the research and they validate so much of what you've
[5:31]been seeing and thinking and feeling and talking to your friends about.
[5:36]So what was the research process like for you with this book?
[5:40]So I had never written with another person and I said, look, I don't want to know the
[5:46]research first.
[5:47]I want to really sort of take myself through writing this book as if I wasn't going to
[5:52]do research.
[5:54]And simultaneously, she was brilliant because she was in my brain and she did extensive
[6:02]research and would come back to me with copious facts and situations and then they would
[6:09]unbelievably parallel and they would match up with a story that I had just told.
[6:14]I didn't want the way I wrote the book to be colored in any way by facts that I knew.
[6:20]And I didn't want it to sound too literary, sometimes when I get too fact based or too
[6:26]insecure about how I write, I then want to sound literary and I want to sound educated
[6:32]and sometimes that is not a good thing.
[6:35]I wanted it to be more raw.
[6:38]You just a minute or two ago you were talking about how you feel like you'd written sad
[6:42]things and you wanted this to be something different and I have to say one of the things
[6:48]that I loved so much about the book is that in your talking about aging, it's not one
[6:56]or the other.
[6:57]It's not what was me, I'm aging, nor is it like, yes, this rocks, wrinkles are the
[7:04]best, you know, and I love what my knees touch my ankle.
[7:09]Yes.
[7:10]Yeah.
[7:11]By the way, there's an A plus tip in there for that.
[7:13]Yeah.
[7:14]I will say it really.
[7:15]I can spoil it.
[7:16]But it's interesting because we live in, I feel like we live in a culture where we don't
[7:21]embrace the gray, we don't embrace the non-binary with anything.
[7:26]It feels to me like if you are over 50, you either have to be like, it's awesome, no
[7:34]negotiation on that, or like throwing in the towel.
[7:39]And one thing that you do so beautifully in this book is just honestly talk about it from
[7:44]all sides.
[7:46]That's what life is, you know, I mean puberty sucks, right?
[7:50]But there's something wonderful about it as well, you know, it's all beginning yet you
[7:54]have acne and cramps and all that kind of stuff.
[7:56]And it's so interesting when you look back, everything has such a duality to it.
[8:02]And I think women have such a calm, they're so complex and they've lived, we've lived
[8:07]so many different lives that it's, it's done that people don't know exactly what to do
[8:12]with it.
[8:13]So it's much easier to jump right over us and go right to menopause, you know, and it's
[8:19]great that we're having the conversation about menopause because nobody was talking
[8:23]about postpartum, nobody was talking about menopause, everything is an icky topic.
[8:27]And so I appreciate that.
[8:29]But you, I always say this, you're either the hot girl at the bar or you're in depends.
[8:35]But like that's how it won, one fourth of all, only one fourth of all advertisers feature
[8:44]a woman in their inner six days.
[8:47]And to me that the dynamic nature of what it is to have lived this long and still have
[8:53]more to live is what's interesting.
[8:55]It's always the duality of things that are interesting to me because we, our brains are
[9:00]computers.
[9:01]If we ask them only negative questions, we come up with only negative answers.
[9:05]It's very clear.
[9:07]If you start to look at asking yourself more positive, it's not my opposite of it, but
[9:12]like really analyze the things that make you different and extraordinary.
[9:17]You start coming into this era of your life with strength and confidence and not arrogance,
[9:24]not vanity, not those things that I used to associate confidence and beauty with.
[9:31]You learn about it differently.
[9:32]And to me, I'd be lying if I said, oh, that's great.
[9:37]I can't wait to, whatever, not be able to sneeze without peeing in my pants, I'm not
[9:44]going to, that's not great, right, but or cough.
[9:47]And so it's kind of like, but why don't we just sort of laugh at it and then talk about
[9:53]the other stuff that accompanies this era.
[9:56]Yeah.
[9:57]Yeah.
[9:58]That question about whoa.
[10:00]What is confidence?
[10:01]And I'm curious for you, if you noticed,
[10:05]if you felt that sort of line and you noticed,
[10:08]oh, I'm in this place where almost like somehow,
[10:13]I am appreciating my talent, my accomplishments,
[10:18]my intelligence in a way that's not,
[10:21]but, you know, dah, dah, dah, but I'm not XYZ.
[10:25]I used to fear not being relatable, you know,
[10:28]and I would say, well, I want to be relatable.
[10:30]And then as I got a little older, I'm like,
[10:32]I don't want to be too relatable.
[10:34]Like they always say like wishful filming, right?
[10:36]And I think women have a tendency to,
[10:40]well, okay, this is what I've spent many decades doing,
[10:44]is make myself smaller.
[10:46]So as not to be a threat.
[10:48]So as to have to sort of walk into a room
[10:51]and be non-threatening, you know?
[10:54]And I think that historically,
[10:56]that's what happens with women
[10:58]is, you know, be soft-spoken, don't rock the boat,
[11:02]don't do this.
[11:03]And that's been happening since the dawn of time.
[11:06]And it was in writing this book
[11:08]that I started feeling, wait a minute,
[11:10]I can step into the bigness, if you will,
[11:14]of being in this era.
[11:16]And I don't have to apologize for it.
[11:19]And I think that that's amazing.
[11:20]Like I used to apologize.
[11:22]And by the way, we still do this.
[11:23]If you say something or do something,
[11:27]or you're bumping into someone,
[11:28]but we always say, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
[11:31]And I'm like, why don't we just say, excuse me?
[11:34]But we say, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
[11:36]And then you get to this age and you think,
[11:39]I don't want to be sorry anymore.
[11:40]I don't want to keep putting myself down.
[11:41]It's exhausting.
[11:43]Yeah, I guess.
[11:44]And we like girls grow up doing that
[11:47]and women do that and at a certain point.
[11:49]Sometimes I feel like I did that last night at a cafe
[11:52]and then I caught myself and I was like,
[11:54]I'm not sorry, you know, it's okay.
[11:56]No crisis just happened.
[11:58]And it's interesting to have those moments
[12:00]where you take a breath and you observe the things
[12:03]that you have gotten so used to doing over and over,
[12:07]whether it's when you're saying
[12:08]or something you're thinking.
[12:09]And starting commence, by the way,
[12:12]if you want to know more about it,
[12:13]go to shopcommence.com and you can see what we're doing.
[12:17]I've poured my life into this and my heart and soul and money.
[12:20]And it's been a huge learning curve.
