Books that make you LAUGH! Jess H. Gutierrez, A PRODUCT OF GENETICS (AND DAY DRINKING): A Never-Coming-Of-Age Story

[1:35]Zibby Owens: I'm Zibby Owens, and I am the host of this podcast, Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. I am also a newly minted USA Today bestselling author of the novel blank and created a whole community of book lovers around this podcast, a publishing company, reading retreats, a bookstore, and more. Learn more at zibbymedia.com, or follow me on social at Zibby Owens, or join the community at Zibby Readers.

[2:04]Jess H. Gutierrez: Jess H. Gutierrez is the author of A Product of Genetics and Day Drinking, a Never Coming of Age story. She is a speaker and former journalist whose work has been published in Northwest Arkansas Times, Northwest Arkansas Democrat Gazette, Siloam Springs Herald Leader, and The Free Weekly. She has earned several awards from the Arkansas Press Association, This is her debut memoir essay collection, which is published by Tiny Reparations Books. Welcome, Jess. Thank you so much for coming on Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books to discuss your book, A Product of Genetics and A Never Coming of Age Story. Congratulations. Yay. Thank you. I'm so excited to be here. Oh, I'm so excited to have you. Oh, my gosh. Your book is so funny. I was just, you know, saying this before we got on, but I am 47 and everything in the book is like a walk down memory lane. You there's every reference to things I had totally forgotten about and things I hadn't. And like, anytime you start a book with cheap trick, I'm like, yes, I was in it for Journey and all the stuff. And anyway, congratulations. Tell tell listeners about the book. Oh my gosh. So this is it's a coming of age story. It just kind of has all of it's funny because it's a memoir. It's a memoir essay collection, but I really feel like it's a shared experience. The stories are about me, but it's about growing up. I was born in 1982, so I'm the very beginning of the millennials. And I was raised by my boomer mom who was listening to Teach Trucking Journey. And in fact, my mom growing up, she told me that my real dad was Steve Perry from Journey and I believed it. Like imagine my disappointment, I was just, when I finally found out, was like, mom, but that was the generation that raised us. So this whole book is about riding our bikes to gas stations 12 miles away that we had no business doing that. And things like smoking candy cigarettes and the music that we listened to and fashion and glamour shots and my coming out story, all of that. So it was so much fun to just kind of vomit it all into a book. I loved it. And, you know, the essays were so, like, bite sized. You can read just one, like, at a time and get, like, all the humor and all of it. Like, I really appreciate a short essay. Right? The zing of the experience. One of the ones I mean, there's so many I wanna talk about. But one of the ones that was so funny was when you were talking about Alestra, do you remember, and the Lay's and all of that? Wait, I wanna find this whole thing. Because, you know, I was doing that too. The baked they weren't called Bake Lay's. What were they called? Like, just the I think they were called Wow chips, maybe. Wow chips. Yeah. Whatever. Wait. Oh my gosh. Now I can't find it. And the whole bottle of it was that it gave us all diarrhea. That was the It's so funny. And then that your mom was on Fen Phen, right? Wasn't she on Fen And you were like, then she didn't want to go off and like just all the things. Well, I can't find it. But anyway, all the things that we all do, you know, I've been open about being on Mounjaro. So I'm sort of like in this whole world and I had a mom who was like eating, you know, cottage cheese and fruit every day and doing all the things and anyway, just to have you just shine a light on how crazy the whole thing is. It's so funny. It isn't the fact that we know it's crazy and we still kind of perpetuate it. Right? Like, I watched my mom wear the, like, the trash bag to sweat it out, you know, and I've done just crazy things. I'm like, well, I know better than all of this. And I'm I know. I don't wanna be showing my daughter any of this or my sons, but I'm like, oh, you know? So it's just funny. Yeah. So funny. The coming out part you referenced a second ago, that was also great. And can I read like a little bit of this chapter unbeknownst queer? Is that okay? You were like, this is what you said. Let me clarify something. There was never a time when I wasn't queer. There was, however, a super long stretch in my life during which I had no idea that I was. My friends were gay. Most of the people I admired were gay. My family was pretty sure I was gay. I was super attracted to women and androgyny in general. Even with all that, it never occurred to me that I was queer. Tell me about all of that. And you're so funny with the guys, oh my gosh. Anyway. I