Neely Tubati Alexander, IN A NOT SO PERFECT WORLD
[0:02]Hi, I'm Zippy Owens and I am the host of this podcast, Mom's Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[0:08]I am also a newly minted USA Today best-selling author of the novel, Blake.
[0:14]I've created a whole community of book lovers around this podcast, a publishing company,
[0:19]reading retreats, a bookstore, and more. Learn more at ZippyMedia.com or follow me on social
[0:25]at Zippy Owens or join the community at ZippyReaders.
[0:30]Neely Tube Body Alexander is the author of In A Not So Perfect World, a novel.
[0:36]Neely is originally from the Seattle area and resides in Arizona with her husband and children.
[0:41]By the way, if you've been following the Zippyverse tour on my Instagram at Zippy Owens,
[0:45]you can see pictures of Neely and me together when I did an event with my mom and the society
[0:50]of the Southwest for Blake. Her debut novel, Love Buzz, won the Zippy Award for Best Be Treat.
[0:56]Love that that's in her bio and was hailed by Good Morning America, which I wrote as the perfect
[1:01]escapeist read absolutely delightful. And book list, which I had nothing to do with, declared her
[1:06]an exciting new romance writer. Welcome, Neely. Thank you so much for coming on Mom's Don't Have
[1:11]Time to Read Books to discuss in A Not So Perfect World. Thank you. I'm excited to chat.
[1:15]I wish we were on a beach in Turks and Caicas today and not, you know, at our desks doing work
[1:22]and talking about books and all of that, I wish we were just pretty large.
[1:28]Okay, tell listeners what your book is about, please. Sure. So In A Not So Perfect World is about
[1:34]Sloan, who is a video game designer, Doomsday Planner, who is working towards landing her dream
[1:41]job at the top of the video game design company. And she is approached by her neighbor Charlie to
[1:47]go on an all-inclusive trip to all paid for trips to Turks and Caicas to resort. And the catch is that
[1:55]he is using her to make his ex jealous. And so she decides to go to use the time away to work on
[2:01]building the game design that will help her land her dream job all while trying to avoid catching
[2:06]feelings for her hot neighbor. Hot, interesting choice of words since they, one of their first
[2:13]interactions is fire, you know, smoldering, you know, aftermath of an apartment fire from their
[2:21]elderly neighbor. So yes, and a very funny, meat cute situation, not really cute meat thrust upon.
[2:29]I don't know thrust upon cute. I don't attack, not attack. Anyway, where did this idea come from?
[2:36]Oh, gosh, well, I guess when I went to Turks and Caicas, I think what ended up being our last vacation
[2:41]prior to COVID, we used to take an international trip every year. And that was our last before COVID.
[2:47]And ironically, I haven't really done it since just because of, you know, everything has gotten
[2:51]so busy and life has changed. But I didn't know at the time that I was doing book research, but
[2:56]it was really cool to go back and look at the photos and kind of relive the trip a little bit
[3:00]and look at some of the places and include them in the book, which is always fun. And my debut
[3:06]love buzz was a book that sort of towed the line between women's fiction and romance. And I really
[3:11]wanted to dive into the romance part this time and kind of went the opposite direction of
[3:17]where in love buzz that they didn't spend a ton of time together on the page, the two main
[3:21]characters. This one I thrust them into a trapped together in paradise situation. So it was really
[3:27]more just wanting to dive fully into the romantic comedy space on this one.
[3:32]I've learned more lately about the different tropes like for the romcoms and like, you know,
[3:37]enemies to lovers this and you know, how do you feel about tropes? And you know, are there really
[3:43]just these categories? I don't know. I feel like all books are so different, but can they be reduced
[3:48]to the main tropes of romcoms? Yeah, I love the tropes. And I think that's a lot of why people
[3:53]come to the romance space because there's a comfort in kind of seeing these same tropes
[3:58]over and over again. You know what you're going to get at the end of a book for the most part.
[4:01]You know, you're going to get a happily ever after or happily for now. I tend to stay in more of
[4:05]the happily for now type of camp because I'm too much of a pessimist to go all the way to the
[4:11]happily ever after. But you know, I think that's why people like this romance space because there
[4:16]are new ways of being able to talk about and incorporate these sort of old tropes. When you think
[4:22]about movies and romance movies in particular and romcoms that you watch, they all sort of follow
[4:27]the same, you know, situations, how many movies you watch where there's one bed or that's fake dating
[4:34]or, you know, force proximity. And we still love it, right? We love kind of reliving and having these
[4:40]situations happen over and over again. There's a sense of comfort in it, which I think is part of
[4:44]why people come to the romance genre to begin with. Do you go to the romance genre for that?
