James Patterson, HOLMES, MARPLE & POE + WHAT REALLY HAPPENS IN VEGAS: True Stories of the People Who Make Vegas, Vegas + THE SECRET LIVES OF BOOKSELLERS AND LIBRARIANS: Their Stories Are Better Than the Bestsellers
[0:02]Hi, I'm Zippy Owens, and you're listening to moms don't have time to read books.
[0:06]This 30-minute podcast features a new author interviewed by me every single day, 365 days
[0:12]a year for about 30 minutes.
[0:15]I am also the publisher for Zippy Books, which publishes 12 books a year in fiction and
[0:21]memoir.
[0:22]Our books are already out now.
[0:23]You can check it out on zippybooks.com.
[0:26]And we have a magazine called Zippy Mag where we have lots of wonderful essays and lifestyle
[0:31]features.
[0:32]That's at zippymag.com.
[0:33]We have classes.
[0:34]It's a B-Classist.com.
[0:36]And I recently opened a book store in LA called Zippy's Bookshop at 1113 Montana Avenue
[0:43]at 11th Street in San Monica.
[0:45]I hope that you are able to enjoy some of our other offerings.
[0:49]But this here podcast is the basis of all of it and started in 2018.
[0:54]And no matter what I do, this is basically my favorite thing.
[0:58]Enjoy.
[1:03]James Patterson is back on mom's Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[1:07]This time he is discussing the secret lives of booksellers and librarians.
[1:12]Their stories are better than the best sellers, which comes out in April.
[1:15]And we didn't really touch on what really happens in Vegas, true stories of the people
[1:19]who make Vegas.
[1:20]But that is another one of his books is coming out, also Holmes, Marple and Poe, the greatest
[1:25]crime-solving team of the 21st century, which we do talk about.
[1:29]James Patterson always has a million things coming out.
[1:32]By the way, fun fact, James Patterson also has a holiday fund which he gives to book store
[1:37]employees.
[1:38]You have to apply or nominate rather one of the employees of a store and their fund
[1:44]selects people who get $500.
[1:47]And one of our Zippy's bookshop employees, Katrina Leno, who we nominated, was one of
[1:52]the recipients.
[1:53]So thank you, James Patterson for that.
[1:54]For those who don't know, he is the most popular storyteller of our time.
[1:59]He is the creator of unforgettable characters and series, including Alex Cross, the Women's
[2:04]Murder Club, Jane F. and Smith and Maximum Ride, and of breathtaking true stories about
[2:09]the Kennedy's John Lennon and Princess Diana, as well as our military heroes, police officers
[2:14]and ER nurses.
[2:15]He has co-authored number one best-selling novels with Bill Clinton and Dolly Parton, told
[2:19]the story of his own life in James Patterson by James Patterson, and received an Agra Award
[2:24]10 Emmy Awards, the Literary Award from the National Book Foundation, and the National
[2:29]Humanities Medal.
[2:31]Welcome to James Patterson.
[2:32]Back on mom's, don't have time to read books for what I don't know the fourth time
[2:36]or something, because you write books so much and so often and so well.
[2:40]Now to talk about the secret lives of booksellers and librarians, true stories of the
[2:45]magic of reading.
[2:46]Congratulations.
[2:47]Thank you.
[2:48]Thank you.
[2:49]Thank you.
[2:50]This line, a nonfiction line, and started with walking my combat boots.
[2:54]And the mission is always been something that's very readable, but to allow people to
[2:57]understand something that they think they understand what they really don't.
[3:02]One of the reasons that I went for a sort of a humorous title, The Secret Lives of
[3:07]Booksellers and librarians, is one in general.
[3:11]It's a very funny group.
[3:13]They do have a great sense of humor.
[3:14]They're the best audiences ever when I go to these big librarian or bookseller events because
[3:19]they get all the jokes and they get the literary references and it's really cool.
[3:23]The people don't really understand one how difficult it is in this current age right now
[3:28]where we have book banning and people punching librarians.
[3:32]It's crazy.