dated guy after guy after guy, and I had fun with him. You know, I wanted to go to movies and hang out and do all the things. But when it would get much further than that, I'd be like, oh, something is amiss. And I had problem. And in fact, I was like, well, this is cool. But it just didn't occur to me for the longest time that that was what was going on. I, you know, so I had, oh my gosh, so many ridiculous dates with guys that they didn't understand it any more than I, you know, we were doing all the things except, you know, the things they mostly wanted to be doing. So my coming out story and then when I did, no one in my family was surprised. None of my friends were surprised. So it was a little bit disappointing. I mean, I didn't want hysteria or police to have to show up, but I wanted some reaction and there was nothing. My best friend who's an amazing best friend was like, let's go out, let's celebrate. You know, she just wanted to party, though, is the truth of it. You know Any any excuse is funny. You also have this whole part about the you and your mom so you grew up in 20 you moved 20 times. You lived in a trailer for part of the time. And at one point, your mom befriends a group of women who start babysitting and join a book club with her. And she has these Oprah's book club, you know, dreams. And then your dad says, you know, this is actually like what like, is like, not what's the polite way to say this? You know? Had prostitutes. Yeah. They were next door, and they'd become my mom's best friends. Yeah. So it it you know, that was part of growing up, and they they became the people that we trusted most in our lives, and they were they were really lovely, lovely women. But, you know, it was just another crazy part of the whole picture. Yeah. She's like, get me back. Like, I'm never using the Cuisinart again. You have great, great closing lines on all these chapters. Like, they all, like, end with such a punch. It's it's it's great. Wait. So tell me wait. Go back to talk about you and writing. When did you start writing? When did this book come about? Like, how did we get here? Well, I've been writing, kind of reading and writing forever. We moved so much that I didn't have a lot of friends. And so books were always the thing. I had two younger brothers, but they were two younger brothers and they were best friends. So I was part of their little ring, but, you know, kind of on the outside sometimes too. So I was always writing and I wrote and wrote and wrote, and I was a newspaper reporter for a while. And then I found out that they don't really pay writers any money, really. Newspaper reporter and they started kind of doing layoffs and I didn't want my career as a newspaper reporter to end being laid off. So I went to the community college and I found a degree. I went into respiratory therapy school, which has served me really well and I've loved it. But I remember we had all kinds of issues with infertility, my wife and I did. And we finally had a baby in 2015 and then another one in 2017. And I was holding that baby, my son, who's now my middle son in 2017. And I remember I was, you know, all of the terrible things. I mean, babies are wonderful. They're also monsters. You know, they're terrible. They make especially the first few months, it's everything you wanted, but you also just always want to throw up because you're so tired and your hormones are just out of control. And I remember looking at him one day and saying to him, you can be anything you want to be anything. And I believed it with all my heart. And then I thought, hormones like tidal wave. And they were like, you can too, and you're not doing that. You're not showing your kids to do the thing that you're telling them, be your dream, do your dream. And I wasn't doing it. So that night, during 2AM breastfeedings and probably lots of tears, I started writing and I started writing children's books actually. And I wrote and started trying to find an agent. I found an agent and ended up not having that agent for very long. I went to another agent, Claire Draper, who was going to represent me on a children's book. And we sent it on sub and they were very positive and very excited. Didn't did not sell that first book. And so it was okay. I had more. I always have more up my sleeve. I, you know, the plan was I was determined. So I wrote five or six romance novels, rom coms, and they kept going on sub and just almost making it. They almost sold. They were so close, which is so much worse than flopping. You know, having the news that it might be happening and then it not, it's just, it was enough to make me eat like an entire bag of fun size Snickers every time, you know, totally, totally fine. And then my agent, Claire Draper, finally said, Jess, it it's time that you just stop. And I was like, stop. And they were like, stop writing what you think I want. Stop writing this crap for your mom. It's good. It's fine, but