[4:48]I do. Yeah. I think as the world, you know, just continues to feel heavy. It's harder for me to read
[4:55]really heavy books. You know, there's always a time and space and mental space that you're in where,
[5:01]you know, you go to certain books for certain things. But I think more and more for me at least,
[5:06]I'm seeing this from readers too, that we really kind of are gravitating towards books that
[5:11]feel really escapist and in feel light and fun and kind of take its out of the heaviness of
[5:17]the real world right now. So I like the idea of being able to provide that for people even for a
[5:23]little bit. And tell me more about how you got your start with love buzz and writing in general and
[5:30]your background and all of that. Yeah. So I had kind of always started and stopped over the years
[5:36]over the course of like 20 years. I always had the stream of writing a book and it's never,
[5:41]you know, finished it. I have that folder that a lot of authors have on my computer of, you know,
[5:46]10,000 words here in 20,000 words here of just things that I started to never finish. And then
[5:51]COVID hit. And my story, I think is similar to a lot of other authors that I've heard on your podcast
[5:55]and others talking about, you know, that really was a time of self-reflection and I had an online
[6:03]kindergarten or at home. I had a toddler at home. My husband and I were both working from home.
[6:08]I have, I'm an entrepreneur in real life. And I, you know, was working with a lot of startups.
[6:13]And so they were really going through it. And so I lost kind of half of my business overnight.
[6:17]And so I really, at the end of the day, I would go walk myself in our guest room and pretend I
[6:23]was at a hotel or anywhere else. And I really viewed it as my self care time of being able to go in
[6:27]there is the thing that I started to look forward to at the end of the day and write. And it was
[6:32]the first time that I had written something from start to finish. And I think there's something
[6:38]that sort of unlocks in your brain once you've done it once. You feel like you can do it again.
[6:42]And that was sort of the opening of the floodgates of being able to kind of continue to move forward.
[6:47]And do you work with the same editor as last time? Like, are you in a rhythm now?
[6:51]No. So I, my editor for love buzz, ended up leaving Harper-Rue Collins when, right before the
[6:57]book came out. So then I started working with a new editor on boat too. So it's been a great
[7:02]experience because I've gotten to see two different styles of work and how editors can work and
[7:07]how they interact. But with largely the same team because I'm still at the same imprint. So that's
[7:11]been a nice, you know, there was still that level of security and similarity of what we went through
[7:16]with the first book to the second book, but got to work with someone new from an editorial perspective.
[7:21]Very cool. And how was that process? I was, I don't know, I was like looking at one sentence and I
[7:27]was like, I wonder how she got to that sentence. Like, why did they, she believed this part? And like,
[7:33]you use interesting words too when you're like, what did you say? I don't know. Anyway, just like how
[7:38]you pick word choice and how much the editor has to do with that. And all of that just go from
[7:44]there. Now I'm trying to find this word that I was like, what? Yeah, now I'm curious for me, like,
[7:49]if it's always an evolution. So first draft is very much, I consider it unconscious stream. I
[7:56]have to be really disciplined about not moving away from the screen to go look up a word or,
[8:01]you know, do research on anything and just kind of saving it and bracketing it for later. I'm a
[8:05]real, that's the part that I'm the most sort of disciplined about, which is to not distract
[8:11]myself from just kind of unconscious stream in that regard. And then as we got further along,
[8:16]my editor was really great. She does a lot from a copy edit perspective as well. And usually
[8:22]those are things like cutting out any words that we don't need and getting it really crisp and
[8:25]clean. But the word choice and things like that tends to be, you know, my own editors are really,
[8:31]really good at not interfering with the voice and, you know, word choice and things like that.
[8:37]They are looking at continuity and they're looking at, you know, making things make sense and
[8:41]pointing out potential bad habits that you have. I think I use goosebumps like 75 times in the book.
[8:47]And so that was one of the things that she pointed out and said, maybe we don't use it again here.
[8:52]So, you know, things like that, I think are really valuable. But I really believe good editors
[8:57]know, they go just up to the line, you know, and then, and we'll kind of help you with everything
[9:03]up to that point. But don't cross that line of interfering with, you know, the voice and tone and
[9:08]integrity of the authorship of the words, if that makes sense. Yeah, of course, of it.