[3:33]It's a very, very hard, it's always been a lot of work with booksellers, two people
[3:38]think, oh, those books, they all have to be stacked and put in place and taken out and
[3:43]whatever.
[3:44]So it's really, really, really hard work.
[3:46]I just wanted people to understand and I wanted to praise them.
[3:50]I wanted booksellers and librarians to go, yes, somebody's telling our story.
[3:54]This is cool.
[3:55]I definitely learned a lot opening a bookstore less than a year ago.
[3:58]That's right.
[3:59]All the things that you have to do in all the different functional areas and as a writer,
[4:05]I was like, where's my book and it must be, but booksellers to have limited space.
[4:10]Well, I shouldn't tell you, you obviously know this, but it's hard, all the calculations
[4:15]and then physically having to ship things back and it's a lot.
[4:19]And put in the computer and every book decision is huge.
[4:23]Yeah.
[4:24]And the joy, just so people understand what Matt ever has been and I did, we interviewed
[4:28]a couple hundred booksellers and librarians.
[4:31]And then we have about 60 in the book or so and we take the 40 or 50 page interviews
[4:36]and turn them into these five or six page nuggets.
[4:39]So you get a feeling for that bookseller or that librarian, that store or that library
[4:45]and then a couple of cool stories.
[4:48]Judy Bloom was one of the booksellers.
[4:51]Yes, written.
[4:52]And Judy wrote in her, she said, I had decided it for 50 years, 50 years of writing
[4:57]that I didn't want to write anymore.
[5:00]And then this opportunity came up for her and she says, so how lucky was I?
[5:04]I was certainly able to get up in the morning excited about what I'm going to do, how
[5:08]I'm going to spend my day.
[5:10]I'm excited every day that I go to the bookstore.
[5:14]That is the truth, period and that's how she feels about her store.
[5:19]And that's what drives a lot of the booksellers and librarians, that's real of recommending
[5:23]a book that turns somebody on and they go, give me another book.
[5:27]And that's how I feel about a lot of my books that I write and I'll get this, you know,
[5:32]with the kids books, people coming back and say, so a lot of times with tears in the
[5:35]right, you've got my kid reading, which as you know is a huge deal.
[5:39]And then a lot of times with adults, adults is that I kind of stopped reading and I've read
[5:44]one of you books and I remember how much fun it was, which is also cool.
[5:48]I think it's great when people have individual relationships with a specific bookseller in
[5:53]the store, right, where they say, oh, you know, Liz's recommendations, where and you say
[5:57]this in some of the interviews in here that some people will like camp out for two days
[6:01]just to be like, I loved it.
[6:02]Give me another one.
[6:03]What else did I read?
[6:04]Yeah.
[6:05]Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[6:06]That is the joy of one of the women from Albany.
[6:09]She said, this is one of the books.
[6:11]She said, to me, a book's really great is kind of escapism.
[6:14]I may have a master's degree, but one of my favorite books is Twilight.
[6:18]It's just escapism fiction at its absolute best to each their own.
[6:23]But my attitude is, listen, I have a kid at home.
[6:26]I have a full time job.
[6:27]I teach.
[6:28]I have a big life, but I don't want to think about my big life for a little while.
[6:32]For two hours, I am not Alexis in Albany.
[6:35]That's the bookseller.
[6:36]I am in the world of forks or I'm in Wonderland or I am in Hogwarts.
[6:41]And there should never be guilty pleasures about reading a book.
[6:44]It's just fine.
[6:46]You're allowed to.
[6:47]I mean, that really, I think in some ways, that's what this show is about, that it
[6:52]is hard being a parent, being a mother, but you're allowed to spend that hour, hour and
[6:58]a half with a book, and find that time somehow or watch a goofy movie or whatever.
[7:03]Yes, that is allowed.
[7:04]That is absolutely allowed and it's good for your sanity.
[7:07]Exactly.
[7:08]I'll tell you the funniest, this is, I love life stories.
[7:11]This is my funniest for this week.
[7:13]The first part of mine is, mother was this wonderful Irish lady, had just incredible patience.