it's not great. And, of course, like, I had another bag of that chocolate because that hurt my heart so bad. But that day, that exact day, I called my mom and I was like, mom, I want to write a story that might not be the most flattering thing. And she was like, if you're talking about kind of your life story, it's the same thing I've been telling you forever and Claire's right. And so I said, are you sure? And she was like, I know I'm gonna look crazy and it's fine. And so I sat down and then just a fury, like on fire. I wrote this book and it just kept coming and coming and coming. And the way it felt when I was writing it, I couldn't stop. Just and so I knew it was the right thing. And we went on sub with this book after all of those being on sub with books. We went on sub with it November 10 and I sworn. I'm sorry. I'm all over the place. But I sworn. I said, I will see a book by the time I'm 40. By the time I'm 40, I will sell a book. Well, fourteen days before my birthday, we hadn't gone on sub with this book yet. And I was like, I will sell a book in my forties. Before 41 that still counts. Well, Eclair sold that book on my fortieth birthday. No way. On my fortieth birthday, it was ten days after we went on stuff. Oh my gosh. I have goosebumps. I almost Yeah, every time I think about it, I'm like, you know, the universe was like, okay Jess, this is the bone we're gonna throw it. And I ended up with the most amazing publishing team and Phoebe Robinson, Amelia Conde is my editor. I just it's been a dream, like a dream. And so yeah, that baby that I talked to at 27 and said anything, anything can happen, you can do anything. I was you know, you say that stuff, but it happened. It's real. So I'm really excited that I wasn't lying to my infant. So Wow. That's so that's like the ultimate, like, reparenting yourself. Or you know what mean? It's like when you say the things and you're like, wait. I'm actually talking to the me of your People are like, I am now my own Miyagi. I am I already have my own Miyagi. Yeah. Oh my gosh. I love that story so much. That's so great. I mean, it sounds obvious. Right? Write what is comfortable. Right? You know? But most of us are like, well, but that won't be good. Or, like, who wants to hear that? Or that's not worth publishing. That's just, like, my thoughts. But it turns out it is worth publishing, and that's what people want is other people's thoughts and to get to know other people and their stories and because they you see yourself in the littlest slivers, even if your life is completely different. Yeah. I think that too. And I was that's what I thought. I thought, who would wanna read a story about me? But then as I looked at it, I was like, it's not really just a story about me. It's us. Yeah. You know, it's a whole generation of messy people. We are all so messy. Yep. And I think that just not pretending to be messy is one of the most freeing things that I've ever let myself do. Just, you know, I'm a disaster. Sometimes I have to walk my kids in late to school in pants they don't want other people to see, and I'm sorry. I'm doing my best over here. You know? I mean, that's just what we look like, and and it's okay. And it you know, we are all together in this even if it's really isolating sometimes. I refuse to open WhatsApp because I can't, like, figure out how to use it properly so that I sort things. And now I have, like, hundreds and hundreds of messages in all sorts of groups. And I'm like, I just can't. So I often have, like, been down there with the kids waiting for the bus and there's no bus. And everyone's like I'm like, hey. Where's the bus? I start texting. It was in the WhatsApp. There's no bus. And I'm like, oh my gosh. So I have to get the kids to school. Well, and it's the same. You know, the the WhatsApp, the 74 emails the school sends every day, which I appreciate the check ins, but oh, that is that's a lot to go through. And you know that the one that you don't read is the one that's like, we're releasing your kids into a field at 12:20PM today if you don't come get them. You know, it's just we're all just trying to keep up, but there's so That's so much. Yesterday, field trip. You have to sign this release, like or your kid can't go on the field trip. My son's like, mom, the release I'm like, I literally just got the thing. Like, it was today. Give me a little time here. Oh, yeah. Last night, my daughter at, you know, 07:30PM was like and she's eight, you know? She was like, it's rest like your career day tomorrow. And I was like, it we it's bedtime in thirty two minutes. Great. You know, that's great news. So then I'm making a costume, which I have no talent for doing, you know, and it's it's just so funny, and I feel like we are all doing this. Yes. I've just given up. I'm like, okay. Pretend you wanna be, like, a teacher and just wear your clothes or something. I mean, I wouldn't even you know? It's like funny hat