[12:25]But in doing this and in having to go out
[12:29]and ask for money and having to talk to VC guys
[12:33]to have to like go into these very male,
[12:36]the presence of the male was so permeated these meetings
[12:40]and walking in first sort of like a little girl
[12:44]and then sort of getting scolded by these men.
[12:49]And then kind of coming out saying like,
[12:51]wow, that didn't feel like it fit.
[12:53]It just didn't feel appropriate.
[12:55]And then gaining confidence and sort of trying to talk
[13:00]to people that start with condescension
[13:03]and say, you know what?
[13:04]I don't really deserve to be condescended too.
[13:07]But you have to learn how to navigate that type
[13:10]of a dialogue within these situations.
[13:13]So the discomfort of starting a business
[13:15]and the fear of starting a business
[13:18]and whether I was 20 or 55 when I started this
[13:23]is what led me to feeling like I could walk
[13:26]into a room bigger than I'd ever done before.
[13:31]Can you please tell the story in the book?
[13:33]There are many incredible stories of what happened
[13:36]when you were going to get funding for commens
[13:39]and someone man's playing to you
[13:41]because it's one of my favorite moments.
[13:46]Yeah.
[13:47]So I'm within a meeting and it was a big, big VC guy
[13:52]and his team.
[13:53]And we sort of did our initial pitch and showed them our deck.
[13:57]And before even asking a question,
[14:01]this guy started telling me what we were doing wrong
[14:04]and how we weren't going to be successful and why
[14:07]and how you know all the guys you're going to want money from?
[14:10]Well, they've already traded you in for the younger model.
[14:13]So they're not going to understand.
[14:15]And their wives are not going to be able to tell them why
[14:17]it's a good company.
[14:19]I mean, it just started to go on.
[14:22]And I finally said, excuse me, excuse me.
[14:25]I said, I'm not going to pretend at what I'm going to say
[14:28]is not going to sound disrespectful.
[14:30]But it's the only thing that I can think to say right now.
[14:33]I said, but I know your time is valuable.
[14:36]And I appreciate you taking it to be with us.
[14:39]But the beauty of this situation is I'm not
[14:43]asking for your opinion.
[14:45]I'm asking for your money.
[14:49]And it came out of my mouth.
[14:50]And I thought, oh, my God, am I a bitch?
[14:52]Like, is that the way it's going to be?
[14:54]But if a guy had said something like that,
[14:57]it would have been like, oh, he's a great business man.
[15:00]And he kind of went, oh, and I said, really, I'm not
[15:04]trying to be insulting.
[15:05]I'm just holding my own.
[15:08]And we're early.
[15:10]You probably only invest millions and millions of millions
[15:13]of dollars.
[15:13]We're not there yet.
[15:14]We'll come back to you.
[15:16]And so I sort of acknowledge that we'll
[15:18]come back to him, but it was from a place of strength
[15:23]rather than arrogance or disrespect.
[15:26]I was respecting myself before the other person.
[15:30]And we had worked so hard on all of this.
[15:34]And it means so much to me.
[15:36]And it has such a beautiful future that I thought,
[15:39]I'm not going to let some guy who's got some complex and just
[15:42]make me smaller and man's playing your business to you.
[15:47]And by the way, every woman, even DC, that we met, never
[15:54]only offered not advice, but things that had worked for them.
[15:59]So there was this different way, instead of you, you, you.
[16:02]It was, well, you know, something we've learned in this process
[16:06]is, and it opened up a conversation.
[16:09]And we took all their advice, because they weren't
[16:12]trying to talk down to us.
[16:13]They were also trying to lift us up.
[16:15]And that was something that we found as a sort of a through line
[16:18]in the book, too.
[16:20]Yeah, it's interesting that you say that, because it's something
[16:23]you write about also.
[16:24]And especially in talking about menopause.
[16:27]I mean, there were fascinating statistics, how few women
[16:31]learn about menopause from their doctors.
[16:34]How few doctors, yeah, I learned it in medical school.
[16:39]And that's insane to me.
[16:40]Yes, it is totally not OK on any level.
[16:44]And it's horrifying, and it makes you, oh, all right,
[16:48]why is misogyny baked into the medical establishment?
[16:52]And doctors simply don't know.
[16:55]And it's an opportunity, also, in the way
[16:58]that women are there for each other.
[17:01]How do you learn about things like menopause
[17:03]or different things that women go through?
[17:05]You go to your friends.
[17:06]You go to your friends.
[17:07]Sometimes you go online.
[17:09]You go to your community.
[17:10]You go to your sisters, whatever it is.
[17:13]And is that something that, as you were navigating that
[17:17]and like, god, who am I going to go to?
[17:18]Talk about hormones.
[17:20]Did you have your people?
[17:21]I had not, not only did I have my people,
[17:24]but I did have some medical professionals who were
[17:28]and some women and most were women.
[17:31]And they had an open conversation with me about it.
[17:35]But there's so much in the medical profession
[17:38]that women experience differently.
[17:41]A woman's expression of pain is calibrated differently
[17:45]to medical professionals than a man's expression of pain.
[17:49]And it was so interesting how I was in the hospital
[17:53]for quite some time with a broken femur.
[17:55]And I wanted to understand more about what my options were
[17:59]and what was happening, because I was there a long time
[18:02]by myself.
[18:03]And I just listened to everything they said.
[18:06]And so one day, the infectious disease person came in,
[18:09]because I had an infection.
[18:10]And I said, I asked him a question.
[18:13]And it was an educated, say that 10 times fast.
[18:18]But it was an educated question in so far
[18:22]as I had listened to everything that they had said prior
[18:25]over the course of the few weeks.
[18:27]And instead of just answering my question,
[18:29]the guy turned to me and said, have you been googling WebMD?
[18:34]And I thought, well, no, I said, and if I did,
[18:37]I'd be convinced you're trying to kill me.
[18:40]But I was like, but the audacity of, I said,
[18:45]I've been listening to everything that you all
[18:47]have been saying in front of me as if I don't exist.
[18:51]And I know they're on shifts and there's so many people.
[18:53]But it is so hard to learn how to self advocate,
[18:56]because then when you do, you're a difficult patient.
[19:00]And learning all of these things and then
[19:03]learning going into the research for that
[19:05]and learning what that was.
[19:07]And I couldn't, I didn't have my girlfriends.
[19:10]I could call them.
[19:11]But this was a dire medical sort of emergency.
[19:15]But what I also learned about that is the female friendships
[19:20]to actually answer your question.
[19:21]I'm sorry.
[19:22]The female friendships that I rely on have also changed
[19:28]within this era of my life.
[19:30]We rely on each other differently.