[7:18]And he and his two brothers, this is, there were five, eight and ten.
[7:22]And it was one of these, it had been snow, snow, snow for like six days in a row.
[7:27]And these boys were at each other and jumping on each other and screaming and yelling.
[7:31]And finally, she's in the kitchen.
[7:32]She pulls open the drawer.
[7:33]She pulls out three butter knives.
[7:35]She goes here, here, here, now kill one another.
[7:39]I love that.
[7:40]It's just such a great.
[7:42]Butter knives.
[7:44]The next time you butter something, think of that story.
[7:47]I'm going to for sure.
[7:49]I love that good, that story.
[7:50]Oh my goodness.
[7:51]I loved in your Judy Bloom part that how it came to be that she opened the books and books
[7:57]in QS from Mitch Kaplan at books and books in Miami, who he is like one of the most important
[8:03]and wonderful people.
[8:05]They're all important and wonderful.
[8:07]Okay.
[8:08]They all are.
[8:09]They all are.
[8:10]Most of them anyway.
[8:11]I do know him.
[8:12]You know, I'm sure I would find them all equally wonderful.
[8:16]But the way that she structured it as a non-profit, I found very interesting as well.
[8:20]And I didn't know that until I read this.
[8:22]Yeah.
[8:23]That's popping up around now, that little trick of it allows people to do bookstores
[8:29]who kind of couldn't afford to do it otherwise, which is great.
[8:33]If you could choose, would you rather be a bookseller or a librarian?
[8:36]I probably would rather be a bookseller.
[8:38]My mother was, and I have a book on teachers coming too.
[8:42]My mother was a teacher and a librarian, she was a librarian on the week on Saturdays back
[8:47]in New York.
[8:48]So she did both.
[8:49]So I got a feeling for that and she just did drag myself and my oldest sister to the library
[8:54]every Saturday.
[8:55]She was four to six hours and we would be in the library every Saturday, reading, reading,
[9:00]reading, which was good.
[9:01]Look what happened.
[9:02]Yeah.
[9:03]That is the secret.
[9:04]If you take your kid to the library, four to six hours a week, you will become James
[9:08]Patterson.
[9:09]That's it.
[9:10]That's it.
[9:11]That's it.
[9:12]My sister, my sister is a big reader.
[9:13]Always has been.
[9:14]The other one that will get dragged.
[9:16]She's not as sure as not to be a writer.
[9:18]Well, your reverence for booksellers and the way you give back is really unparalleled.
[9:24]And you even have this holiday bonus where you can submit a bookseller and you give out
[9:31]gifts.
[9:32]And one of the women in our store got one of your gifts and it's changing her life.
[9:35]So thank you so much for that.
[9:37]Well, the great thing about that is more than anything else that we do, we do a lot of
[9:41]a lot of college scholarships and stuff.
[9:43]But the booksellers, I swear to God every single person that we give something to, they
[9:47]send the most wonderful letters.
[9:49]So it really is a joyful thing.
[9:52]We're actually, we're working on it right away when secret lives comes out, I think in
[9:56]April or so, we're going to do another gift to book.
[10:00]tell us in librarians. So so we're working that out to see who's getting a
[10:04]presence. Who's been they want none of them or nobody, but you know what what
[10:09]nice ones are going to get something. Yeah. Why give back so much. I credit my
[10:14]mother and my grandmother. That's just the way we were brought up. And they
[10:17]did it. My mother, you know, she taught. She she worked in in the library, as I
[10:22]said. My very fond of grandfather had a very small restaurant. And they used
[10:26]you know, gifted people didn't have any money. Well, it's just the way we were
[10:29]brought up. That was the deal. And you know, it's a funny thing. I was on the
[10:34]wait, wait, don't tell me that podcast or your listeners will know. And I
[10:39]couldn't get back that night from New Haven back to Florida. So I stayed in
[10:43]the hotel. This is a weird one. Such 30 morning, I got up. And the nicest person in
[10:49]the world, she was the server. And I just had like a half a bagel and a coffee
[10:54]whatever. And I don't know what got into me, but I left your $100 tip. And she
[10:58]said, oh my God, you've made my weekend. I said, you know what, you just made
[11:02]my weekend. And it was just a thing about the joy of giving. There are a lot
[11:07]of sort of well to do people in this world that they need to, they need to
[11:11]experience a joy of giving more than they. And then we wouldn't have the same
[11:14]with people going like, oh my God, these people have so much money. Give it away.