day. Guess what? You're not wearing a hat. Like, don't have to wear a hat. And they're like, we don't wanna wear a hat on funny hat day anyway. I'm like, great. But you are my people. I need you to those people because sometimes we're just not gonna have a hat. Yeah. I have a toaster struggle in the back of the car. If you can dig that out somehow, you can use that. It's fine. But that we have no hat. I'm sorry. Exactly. Yeah. I love it. Boy cutting. I mean, we all have to just do what we do to get through. I mean, there's too much. I mean, that's why it's that's why your book is so funny. Right? I mean, not it's part of why. I mean, you have you talk about so many different things, but part of it is just, like, the acknowledgment that it's impossible. And but instead of saying, life is impossible, you're like, let me give you 8,000 examples of this. Yeah. Can give you eight eight thousand examples of it. Hard. You could fill probably a million more books of all the stuff. Today's episode is sponsored by Quince. Summer always makes me rethink what I'm reaching for every day. 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[20:03]Jess H. Gutierrez: Speaking of which, so are you going to be writing more books? What's the plan now? I'm actually under contract with the same publisher, Tiny Rep, for my second book. I actually just turned in edits and I'm you know, for my editor to see them. It's Adulthood for Stories of a Geriatric Millennial, which is also offensive. No. No. No. So you said that you're Gen X. Right? You're Gen X. I mean, I guess. I guess. We're so close, though. I feel like some of us are just kind of in the middle of just being all the Gen X. The older Gen Xs are the ones that beat us up on the playground. You know? So I know. I was not beating anybody up on the playground. It's so funny, though, because there's just this weird in the middle. And I feel like that's a lot about what this book is, is that some of us don't really fit into either, but have so many memories from both. And so that's kind of I think, that's kind of fun. My husband is born in 1982, and I'm in 1976. And we have, like, different cultural references. I'm like, it was not that many years apart. But, like, how Yeah. Not seeing all these movies? And, like, you know, it's it's crazy. Yeah. The differences in our culture. Oh my gosh. So let me just, like, pick at random one of the funniest things. Oh, you're funny. You're so funny. The the so cute. The fourteen year dry stretch fictional film in the nineties. Disclaimer, if I were a normal girl writing a normal book, there wouldn't be a whole chapter entirely focused on fictional film characters of the late nineteen nineties. But as you've come to learn, there's no direction in which this story is afraid to wander. Oh my god. You're so funny. The whole thing with Rose and Jack. I mean, Taco Bell. You're you're just so funny. When you were thinking of essays for this, did so they all just, like, came out and what like, how did you organize them? And did you know it was essays versus a memoir? Because sometimes they're like, oh, essays don't sell as well as memoir. And, you know, there's all that stuff, which I disagree with, but whatever. I was lucky enough. And this does not sound lucky at all. This sounds kind of dumb actually. I didn't do any research. I didn't know that any of this was a hard sell. I didn't know. I think I would have been really intimidated if I had done any of the work. I like to say I'm lazy, but I don't think I'm lazy. I'm just a busy mom and they're my focus and that's what I do. So when I wrote these, I didn't know that it would not be easy. So when I sent it to Claire, Claire was like, this is wonderful, blah, blah, And Claire didn't tell me because Claire knows I'm a little crazy. So my agent was like, well, just not let Jess know any of the things that she didn't research. So when I was writing them, I was just writing stories. And when I wrote a story about Titanic, made me think of something else and something else. And I was like, oh, this bar, this thing that happened with this girl and they just kept happening. My editor was awesome in saying, okay, this is a lot of thoughts and we're going to have to organize them. My editor is also amazing. Emmy, Emmy Akana is also really good at I'm a big, alright, right, right, right, right. And then I just want to be done. Like, okay, I'm finished with Jack and Rose. And I don't want to talk about the Titanic anymore just for this moment. I definitely want to talk about it. And I'm like, this is so good, but it doesn't have an ending. I'm like, does everyone have to have an ending? Apparently, that's really important. So that was something I really had to learn is to finish, I guess, the essays. Having kids, I feel like this goes so much in theme with what you're doing here. Having kids, there is no scheduled time to write. When you're the primary caregiver, it does not matter