[19:33]And the nature of those friendships has changed,
[19:37]but I rely on fewer, but more deeply.
[19:42]That's interesting, tell me more about that.
[19:44]So because I think friendships
[19:46]have been the conversation about friendship
[19:48]as we get older and particular women's friendships.
[19:51]And I will say one of the things I found very moving
[19:53]in the book, you write about your friendship
[19:55]with Ali Wentworth, someone you've worked with,
[19:57]and multiple times now.
[20:00]and who was a dear friend to you,
[20:02]and how you met her a lot of people,
[20:05]there's this narrative of,
[20:06]you don't make deep friendships after 20,
[20:10]and they're in your book, it's yet one more thing
[20:13]that you're like, actually, no.
[20:15]Well, so we measure friendships with
[20:18]how long we've known each other,
[20:20]and it's just an interesting dynamic,
[20:23]and women do that, when you're in grade school,
[20:26]you're like, I'll be your best friend,
[20:27]and then as you kind of go through teen years
[20:31]and a little bit later, it becomes how many friends
[20:34]you have, indicates how popular you are,
[20:39]or where you are in your life,
[20:41]and then as you get older,
[20:43]you really start to realize that I have fewer friends,
[20:46]it's not about the number, it's about the level
[20:50]of friendship and the intimacy, the friendship, the trust,
[20:54]and all of that, and meeting a woman
[20:57]in my 50s, everybody would say like,
[21:00]how long have you guys known each other
[21:01]because we have a very cohesive dynamic together,
[21:06]and we're funny, and we bounce off each other,
[21:09]and my first answer was always not as long
[21:13]as it feels like it should be to be this loving
[21:17]of a person and needing them in their year life,
[21:20]and I worried that it didn't count,
[21:23]because I hadn't known her for 20 years,
[21:25]and you also realize you're, I'm different now,
[21:29]there's still me, but there's, I'm a different person,
[21:32]so I need things differently from friends,
[21:36]and to meet a new friend in this age
[21:38]just felt so, it was a revelation to me,
[21:42]and I think that that's important,
[21:43]we shouldn't hinder ourselves or be, it's okay,
[21:47]how great is it that you can keep adding
[21:49]to sort of the fabric of your whole life, you know,
[21:53]and women friendships sort of was, you know,
[21:57]it's like, oh, it's just Majong, you know,
[21:59]or quilt making or something like that,
[22:02]like we get together like a bunch of bitties,
[22:03]and we just, you know, bitch about everybody.
[22:05]It's like, no, when you're really surrounded by
[22:09]your friend peers, the level of conversation
[22:14]is so brilliant and so diverse,
[22:16]that it's just empowering, it's exciting.
[22:19]Yeah, and sometimes I feel like because you are,
[22:23]like all of us are more, we know who we are more,
[22:27]that you don't need to claw through those layers of BS
[22:32]to get to a level of intimacy with some emotional intimacy
[22:36]with a friend.
[22:37]It can be a shorthand, and it doesn't always happen
[22:40]when it does, it's refreshing and it does feel like a gift,
[22:44]and there was one day that I just respect her so much
[22:49]and I love how she mothers and I love her sense of humor
[22:54]and her brain, and I said to her one day,
[22:57]I was a moment of vulnerability, I said,
[22:58]I just can't believe you're my friend,
[23:00]and she said, don't do that, don't do that,
[23:04]and I said, oh, God, I was, I was going back to high school
[23:08]thinking that she was one of the cold kids
[23:10]and she had invited me to the party, you know,
[23:12]and she's like, that's not, we're past that,
[23:15]and I thought, wow, yeah, you're right, you're right.
[23:19]But aren't you happy that I'm your friend?
[23:20]I was like, tell me about when you were sitting down
[23:28]to write when you have all these ideas
[23:30]and you'd have things I want to dig into
[23:33]and I want to talk about, what is that process like for you?
[23:37]Are you like a list maker?
[23:39]Like I want to hit this, this, this, and this?
[23:41]Are you like just vomit out all the words person?
[23:45]First of all, I say a prayer that my husband's not gonna read
[23:47]and you know, because the headlines that have come out now
[23:52]he's like, really, really, you had to tell that story about me.
[23:55]I'm not, I don't make lists, I usually make lists
[23:58]with everything else.
[23:59]When I'm writing a memoir, I really do have to just
[24:04]sort of vomit it out and have an editor edit it
[24:08]and then ask me questions with regards to what they need
[24:11]embellishment of or what they need more of,
[24:14]and I don't ever read it back.
[24:16]But I don't read it back until that chapter is completely done.
[24:20]And because I, again, will try to make myself smarter
[24:25]and use all the words I learned, you know?
[24:28]And I don't ever want this type of, and I only write memoirs
[24:33]so I don't, my joke is I don't have original thought,
[24:36]but I just only, I write about things that have happened
[24:39]and my perception of them.
[24:41]And so I can't really start to analyze it,
[24:44]otherwise I'll kind of craft it differently.
[24:47]So, and by the time you get a few chapters without reading them
[24:51]and then you have to go back and kind of add the edits,
[24:55]it's fresh to me and I can hear my voice in it
[24:58]and I'm not judging it and I'm not trying to fix it.
[25:01]The parts where you write about the medical establishment
[25:04]and different things and like some of the things that made,
[25:07]you know, all sorts of headlines,
[25:08]you had a procedure done to you did not ask for,
[25:12]a doctor just felt like, oh, I know what you want
[25:16]without your consent and it's a horrifying moment.
[25:21]And even there's a moment where an anesthesiologist just,
[25:24]just wants to tell you certain things
[25:27]and you kind of shut that down in that moment.
[25:30]It feels like the medical establishment is one,
[25:34]it's that conversation of how women are treated,
[25:38]like particularly women over 40 over 50
[25:40]are treated in the medical establishment.
[25:42]It's one that is so new in that we are talking about.
[25:48]And I felt like you just go in there
[25:52]and saying, hey, I'm not super psyched to like
[25:55]share this with the world but I'm going to
[25:57]because we need to start talking about this.
[26:01]I thought was so important.
[26:05]And you know, there's so much shame surroundings,
[26:07]so many things that we go through medically.
[26:10]And, you know, I chose to be really honest
[26:12]about these certain, I had a procedure
[26:15]and it was in, I don't know what you can say in a temple,
[26:19]my area and it was a medical situation.
[26:25]And so at the end of it, I came out of the surgery
[26:29]and I went back for my checkup.