[11:17]Give away a lot of it anyway. Yeah, you have to give away all of it. You can still
[11:22]you know, have nice things. But anyway, so that's what we do. I'm curious about
[11:27]the current sort of environment for breaking out as a new writer versus when
[11:31]you got started. Do you feel like it's harder now? Yes. Are there more books or is
[11:38]that just a perception? Because it just feels impossible or was it always
[11:42]harder? Do you feel like you if you were starting out today and today you
[11:45]were 25 years old publishing your first book or something? What do you think
[11:49]that would be like? I don't know if I'd make it. There were very few publishers.
[11:52]Some publishers have a bunch of imprints. When I, you know, initially there were
[11:57]40, 50 imprints. There was just a lot of publishing houses. That's how I got
[12:02]31 turn down some of my first book. There were a lot of places. And then it
[12:07]went in Edgar as best first mystery. So go figure that one out. But I think
[12:12]it's never been harder. The only thing it makes that is easier now is you can
[12:16]publish your own stuff online and you can't get feedback and you probably
[12:21]won't make money. But you might. You can go online and if you can get the
[12:25]word out a little bit or you can go on, you know, some people obviously have
[12:28]been very lucky with TikTok. So there are ways to get it out there without a
[12:32]publisher. But but I think I think it's I think it's very hard to get published
[12:36]in a traditional way now. Okay. Well, I just wondered if it was only my my
[12:42]first episode. No, no, no, no, no, no. And everybody all, you know, all my
[12:45]published writer friends are all talking about that. It's like, oh my god, it's
[12:49]so hard. It's hard for people. You know, even people who want awards and people
[12:52]who have, I'm pretty good track records. It's just, it's free talk. Great talk.
[12:56]And people are reading as much as they, as they should, I think. I don't know if
[13:01]you read this in the New York Times recently that for the best sellers in the
[13:05]New York Times list, all of them were repeats except the only new people who
[13:10]got on the list. Three of the five or so were from the big book clubs of the half
[13:17]of them. And then the remaining three one was like a book of the month club pick.
[13:22]And so basically there was only one book or so that actually got on the list
[13:26]from a debut author. What do we do with that? That's always been true. I think
[13:31]they it's always been hard to break on. I was lucky with the first
[13:35]sellers cross book. It's a funny thing. I mean, I published your head and told
[13:39]me, you know, and all of a sudden I pick up the New York Times and it was number six.
[13:43]I'm going, I thought this is a mistake. And so I went over to the local Barnes and Noble
[13:49]on Broadway. And it was in the window. And then I went back in the store. And what
[13:56]were some writers would do? I still do it is if you pick up our book, we'll watch you.
[14:02]And if you put it down, it breaks our heart. And if you buy it, if you take it, it just
[14:08]it makes our day. And to this day, it's still that way. If somebody picks up my book
[14:11]in an airport and I say, you know, anyway, so I walk in the store. And this woman is
[14:16]is looking at the book and whatever. And then she puts it under her arm and she's
[14:20]walking down the aisle. And she puts it in her pocketbook. She stole it. And all I'm
[14:25]thinking is does that count as to say, oh, is this true story? It's weird though. Yeah.
[14:29]So yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's it's always been hard. I think for first novels. And less
[14:35]the publisher really decides you're going to go out there and really, really back it like crazy.
[14:40]And then you have to convince a couple of the chains to to believe you. So if arts and Noble and Walmart
[14:48]don't believe you, it probably won't happen. So but it's it's hard, but it's doable.