what you're doing. You are still doing the laundry and the kids will bypass their other mom if they need a band aid. That's just how that's My spouse is a firefighter. She works a lot and I stay home mostly. And so the kids, they come to me for most of those things. So it's really funny because writing is the same way. There are no office hours. So this book, product of genetics and day drinking, I wrote 100% entirely other than the edits in the notes app on my phone. No way. Yeah. I will write an essay and I just did it with my second book too. Write the 2,500 words. I think you can get to 3,000 words in a note and then it cuts you off, but you don't really know it cuts you off. And then you look and it's like, oh, it's gone. Stuff is missing. But I will write the 2,500 words and then email them to myself and then put in my word document and then write another essay. Even that's what I do at 2AM, 3AM. That's when I'm doing my writing. Have that 20 old at home and, you know, and that's one thing that I think that parents I would have never said, Oh, I'm incredible. I'm amazing. But you see moms and dads and parents and people that take care of kids just do ridiculous things to make things better and to show their kid. So I'm writing 2,500 word essays and notes apps at night to get this done. I did. And so it feels really big to me. It feels like a big deal. It should feel like a big deal. That's huge. I mean, first of all, I can't even, get the hang of my notes app. You know, it's really simple. Like, my daughter just tried to share a note with me with, her birthday wish list or something. I'm like, you can share notes. Did you know that? You can, like, have a collab on a note. I was like, this is so cool. So now all of a sudden, I'm in her notes. I didn't know that, and I used them all the time. Yeah. You can just collab now with your editor and just send her all the notes. That's amazing. I know. But I'm learning all these things, too. But you basically had to type it all, just like do do do on your phone. The manual dexterity involved in doing that is also impressive because I'm so much faster with all my fingers on a keyboard than just like do do do do. My mom will watch me and she'll be like, that's ridiculous. I'm like, you know? You do what you have to do. You just do it. Just like she did what she had. I mean, we all just started making it, you know? Wow. Imagine what you could do if you had time. I tell my wife that. I'm like, oh my gosh, what could be in here? She's like Yeah. Mean, you're going to have so many. You're going to just have essays like coming out of your ears. Have about 20 on my phone right now that are like midway. And I'm at the point where I either need to spin it because it becomes a lot. So How how do you know what to save for your books versus, like, your sub stack? My favorites well, it really just depends. The books are kind of thematic. So if it's going with a theme, then I know that that one should be saved. Then others that just need to happen right now or something ranty, like a Walmart encounter, you know, that's when you should be just vomited out and sent it to my, you know. So Wow. Do you ever talk I mean, this this is sounding like a random question. Like, I feel like you could have a not just a writing thing, but, like, you have so much material and your brain is just, like, always processing it and so funny, you could do more than just the writing if you wanted. You know I mean? Like, you could do a podcast. You could do, like, a show. Like, I feel like you know what I mean? Like, your your thoughts on stuff, if if it's really just, like, pouring out, there are other avenues too. I would love that. I have always been so interested in comedy just because it's kind of my background or not my background, but I guess it's sort of my coping mechanism. But it's a really fun coping mechanism if you need one. So yeah, I absolutely think that. My editor was really good about not letting me go dark because I grew up in my family. I have a funny family. I'm certainly not the funniest person in my family. My mom is weird, funny, and I have a brother who's really funny. But we all have the tendency to go a little dark on humor, and that isn't always the most well received. So you have to be really careful with that to not do that. So my editor, a couple of times, was like, Hey, not this one. This is a little good. I'm so glad I'm being censored a little bit. So that's always appreciated. Do you ever think about publishing all those romance novels, like under a different name or something? I do think about them. And I do think now that I've kind of unleashed the side where I feel more comfortable just saying everything because I'm just really holding back in those books. I think that if I hadn't, I think if I went back through and I was telling my agent, I'm like, I'm going to dirty them up a little bit. And they're like, oh, and I'm like, not in that way. I'm