[26:31]And the guy literally looked at me
[26:35]and I'm going to get struck down in a minute
[26:37]but he said, I tightened you up a little bit.
[26:42]I was so dumbfounded and then she felt shame
[26:48]and I was just, I didn't know what to do
[26:49]and I went home, I didn't tell my husband.
[26:52]I was so, just, I couldn't believe how helpless I was
[26:58]and then how I was supposed to be thankful.
[27:02]You know, as if I wanted to be like a porn star or something
[27:05]and that was important.
[27:06]I was just, I didn't, and then I didn't want to sue him
[27:09]or anything because then, again,
[27:11]we would have been talking about that areas
[27:13]and just, they've been speaking about it since I was 11
[27:16]and people have been obsessed with it for some reason
[27:18]and my virginity and all that.
[27:20]And you just kind of go like, oh God,
[27:22]do I want to do this?
[27:23]But then in writing the book, I thought we have to know
[27:27]this stuff that's not fair.
[27:29]It's just, you know, I had a cone biopsy
[27:31]to get rid of cancer in my early 30s.
[27:35]And I would have loved to have been told
[27:38]that it might make it difficult for me to get pregnant
[27:41]but I was never told that.
[27:42]So we were trying an IVF seven times
[27:46]on all of these things that you go through
[27:48]and you're just feeling more and more like a failure
[27:51]and you know, had a doctor said,
[27:53]listen, you might want to take precautions or do whatever
[27:57]and, you know, maybe you won't have to go through
[28:00]your belly button to get pregnant.
[28:01]Like if the stuff is so crazy, that happens.
[28:05]And if you are a public figure, it's tricky
[28:10]because I couldn't be not honest.
[28:12]I had to be ready for it being, you know, the headlines.
[28:18]But in thinking about the bigger picture of women
[28:20]in this era of their lives, they deserve to feel
[28:24]validated in their advocacy of their selves.
[28:28]And I think that that's, to have a story like this,
[28:31]it's a good jumping off place to start a conversation.
[28:35]Yeah, and I, I mean, I imagine once you started,
[28:39]once you were writing about it and talking about it,
[28:42]I have to imagine that friends said,
[28:44]oh, yes, and X happened to me
[28:47]and people have been coming up to you saying,
[28:50]yeah, because it does feel like you opened a door
[28:55]to have a conversation about things that we all know
[29:00]but don't necessarily articulate.
[29:03]And, you know, sometimes it just takes someone
[29:05]starting the conversation and then you feel like there's
[29:08]a context within which you can be safe.
[29:12]And so that's why this was, that's why I included all of it
[29:17]because, you know, it was a conversation starter,
[29:21]I guess, but it was also really to sort of give women
[29:25]and the fact that we even have to ask for permission
[29:27]for anything like, oh, giving this book gives women
[29:30]permission, I didn't set out to do that,
[29:32]but when you hear someone else's story,
[29:35]it does feel validating.
[29:37]If you've been dealing with something in private
[29:39]or you're ashamed of something or you're worried about it.
[29:43]Yeah, you tell a wonderful anecdote about Gloria Steinem
[29:45]and how she told, she tells you at some point
[29:48]I'm gonna butcher her quote, she says it's much more
[29:51]one articulately, but something about how so many things
[29:55]with women start in a small, in that small room,
[29:58]just sitting around talking and the.
[30:00]way that that if that amplifies another person's voice
[30:03]and another one, and then it becomes,
[30:05]oh, it becomes something that we're all talking about
[30:07]in a movement.
[30:08]And she said that too, and she said, you know,
[30:11]and what people were all saying,
[30:14]we were sort of sitting in this couch discussing women
[30:18]and where we all are in the world,
[30:20]and this was some years back.
[30:22]And someone said, well, how, how can we change it?
[30:24]How can we make a difference?
[30:26]And she said, don't kid yourself.
[30:27]Every single important movement
[30:30]did begin in a basement over a kitchen table
[30:34]on a small, like with small people,
[30:36]and the conversation gets fed, and it goes out.
[30:40]And, you know, that is what a real movement is,
[30:43]you know, and you can't set out to do it,
[30:47]but you start it, you ignite it.
[30:49]Yeah, this actually leads perfectly into one of the questions,
[30:52]which is one of my favorite sayings,
[30:55]I think from Corey Katz, if I'm reading that right.
[30:57]One of my favorite sayings is empowered women
[30:59]and power women, and I get very upset when we aren't
[31:02]kind to each other.
[31:03]How can we do better at lifting each other up
[31:07]and being our own cheerleaders?
[31:10]I think you have to start small.
[31:13]You know, a friend of mine once said,
[31:15]I wish you could see yourself the way I see you.
[31:18]And if, and I thought, well, that's really interesting.
[31:21]There was this one advertisement for Dove soap,
[31:26]and what they did was they got a court artist
[31:29]to, there were people were paired in two women,
[31:32]and the artist was behind a curtain,
[31:35]and each woman came in and he said,
[31:38]describe yourself and then described the person
[31:41]that you're partnered with, and he drew a picture,
[31:44]not seeing them, and when they put all these pictures
[31:47]upside by side, when women described themselves,
[31:52]it made them cry, they looked angry,
[31:54]they looked, you know, one said something like,
[31:57]oh, I've got a witchy nose,
[31:59]and then the other woman who was describing her said,
[32:02]oh, she's got this, like, gladiator look to her
[32:05]and this, like, strong Italian jawline and nose,
[32:08]and she was more beautiful in the way other people,
[32:12]that other partner was describing her.
[32:14]And I think that we have to ask our friends
[32:17]to help us through it, and when you start small,
[32:20]like, if you watch your friend self-deprecating too much,
[32:24]I mean, I use self-deprecation as humor for a long time,
[32:28]but I also realized that I got really good at it,
[32:30]and if you do it too well, you start believing
[32:34]all of those funny, negative things about yourself,
[32:37]and I stop my friends when they do it,
[32:40]and it started them and then they,
[32:42]so you've kind of just, you gotta start small,
[32:44]and I've started this, I don't make resolutions in January,
[32:49]but I try to do one thing that is gonna make a difference
[32:54]just in my heart.
[32:56]And I randomly walk up to people
[32:59]and compliment them on something.
[33:01]I love the color of your hair,
[33:03]or that's a great lipstick color, or whatever it is,
[33:05]and it's like the little light went off,
[33:09]and someone always just say, oh, thank you, you know?
[33:12]And that's it, and you just walk on,
[33:13]and you're kind of anonymous,
[33:15]and I think that it's, that matters,
[33:18]and those little teeny seeds actually do matter, I think.