[9:13]Well, here, I couldn't find the word I was talking about, but as I was flipping through,
[9:17]let me go through a few because it's, I'm putting this out because it's trying to write
[9:22]novels myself. You always think like, how can I say said another time? She said, he said, blah,
[9:26]blah, blah, blah. Okay, so here are a few that you have. Mumbles, she mumbles, she whispers,
[9:33]she squawks. That's a good one. I'm saying this out of appreciation, by the way.
[9:38]This is great. Well, that's funny. You say it because Emily, my editor had called me out a couple
[9:44]times during edits and said, breeds is not a dialogue tag. Like I kept saying, she breathed.
[9:52]Everybody can eat it. That is not a dialogue tag. So I would, I was called out a few times for using
[9:57]ones that were not, were not appropriate. That's really.
[10:00]Well, anyway, what are your thoughts in general and like even the notion that there could be some sort of perfect world?
[10:06]Like isn't it a nuts and perfect world for like everyone at every time particularly now?
[10:10]Like what is the what are some of the main messages of the book?
[10:14]Yeah, well, she's an apocalyptic video game designer and James Day planner and natural pessimists the book is dedicated to the pessimists
[10:21]I'm one of those people and I think it was more about you know
[10:25]He's kind of this or internal optimist and so I guess it does have when we talk about tropes like kind of that grumpy sunshine
[10:31]Aspect as well, but he's the sunshine and I think it was more about how we you know
[10:37]Everyone is existing and sort of this imperfect imperfect world
[10:40]She's sort of waiting for doom and gloom to happen because she spends her life preparing for it and finding someone who can counter that for you
[10:47]And they don't make it perfect
[10:49]But they come in and kind of change your view of the world
[10:53]And it sort of goes back to that saying of you see what you're looking for right?
[10:56]Regardless of where you are and so helping her just sort of see those things differently
[11:00]I think was really fun to to explore. Awesome. Do you play video games?
[11:04]I don't know I mean I have some mobile games that I play
[11:07]But I was really cool to do research especially when I found out I think I even put this sentence in the book
[11:13]But video games are that industry is bigger than music and film and TV combined
[11:19]It is a huge huge industry
[11:22]And we don't see a lot of representation in you know the film world and TV in in books
[11:26]So it's cool to see that starting to emerge a little bit. Are there awards for video games?
[11:31]Yeah, what do they call it? Like what's the Oscars of video game?
[11:34]You know, they're yes, I even I think I have it listed in the book and now it's escaping you do
[11:40]There's full you know design and you know graphics and characters
[11:44]Just like you would have for for novels or for film and TV
[11:47]I don't know why that should surprise me. Where did your knowledge about teeth come in
[11:51]I know this is like the opening page
[11:52]But where did that come from? Have you lost a teeth did a friend lose a teeth a teeth?
[11:57]No, that was part of the reason character research
[12:01]You know Sloan is someone who again is like a doomsday planner
[12:05]And so she has a lot of tips she talks about so that was a very interesting kind of google search history too of
[12:13]Figuring out like all these for chapstick and you know and all of
[12:17]Do with sort of every day things in your home
[12:20]But no, that was part of the research first loan because she's she's a very prepared person
[12:24]So I very much learned a lot about
[12:27]What you can do to survive in certain situations
[12:31]I like to think that there are some redeeming qualities like survival skill so it could come out of video games
[12:36]It's my own first place
[12:38]We tell me more about your real job quote unquote as you call it in the entrepreneurial space
[12:43]What is that?
[12:44]So I work as an HR consultant
[12:46]So I work with a lot of startups and small businesses and provide them human resources support in a consulting capacity
[12:52]Because a lot of small businesses don't need a full-time HR person internally
[12:56]But they do need directive and support when they have challenges and to helping to build out their internal operations
[13:02]So yeah, it's really fun to work with kind of other entrepreneurs and just feed off of their energy and excitement
[13:08]And I find that really fun have any of the companies you've worked with like taken off shark tank style
[13:14]Oh gosh, let me think about that
[13:16]There have been a few that I've really watched usually when they come to me
[13:19]They are in a high growth mode, right?
[13:21]Because everything is changing and they need a grasp on what is happening internally to be able to help support that growth
[13:26]So most of them are typically in a high growth phase which is fun to be part of
[13:31]And how long did it take for you to write this whole thing?
[13:34]So I started writing this book when I was querying love buzz
[13:39]And so really I used it as a distraction from the ups and downs of querying
[13:44]And any author who's queried knows that is a roller coaster of emotion
[13:47]You can get a flow request in three
[13:51]Rejections in the same day from hour to hour, right?