just going to make them sound a little bit more like me because I think that it works. I write the way that I talk. I think that people maybe like that. Like I want you to read my book and think that you're gossiping with your best friend. I want to be, I feel like the whole book is gossip about me about, didn't, you know, I want it to just be like you're talking smack with someone that you enjoy being with and giggling with and all of those things. And so I think if I went back through those books, would know what I had missed and be able to make them funny. You should totally do that. Oh my gosh. And you do you still live in Arkansas? Did I get that right? I do. We live in Northwest Arkansas. Yeah. That's so close. So not even Little Rock, another book? No. No. We live in Northwest Arkansas. Have you found other authors? Like, is there a writing community for you there? There are other writers here. I'm not very well connected to them. I have met through my 2024, we have a debut group for another author, Travis Simpson. He is debuting this year with a book Strong Like You. He and I have become really good friends because it's such an interesting experience to be publishing a book for the first time. So he's another writer in the Ozarks. Yeah, I've just, it's been writing this book that's making me kind of reach out. I'm an introvert. I'm an extroverted introvert, which I know is people say that, but I really just want to be basically hiding under my bed from other people. And so it's been really interesting putting myself in different situations. But yeah, I do not have a writer's group. Don't have beta readers. I've never done any of that. I've never done any of this. So this has all been so new and so much fun. Oh my gosh. It's been wild. It's been a it's been a literal dream come true. It really has. Well, if you venture out to LA, you have to come to an event at my store. I have a bookstore in LA called Divi's Bookshop. So if you are doing any tour and I was looking at your website, but anyway, if you go west. I did a normal amount of safe legal stalking of you before. And I'm such a huge admirer. You just being so real about what it's like to be a parent. We need that. We are all living the same thing, and it's it's so nice to have that solidarity. So Thank you. Sometimes I'm like, I don't know. Life would be a lot easier if I didn't do all this book stuff, I just started talking about my life as a mom again. Yeah. Do you know how much time I would save if that's really what people like that I do? No. I like all of it. And the book stuff is so It's much so much fun. I I have decided that I do wanna be you when I grow up, if I grow up. Close in age, so I feel like it might not happen, but I goals. Oh my gosh. So funny. Well, thank you. I'm very flattered. I don't have my stuff together either. There are always things. I mean, you know, we're all just doing our best every day and, you know, my kids are, like, addicted to their iPads and that's, like, really the secret sauce. So, you know, we'll see how they turn out. It's so funny. I had a mom the other day be like, what do your kids do to earn their iPad? And I was like, oh, my kids wake up. Get in my face. You know, do you want that? Math? Calculus? No. They're just on I'm not you know? I know. I was at someone's house yesterday and they were like, oh, I got this. It was like the kid was like, I got this with part of my allowance that I'd saved. And I was like, allowance? I know I'm supposed to be doing that. That require, like, a whole system of, like, what's the allowance for and what's I'm like, I don't have time for that. Like, what do you you know? Anyway No. Absolutely. Like, I know. But there are also things and I do that. I'm like, I'm this and this we eat crap, all of these things. And I'm like, but you know what? I blow holidays out of the freaking water. Like, I can stand up like nobody else. You know what I mean? I'm like, so I have Yeah. They have fun. They're having I think our kids are having a lot of fun. They're in here. They feel loved, and they're having a blast. And even if they don't wear a hat on hat day and they don't have any moments and whatever, they are gonna have a blast and be really great people. It matters. Hopefully, they'll all be friends. That would be fun. Hopefully, they'll write memoirs about us when they're Exactly. Yes. We will commiserate when they're when their memoirs come out. Oh my gosh. Too funny. Well, oh my gosh, Jess, congratulations. This was so fun. And I hope I get to meet you in person. I've never been to Arkansas. That's really cool. I wanna even hear more about that. But anyway, congratulations. I hope you never come of age. Me too. Thank you so much. All right. Take care. Bye.

[33:31]Zibby Owens: Thanks for listening to Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. If you love it, please leave a review and follow us on social at Zippy Owens and at Zippy Readers.