[33:22]Brooke also goes up to teen girls,
[33:24]and you tell you on the street,
[33:26]and you have this great moment,
[33:29]this anecdote that you tell in the book of when
[33:31]you walked up to a group of girls
[33:33]who were just trashing themselves,
[33:37]and how did they respond?
[33:39]It was a bit forward, I mean I, you know,
[33:41]they didn't ask for my opinion, you know?
[33:44]And, but as a woman and mother of two daughters,
[33:49]I heard them, they were taking selfies and pictures,
[33:52]whatever, and they kept saying, okay,
[33:54]well, don't show my sad, and I don't wanna,
[33:56]I don't wanna look, I don't wanna look chubby in this,
[33:58]and I don't like, and it was just so pervasively,
[34:03]hurtful to themselves, and you know,
[34:06]and I thought, I just was like, oh, I cannot,
[34:08]I can't listen to this, and I just went up to them,
[34:10]I said, can you guys please stop doing that to yourselves?
[34:13]You're so beautiful, you're so lovely,
[34:15]you're all so different, and if you don't stop doing it,
[34:20]you're gonna be so tired by the time you're in your 50s,
[34:24]again, really, I was like, I'm, I just,
[34:27]you didn't ask, I know, but I just wanna spare you
[34:30]from beating yourself up for no reason,
[34:34]just look at how beautiful and look at your lives
[34:37]in front of you, you know?
[34:39]So, and I love that I love what Ali said to you,
[34:43]and I love that sometimes with self-deprecating,
[34:46]because it can sort of take hold,
[34:50]and minimize your voice, and what you ultimately perceive
[34:55]is your right to speak about certain things.
[34:59]And I was thinking about the moment in the book
[35:03]where you write about the brilliant,
[35:05]up-head piece you wrote for the New York Times
[35:08]after, about postpartum depression,
[35:10]after Tom Cruise had gone on the Today Show
[35:13]and talked about it, you shouldn't take antidepressants
[35:15]for it or whatever.
[35:16]And how someone in your life said,
[35:20]told you not to learn,
[35:21]encouraged you not to write it,
[35:22]not to validate it, not to write it.
[35:24]And I know that, and you talk about this in different way,
[35:28]you think about the sliding doors of your life
[35:30]and different things you had done.
[35:31]I was wondering if you think about that moment.
[35:34]What if I hadn't done that?
[35:36]Because to me, that was such an incredibly important piece
[35:41]to write, both for everyone who read it,
[35:43]and also for you.
[35:45]I think about it often because I felt like in that moment,
[35:51]I wasn't doing it selfishly and it wasn't for myself.
[35:55]And I remember thinking, oh, I don't know.
[36:00]Like you don't get to do that to us.
[36:02]You don't have ovaries, first of all.
[36:04]So you don't get to talk about postpartum depression
[36:07]and what it is to go through birth, childbirth.
[36:10]So I got angry and then I just got really
[36:14]calm.
[36:15]And I just, I think about it often because it was,
[36:20]the woman who told me she fired her,
[36:23]she was a publicist, and she said, don't answer.
[36:27]Don't answer, just stay quiet.
[36:30]And I thought, wow, what did disservice?
[36:32]Because this was an opportunity actually
[36:35]to have it be heard differently.
[36:37]And he actually made it better for us
[36:41]because women all over were starting to stand up
[36:44]and say, no, you don't get to decide what we do
[36:49]or what our experience is.
[36:50]So I try to carry that with me.
[36:52]I was scared.
[36:54]I was scared.
[36:55]I would never get a job in Hollywood again.
[36:58]I went through the actress thing.
[37:01]But then you step back and you think, no, no,
[37:02]I cannot be irresponsible.
[37:05]And I need to be able to have a platform
[37:08]for women's voices to be heard.
[37:11]And that idea of I'm scared and I'm still doing it.
[37:17]Yeah, and also one more thing about like the duality
[37:20]of those things, like when you choose
[37:22]to talk about something when you don't,
[37:24]there is something I have two stunning daughters.
[37:28]They're just, they're so different
[37:30]and they're so, let every, we all do.
[37:32]You know, we all have the best children.
[37:35]And we just do, it is, and we love them so much.
[37:38]And they make us crazy.
[37:40]And all of the above.
[37:42]But there's something about this age too,
[37:45]where they are coming into their own.
[37:48]And there, everything is high and tight and perky.
[37:52]And you're just like, oh, God.
[37:55]Why didn't I appreciate it when I had that?
[37:58]And you know, now when I walk down the street with them,
[38:02]you know, they're the ones that are looked up and down.
[38:06]And then the gaze immediately goes to them.
[38:09]And in that, in that second,
[38:11]I have all these mixed emotions.
[38:13]Like, what, what are you looking at my baby?
[38:15]I will, I will hurt you.
[38:17]Don't you dare.
[38:18]And then aren't they beautiful, aren't they so great?
[38:20]You know, and then also you're not looking at me.
[38:23]And you try, it's like, oh, God,
[38:26]what is this not a terrible thing or did I,
[38:29]but you have to kind of own it and say, yeah,
[38:33]it's this part's their turn.
[38:35]But I also bring to the table something so different
[38:39]and something and so what if I don't look,
[38:42]15 anymore, 18 or whatever,
[38:44]that's not the point of this age.
[38:47]And we chase beauty and I'm all for it.
[38:49]I'm all for anything that makes you feel your best.
[38:52]But to look more like yourself,
[38:54]not to look like somebody you were.
[38:57]What are I'm curious what, yeah, seriously.
[39:00]When you have conversations with your daughters,
[39:06]what is, I mean, the way that we grew up
[39:09]is so different from how they're growing up,
[39:12]even as far as messages in the media,
[39:14]not totally different, but a little bit.
[39:16]And how do they approach?
[39:18]I mean, when you write about aging,
[39:19]like what's their perspective that's different from yours?
[39:23]Well, they have a lot more confidence now
[39:26]and they're very sort of righteous about it.
[39:29]And so it's interesting to have conversations with them
[39:33]where they're saying things to, you know,
[39:35]they stare at themselves and they just,
[39:37]everything is like, you know,
[39:40]and I'm like, what are you doing?
[39:42]And then, but there's something kind of great about it
[39:45]because they're celebrating their selves in a way.
[39:49]There's a whole other part of that,
[39:50]which I think is frightening with Instagram
[39:54]and with social media and the comparison.
[39:56]I think that's a whole different conversation.