[13:54]So I used it very much as a distraction
[13:57]I wrote much of the first draft while I was querying and then
[14:00]I kind of worked on it through that process
[14:04]And I had a rough draft that I was able to submit when we went on submission
[14:08]And I was sort of in good enough shape to be able to share as part of a two-book deal
[14:13]Which was exciting wow was this always the title no no they changed both my titles
[14:19]What were they vote love buzz was initially one night on Bourbon Street
[14:24]And then in a not so perfect world was originally if the world was ending
[14:29]Which they felt was too dark for a romcom. So I'd be gradually agreed
[14:35]That's really funny. Yeah, that would have matched the
[14:38]The song title component with love buzz. So and what is coming next? What are you working on now?
[14:44]Yeah, so my third book is with my editor now or for a look
[14:49]So that's exciting. She is reviewing it now
[14:52]And then we may go on submission. I don't know
[14:54]We'll see what happens with it and so then while that's out in the world
[14:58]I am drafting book four trying to keep up with a book a year
[15:02]We'll see how long I can kind of maintain that do you put it in your calendar
[15:06]Like the days that you go into the guest room and like hide yourself away and pretend you're not in your life
[15:12]How do you know when to do that? I don't do that so much anymore. I tend to
[15:17]And I shouldn't even say this but I tend to write when my kids are at school and kind of really take them morning
[15:22]I think it it's very important to know kind of how you best operate and where you your
[15:27]Creativity kind of works
[15:29]The most for me. It's in the morning when my kids are gone. I need uninterrupted time for writing
[15:34]I can do HR work and kind of you know other work with some distress level some level of distractions
[15:41]So I tend to take the time that my kids are at school
[15:44]And I would say that one of the life-changing things for me was once my kids were all were both both in the same school
[15:50]On the same schedule and not you know multiple pickups and drop offs and things like that
[15:54]So, you know, there's always a season that's hard and then it starts to get easier as these things start to align
[16:00]So I've definitely taken advantage of that. I feel like it's hard to switch gears from like
[16:05]Kid drop off to like crazy creativity
[16:09]I feel like that is hard. I'm like imagining authors all over the place
[16:13]Dropping off. I don't know. I don't know. I feel like I need to write on the weekends or like where there's no big
[16:20]Time to commit and I don't know. My fiction muscle is not as well developed as yours
[16:26]Well, I will say I tend to
[16:28]Be getting right into the groove of things right when I have to stop to go pick them up
[16:32]So it always seems to have that way where I'm having to stop at a point that I really don't want to and I'm kind of in it
[16:37]So that's always a little bit challenging, but that's good because it must be easier to pick back up. You would think
[16:42]We're some authors that you love to read. Oh gosh. Well in this space in particular
[16:50]I mean Emily Henry is obviously what is the queen? I think she's every book
[16:55]She writes is fantastic and I really love how great she is at snappy dialogue
[16:59]That's one of the things that I really enjoy when reading in this space
[17:02]Kennedy Ryan is amazing Tia Williams is amazing
[17:06]So, you know, I tend to enjoy some of the
[17:09]The main folks that other people enjoy as well
[17:12]I think that there's a lot of up and coming great talent in this space too
[17:16]Ali Palmer's debut. I think it hasn't come out yet
[17:19]But I think it's coming out in August is really great
[17:22]Nana Kumar's book say you'll be mine that just recently came out is really great
[17:25]So there's a lot of there are a lot of newer
[17:28]romance authors that are really breaking into the scene that are
[17:31]Are exciting to watch and I'm excited to see what they come out with next as well
[17:34]How do you feel that tiktok?
[17:37]Well, I am I've never posted anything I'm a pure lurker
[17:42]So I'm on there a lot but I've never actually contributing in any way other than lurking
[17:47]You know, I think that it can't be ignored
[17:50]When we look at the New York Times bestseller list and the books that are selling it tiktok is clearly dominating
[17:55]From an influence perspective of what people are buying so it can't be ignored
[17:59]I think authors feel pressured to participate in some way
[18:04]My view is if it's not natural to me that's going to come across
[18:08]I'm not someone who's like particularly good at or comfortable on camera
[18:12]Especially when I'm recording myself
[18:14]So I think that the organic component of it which is other people being really excited about your books
[18:20]And those types of situations are more
[18:24]Real and honest than an author trying to put things out and you know go viral or whatever it is on tiktok
[18:29]So I tend to think that there's more opportunity when you write a good book and get it into the right
[18:36]Hands and allowing those people to sort of do those things for you because they're better at it and more authentic when they do
[18:42]Well, how do you feel about it?