[39:58]But they are the ones that,
[40:00]and tell me, mom, you know, wear a bikini.
[40:04]Don't hide, don't only want to wear moo-moo's
[40:07]because you feel whatever your curvy or whatever it is.
[40:10]And they're helping me be okay with celebrating myself.
[40:16]And that was kind of a fresh perspective.
[40:20]But they're very clear about what their boundaries are,
[40:25]what they celebrate in how they look
[40:30]and the differences that they have.
[40:32]And they're not trying to be completely homogenized,
[40:35]which I think is a start.
[40:37]And I'm glad that they have that.
[40:40]Yeah.
[40:41]I wanted to ask you about the industry
[40:44]that you've done so much in in Hollywood.
[40:47]And you have, of speaking those statistics,
[40:50]20% of movie characters, this research
[40:52]that Gina Davis is incredible, center is done.
[40:55]20% of movie characters are over 50.
[40:57]And of those, 25% are women.
[41:02]And more often than not, they're presented as senile,
[41:05]homebound, feeble, and frumpy.
[41:10]So as someone in that industry, I mean,
[41:15]what is it like to navigate?
[41:17]I'm lucky insofar as I've sort of hooked into comedy.
[41:23]And in comedy, you get a little bit more
[41:28]of an opportunity to do different things.
[41:31]And so I've sort of found a bit of a niche, so to speak.
[41:35]And it's been powerful for me to be able to go to an Netflix
[41:39]and say, no, this is a story about this woman
[41:43]who's in this phase of her life, and have them
[41:47]respond to it.
[41:48]I do think it's changing positively.
[41:51]I do think that is all very true.
[41:53]But I think there is a movement towards celebrating,
[41:57]or at least writing stories about women over 40.
[42:01]The thing that's happening, which I find fascinating,
[42:04]is now most of them are just them with a younger, younger,
[42:09]younger man.
[42:11]And great.
[42:13]I mean, all the power to them for that,
[42:15]like those are cool stories.
[42:17]But it's so interesting how that had to be,
[42:22]instead of just all the real complexities
[42:24]of what we bring to the table.
[42:26]So my agents and I are always pushing forward
[42:31]for the roles that I get offered to be more multi-dimensional.
[42:39]And you kind of just have to keep fighting.
[42:42]And then when something successful,
[42:44]you bring it back to them and say,
[42:46]did you see the ratings on this?
[42:47]Did you see that we ended up number 20 in all time?
[42:53]And you bring it back to them and you hope that they see it,
[42:56]because you have to give them an economic reason
[43:00]to write those stories and make those movies.
[43:03]And that's just true.
[43:05]Yeah.
[43:07]You quote Ada Calhoun, and she says,
[43:09]the world ignores women over 50.
[43:12]I think at its peril.
[43:14]And I think that's very true.
[43:16]Certainly in Hollywood, in business,
[43:19]I wanted to ask you about comments
[43:20]which you mentioned earlier, because you write in the book
[43:22]that you could not have done this.
[43:25]You could not have launched this company
[43:27]other than at this point in your life.
[43:30]And I'm curious why.
[43:33]I had to grow up a lot.
[43:35]I had to go through many stages in my life.
[43:39]My kids were going to college.
[43:42]And I kind of had to ask myself, what do I want this next chapter
[43:46]to be?
[43:47]And do I just keep wanting to raise my hand and say,
[43:51]pick me and you have that horrible feeling
[43:54]that actresses have all the time?
[43:56]And I wanted to have a legacy.
[43:59]And I wanted to create a place for women
[44:03]for specific problems in their lives that they are facing.
[44:08]And beauty was we started the community
[44:11]and we just kept building.
[44:12]And beauty kept coming up in all these zooms
[44:15]and all these conversations with women all over the world.
[44:19]And they kept saying, well, what do you do for this?
[44:21]What do you do for this?
[44:22]We need problem solving.
[44:24]And hair became such a really fraught place
[44:27]for women in this era.
[44:29]And when we started to do the research,
[44:31]we realized that there were no products out there
[44:34]that catered to the 40 plus woman.
[44:37]And her scalp is different.
[44:38]Her hormones are different.
[44:41]And I thought, you know what?
[44:43]This is what I need to do for this next chapter of my life
[44:47]because I am getting older.
[44:49]So I don't get the same roles.
[44:51]And certain things are, this is a very young industry
[44:56]and sex will always sell and young youth will always sell.
[44:59]And that's great.
[45:01]But I wanted something that was going to last in perpetuity.
[45:05]And we began with hair.
[45:07]We call ourselves a care brand.
[45:10]People were saying, oh, is it a beauty brand?
[45:12]Is it a lifestyle brand?
[45:13]And I said, no, we are a care brand.
[45:17]We look at women.
[45:18]We ask them what they need.
[45:20]And we are coming up with a limited amount of products.
[45:23]And we've grown so much.
[45:26]But I knew that in this era of my life,
[45:28]there had to be something more.
[45:30]And being a CEO, starting a company,
[45:33]knowing nothing about even the language that's used,
[45:37]has been, it feels like I'm back in college.
[45:40]And I just, I feel proud to have jumped off this sort of
[45:44]ledge and to still be, you know, flying sometimes
[45:48]about sometimes I'm down.
[45:49]But I've learned a lot.
[45:51]And I've met some amazing people in the process.
[45:53]And the company just keeps growing.
[45:56]And I can look at this as a legacy.
[46:00]But I can also just look at it as, wow, look at what you did.
[46:03]You know, you're not over.
[46:05]This isn't the beginning of the end.
[46:06]This is the beginning of the beginning.
[46:08]And listen to your peers and listen to this community
[46:12]because they are screaming to be heard.
[46:15]And they are screaming to not just be relegated to dry and
[46:20]frontbeat and all of those things that just are not the only
[46:25]parts of us, you know, we have to deal with certain issues.
[46:29]But we, why not approach them from a place of knowledge and
[46:33]empowerment.
[46:35]And so that's why I just, it happened it grew so quickly.
[46:39]And all of a sudden it just became this, I can't, I put my heart
[46:44]and soul and money and time into because we need it as a women.
[46:51]Yeah.
[46:51]And you also write about what a good time it is to do things
[46:56]that you might have, whatever it is, not felt the confidence
[47:00]to do or not had the focus or weren't in, you know,
[47:04]the front of your mind because you had other commitments.
[47:06]And also you write about saying no.
[47:10]When you're like, you know what, no.
[47:13]And the whole world's telling me that's whatever it is.
[47:16]This is the right role to take.
[47:17]This is the right thing to be doing with my life, with my
[47:20]family, whatever it is.
[47:22]And knowing that actually I'm going to not listen to that.
[47:26]That's, you know, we're not necessarily taught that as females.
[47:30]I mean, I grew up always just say, yes, yes, yes, don't say no.
[47:33]No, don't be difficult, don't, you know.
[47:35]And you just do it at nauseum.
[47:38]And there's been so many times that I've put myself in situations
[47:42]that have been so much better for other people than for me.
[47:45]And there's this obligation that I feel, oh, I have to say yes
[47:48]to that because they need funding and I can get them funding.
[47:51]And, you know, and you just take on these responsibilities.
[47:55]And then you realize you've not put yourself in the light
[47:58]to shine necessarily.
[48:00]And I was recently offered to perform at Lincoln Center
[48:04]and to perform a musical with a huge orchestra.
[48:08]And I thought you can't say no to this because this is Lincoln
[48:12]Center.
[48:13]And it's a, it's Sonheim and it's a 50 piece orchestra.
[48:16]And they've never done, you know, a little night music
[48:18]with that large and orchestra.
[48:20]And you should feel so lucky.
[48:21]And, and I started getting sick with nerves.
[48:26]And I finally just said, you know what?
[48:29]I cannot say yes to this and I know it would help you.
[48:34]But it won't help me because I will be only relieved
[48:37]when it's over.
[48:38]And I would be so nervous and I'd be sick.
[48:41]And I would just be, I thought, do you really have to
[48:44]at this stage in your life keep putting?
[48:46]I mean, I always love to challenge myself and learn.
[48:50]But I wasn't going to be able to go out there and do my best.
[48:55]It wasn't the type of music that sits well in my voice.
[48:58]And footnote, after that Cynthia Rivo played the character.
[49:05]So we know it was not exactly a walk in the park for someone
[49:08]like me to do this.
[49:09]And yet they kept saying, oh, you'll be fine.
[49:12]You'll be fine.
[49:13]And I thought you don't get to tell me when I'm going to be
[49:15]fine or how I'm going to be fine.
[49:20]But to do it with respect, like that was, it was amazing to me.
[49:23]I said, you know what?
[49:24]I just have to say I've got to protect myself right now.
[49:28]And it was so simple that they didn't try to bulk at it.
[49:33]And no, no, no, you have to.
[49:34]You have to have made it with the pressure.
[49:36]Because it was just clear.
[49:38]Yeah.
[49:39]Someone in the audience asked, could you share your experience on
[49:41]ageism of the entertainment industry and how to best navigate as
[49:45]an accomplished female actor?
[49:48]We kind of touched on that.
[49:49]So I'm just going to add to that question, like what was the role that you
[49:54]got offered that you were like, hell, no.
[49:57]Not that many.
[50:00]I wish I could say there was a list of them.
[50:03]No, I mean, I'm more often put in a position
[50:06]and over my whole career of hoping to get something
[50:12]and being rejected.
[50:13]That's, we don't really recognize all the times
[50:17]that people have gotten rejected.
[50:19]We focus on the one or two that then are in our consciousness.
[50:23]And so I, you know, in every single one of those,
[50:26]I used to think, oh, if I just was more talented of it,
[50:29]it was just better if I, and then I became a producer
[50:32]on my own show and had to go through
[50:35]all of the audition process.
[50:38]And what I noticed was by the time they got into the room,
[50:42]they were all pretty talented.
[50:43]Like that's the assumption one maybe had blonde hair,
[50:46]the other one, you know, was shorter,
[50:48]maybe the other one had, you know, curly hair
[50:50]and you end up seeing how it's not personal.
[50:53]And so navigating that part of it was a learning experience.
[50:59]For me, I still take it personally.
[51:01]I still feel afraid of auditioning,
[51:06]but it's getting to the point now
[51:08]where I just, I don't feel as personally confronted by it
[51:12]because I do know I have talent.
[51:14]And I just recently got to work with women I really respect
[51:18]and I haven't had that much of an opportunity to do that.
[51:21]And I was so nervous.
[51:24]I was just, I thought, how can I bring up my game,
[51:28]you know, and these women were so lovely
[51:31]and so gracious and so supportive.
[51:34]And I really soared in it because I started to tough,
[51:41]I tried too hard, went to the bathroom,
[51:44]put some water on my face, came back and said to the director,
[51:48]I'm trying too hard and I would like to know
[51:52]if I can just bring it all down.
[51:54]And the woman said, I was just gonna tell you,
[51:56]you don't have to try so hard.
[51:58]It's all right there.
[51:59]Just be in the scene and do it.
[52:02]And that kind of letting go was just,
[52:06]it was really important for me to feel that.
[52:09]And then trust it and have it not be a disaster, you know?
[52:14]As you said, you produce as well, of course.
[52:17]I think we know you're a really good writer.
[52:19]I mean, bro, when are you gonna start writing things for you?
[52:23]I mean, I know you've got a few things going on
[52:25]in your life, CEO,
[52:27]but do you think about writing scripts for you to do?
[52:31]I do think about finding books that I would like to have a say
[52:36]in the process of the writing,
[52:37]but find really brilliant women writers actually
[52:41]and partner with them.
[52:43]And because I've never written a script,
[52:45]I don't necessarily aspire to, but who knows?
[52:49]Directing probably would be the next place that I would go.
[52:53]But I'm always looking for book series
[52:56]that I can bring to certain networks
[52:58]and can't really say networks anymore, but outlets.
[53:01]And say like I would like to develop this for myself,
[53:05]and that's a privilege to be able to do that.
[53:09]Absolutely.
[53:10]If you are over 50, it's speaking of different jobs
[53:13]and looking for a new job,
[53:15]what is your best advice for that?
[53:19]You know, again, I never really give advice,
[53:21]but what I can say is just don't assume
[53:25]that they know better than you do.
[53:27]You know, I mean, I feel like you have to put yourself
[53:30]out there and keep throwing things at the wall
[53:33]and see what sticks,
[53:34]because the thing that might stick,
[53:36]you might not have ever thought of.
[53:38]And it might be something that's so in your wheelhouse
[53:40]and you didn't even know to ask that of yourself.
[53:43]But what I have found is every time I get,
[53:47]sort of cool, you know, they didn't want me in movies,
[53:50]so I was able to do Broadway.
[53:52]And then Broadway wasn't happening,
[53:53]so I was able to do TV.
[53:54]It wasn't as if I just bounced around.