[18:43]I tried to use it it takes me so long to do something really short
[18:49]Which I can do in a real really quickly
[18:52]I don't know. I feel like I have spent the time getting to Instagram
[18:55]But I am aware that I'm like missing the biggest still book platform around
[18:59]Yeah, so how can I justify that but I don't know I haven't been able to master it and I can't even like figure out how to
[19:08]Find the right people. I don't know. I don't find it into it. So I have a hard time with it
[19:12]Yeah, it's tough and I don't know that you know publishers don't necessarily know how to
[19:18]Rain it in either so it's just sort of this thing that's out there that is hard to navigate
[19:24]I need to like throw a pebble in
[19:27]Just like from afar, you know, like I need to like not be in the fountain, but anyway never mind
[19:33]What advice do you have for aspiring authors?
[19:36]I've heard people say on this podcast before find your community
[19:39]And so I hate to say the same thing
[19:40]But I think that also what I've seen a lot on threads or on Instagram is that people say you know
[19:45]I hear I hear out there say find your community
[19:47]But where are these people? How do I actually find them and do it?
[19:50]And so I think the more valuable resource is where do you find these people?
[19:54]And the reality is it does take putting yourself out there a little bit
[19:57]There are lots of groups online that you just have to do some
[20:00]Research on mom's who write is a great Facebook group
[20:02]that I found my very first writing group through
[20:05]there are podcasts that will do match ups with authors
[20:08]and similar genres anytime I see someone post
[20:11]in like this mom's who write group, for example,
[20:13]saying, hey, I'm in this area of the world.
[20:15]I write this as anyone interested or in meeting app
[20:18]or doing critique partners that will be dozens of responses.
[20:21]So there are a lot of ways to find those folks,
[20:24]but you have to kind of put yourself out there
[20:26]a little bit to find them, but it is invaluable.
[20:28]And I think I would go so far as to say necessary
[20:30]to be able to navigate this space because it is hard
[20:34]and it is isolating and you need other people
[20:36]to be able to support you and help you navigate it.
[20:40]What three things would make your life more perfect?
[20:45]Oh gosh, well, the next book to y'all,
[20:47]let's put that out there.
[20:49]Okay, okay, universe, go ahead.
[20:51]It's gonna universe that.
[20:52]I would say more time, but that's not really true, right?
[20:55]We're always gonna be navigating the time
[20:57]that we have and kind of maximizing it there
[20:59]for always feeling like there's not enough.
[21:01]So I think more than anything,
[21:03]I would want to have the ability to give myself grace more
[21:09]and to just be comfortable with some days.
[21:11]I'm gonna be really good at this,
[21:12]some days I'm gonna be really good at this
[21:14]and they're probably not gonna be the same day
[21:15]and just being kind of comfortable
[21:17]at that I think would be the biggest thing that I could do.
[21:19]Last question, if you could go to a beach anywhere
[21:22]in the world today, where would you go?
[21:25]Oh gosh, well, I'd like to be back in Turks and Caicos
[21:27]on that beach again.
[21:28]Yeah, absolutely.
[21:30]That's an easy one.
[21:31]I'm just like looking at this.
[21:33]It's like with a rum punch in hand.
[21:37]Yes, I mean, and by this, I mean,
[21:39]the cover for people listening.
[21:41]You can tell the NVM feeling in the need
[21:43]for some relaxation and rum bunches.
[21:46]Sounds good, but that's why it's so great.
[21:48]All you have to do is open up a book
[21:49]and you're right there for those of us
[21:50]who can't hop on and take time off.
[21:53]There you go.
[21:54]In an also perfect world,
[21:55]which can make your existing world a little bit more perfect.
[21:58]There you go.
[21:59]Your ad campaign.
[22:00]Thank you, Nili, so much for coming on.
[22:03]And thank you, by the way, also, for coming to the event
[22:06]in Scottsdale, Arizona for the literary society
[22:09]of the Southwest that my mom put on.
[22:11]So I loved meeting you in person.
[22:13]Yes, it was so fun to meet in person
[22:15]and it was really cool, especially after kind of interacting
[22:18]online when you get to meet someone in person
[22:20]is always really fun.
[22:21]Because I'd different than you thought you were exactly
[22:23]what I was hoping for.
[22:24]Oh, really?
[22:27]That's such a nice answer.
[22:29]All right, well, thank you.
[22:30]Have a great day.
[22:31]Thank you.
[22:32]Take care.
[22:34]Yeah.
[22:35]All right, thank you, Nili.
[22:38]Thanks for listening to moms.
[22:39]Don't have time to read books.
[22:41]If you love it, please leave a review.
[22:42]And follow us on social at city Owens and at city readers.