[53:57]It was, I went to areas that were the water was warm,
[54:01]you know, and I didn't stipulate,
[54:04]oh, well, that's, you know, that TV is this
[54:06]or movies are this and you're only valid if you do that.
[54:09]And I think we do that when we're looking
[54:11]for our next gig, is we try to box ourselves
[54:15]into something that we think we should get or have.
[54:18]And often that just doesn't let us be
[54:21]and you might be surprised.
[54:22]So I think you just have to keep,
[54:24]no, it doesn't necessarily mean no to you.
[54:27]It just means no at that moment.
[54:28]And I think that that's helped me keep pushing forward.
[54:32]You write about that, I think that you're the quote
[54:36]you say is something is brewing,
[54:38]that you feel things changing.
[54:40]And I was wondering what your,
[54:42]what your hope is for the next few years,
[54:46]as people like you, you know, open up and ends.
[54:49]And I don't mean, you know, we were talking about
[54:51]like how annoying it just gives permission for people.
[54:54]I feel like what you're doing is you are putting a megaphone
[54:57]in front of other people's mouths in a lot of ways
[55:01]with this book.
[55:03]What's your hope for the next five years?
[55:06]I mean, you know, again, I don't set out to,
[55:09]to, I don't know, I don't want to be a guru.
[55:12]I'm not trying to be a self-help person.
[55:14]And I'm, you know, I don't, I don't,
[55:15]I don't necessarily, I don't want to do a TED talk.
[55:18]But you know, but what I'm hoping for is,
[55:21]I am so dead set at making this company,
[55:26]what I know it can be.
[55:28]And I'm, I'm so much more confident in my talent
[55:32]that I'm really wanting to manifest what my next
[55:37]real area of creativity is with regards to being an actress.
[55:42]Because that's what I fall asleep thinking of.
[55:46]You know, it's like I wake up thinking about the company.
[55:48]I fall asleep thinking about acting, acting
[55:52]and what it, what it really, how it feeds my soul.
[55:55]And so in a way, those two things are just,
[56:00]there is something brewing in that
[56:02]because all the hard work that's led up to this moment,
[56:05]you can just feel that something is shifting
[56:09]and it couldn't have happened before.
[56:10]You know, I, I wouldn't have been ready.
[56:13]Last question, you're turning 60 this year in a few months.
[56:18]Yeah.
[56:19]What an extraordinary life you've led and continued to lead
[56:24]and will continue to lead.
[56:27]What's your plan?
[56:28]Like, what's your birthday party plan, bro?
[56:30]So, you know, it's a funny that when you,
[56:33]when you're a kid, you hear numbers like 50 or 60
[56:37]and you just think, oh my God, is that old?
[56:40]Then you get so close to it
[56:42]and it just feels younger and younger.
[56:44]It just really does.
[56:45]And, you know, I think I stopped feeling,
[56:49]when it's like 38 is where I sort of stopped
[56:51]in my psyche and I don't want a big party.
[56:56]I don't want, it's too much pressure.
[56:58]There's so many different groups of people in my life
[57:01]that matter to me and they don't all have to be best friends.
[57:06]Like, you know, you used to think in high school.
[57:08]You had to be part of a click and I want to do something
[57:11]special with groups of people
[57:15]and whether it's traveling, whether it's, you know,
[57:17]there are my theater friends, there are my travel friends,
[57:19]there are my like, polar plunge friends, you know,
[57:21]and there are my crafting friends
[57:24]and, you know, there's all these different parts
[57:26]of my life and friendships that I want to celebrate
[57:30]and I don't want the pressure of everybody in a room
[57:33]and cake and I want cake with every single one of them, though.
[57:37]And not just one big cake.
[57:40]And you deserve it all.
[57:41]Take a year.
[57:42]I want to take the whole year of 60 and just celebrate it.
[57:46]APPLAUSE
[57:47]Here, here, we celebrate it with you.
[57:51]The book is Brooke Shields is not allowed to get old thoughts
[57:55]on aging as a woman.
[57:57]It's such a good read.
[57:58]I feel like sometimes we talk about like such heavy stuff
[58:01]and it's also so funny and it just feels like sitting down
[58:05]with your awesome friend who's super smart
[58:08]and knows every great statistic ever.
[58:10]But you know, it's the back of it.
[58:12]People don't realize it's all fact.
[58:15]So when we were thinking about the back cover,
[58:18]I thought it would be really funny
[58:19]to have the Brooke fashion head
[58:21]because that was like big in the 80s.
[58:23]Like there was a doll of me.
[58:24]I mean, try going to high school when that dolls out.
[58:28]Like it does not make for an easy transition to high school.
[58:31]But it was so ridiculous to me that there was a doll
[58:35]above my head and my Barbie body,
[58:38]which my mother, by the way, took Barbie's body
[58:41]and made the toy company shave down the boobs
[58:46]so that it was anatomically correct.
[58:48]I was like, mom, I have a chance at having boobs.
[58:52]Why would you carve them down?
[58:55]She's like, well, you are a teenager
[58:56]and that is not the way you're built.
[58:59]And I was just like, anyway,
[59:01]so it was such a ridiculous thing to be,
[59:04]to have a doll of you.
[59:05]Anyway, so I said to my editor,
[59:07]I said, will you please go to Instagram
[59:11]and look up all the negative crazy comments
[59:14]that I don't read because my kids told me not to read anything.
[59:18]And I said, bring me a whole list of them
[59:21]and she was like, are you sure?
[59:22]And I said, yeah, just bring me a whole list of them.
[59:25]And we picked out the most egregious ones
[59:28]because they are real.
[59:30]Someone said you, she aged like, sour milk.
[59:34]I don't even know what that means, a curdled, I don't know.
[59:37]But I was like, there are so many ridiculous things
[59:39]that get thrown at me by people I've never met.
[59:44]And so when you see the back of the book,
[59:45]it's actually, they are real.
[59:47]I didn't make any of those.
[59:49]And it was important for me to be able to laugh at it.
[59:52]Yeah.
[59:53]Well, it's, yeah.
[59:55]The book is incredible.
[59:57]Front back and middle, all throughout.
[60:00]Brooke Shields, thank you so much for joining me.
[60:03]Thank you to the striker center.
[60:05]Thank you to all of you.
[60:07]Thank you for listening to Totally Booked with Zibi,
[60:10]formerly Momstone have time to read books.
[60:12]If you loved the show, tell a friend, leave a review,
[60:16]follow me on Instagram at Zibi Owens,
[60:18]and spread the word.
[60:20]Thanks so much.
[60:21]Oh, and bye the books.