[14:54]So meanwhile, between the secret lives of booksellers and librarians or before that and after that,
[14:59]you have so many more books coming out and have already come out of book about Las Vegas.
[15:04]What's coming out? What's next up in your pipeline and what's going on with your younger kids
[15:10]line and just all of the stuff? I, you know, the younger thing is that's calmed down a bit.
[15:16]In January, I think a really fun book. And I actually sold this out in Hollywood. And I said,
[15:23]you should buy it just on the title. And the title is Homes, Marvel and Poe. And I sold the
[15:29]to Sky Dance to David Ellison. And he said, well, I love the title, but you have to tell me a little
[15:34]bit more. And he did buy it. But if you can imagine the sort of clever deductions of Sherlock
[15:42]Holmes, that kind of the mind that that that character had. And then the kind of thorough
[15:49]investigations of Miss Marvel, where she was just that great observer of life. And then,
[15:54]and then the kind of surprises and shocks you would find in Edgar Allan Poe stories.
[16:01]And somehow, this book, all of this is happening in New York City in 2024. Okay.
[16:09]So if you like all that and I do, then you're ready to read homes,
[16:14]Marvel and Poe. It's a great team of investigators. They have all of those talents that deduction,
[16:20]that observation, the surprises. And I think it makes for kind of an unforgettable novel.
[16:26]And it's a little cozy. So it's not like a big murderous, whatever. So I think people
[16:34]will really like it a lot. And one of the fascinating things about that process, I write it with
[16:40]a guy named Brian Sitz. Brian worked with me in advertising. And then we did a kid show,
[16:47]kids do, which one like six, I mean, or something. It was not, you know, whatever. But he had
[16:52]never written an novel or anything like it. And then Brian got, and I got together. And we wrote a
[16:57]book shot, one of the novellas. And then Brian is the other brain behind this Holmes, Miss
[17:03]Marvel and Poe book. And he's great. And he's like, at this point, I think he's 70 or something like
[17:09]that. And he's, he's, he's never written any fiction before. He's great. He just has it. He has that
[17:15]gift. He has that, whatever the heck it is. So I think people will like Holmes, Marvel and Poe. And
[17:21]you know, I, I'm sure there are people listening and watching whatever, I don't know where watching
[17:25]or whatever it is. Who, why don't we James Patterson? That's a silly thing to the silly. That's
[17:31]like saying, I don't want, I never watch Netflix or no, it's, there's so many things in the
[17:36]variety as such. And, and I, you will like Holmes, Marvel, but if you like mysteries, if you
[17:42]you don't like mysteries, you know, I wouldn't read that one. Read the, read the librarians book then.
[17:47]Your memoir was one of my favorites of yours. I have to say. Oh, thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
[17:50]I loved that one. Well, and once again, that's, I don't think people would expect that. And,
[17:56]and that's where we, I love, I mentioned before about the librarians or the book about the soldiers.
[18:02]I love it when people think they understand something, but they don't. And you go like, oh,
[18:08]okay, that's not what I thought. You know, I mean, you're right about the memoir.
[18:12]Most people, especially people that don't read my books would say, I have no interest.
[18:16]If you read it, you go, okay, I really had no idea who this guy was, I think. Yeah, for better
[18:21]awards. No, well, they should know that you're very funny. I mean, you're a little extra
[18:27]for you to are very funny. And I feel like you've also conquered how to keep people's attention.
[18:32]I feel like that's something that you're really good at, whether it's a memoir or, you know,
[18:36]short shortened interviews or mysteries or, you know, the book about,
[18:41]I'm forgetting the title, but football family, the wolfs.
[18:44]House of wolves. House of wolves. Yeah, I, I've written a couple now with Mike Lupica. And when
[18:49]we're on the show, your, your podcast wants to. Yeah. And, and we just have a blast together.
[18:55]It's, I mean, we have so much fun. It's like a, a, a sane writer's room where the two writers
[19:01]I love each other. It really, it's been, it's been, it, it's been, it is a really great relationship.
[19:07]The 12 12 months to live, I think this is what we were on for, I think. And that's another one.
[19:11]It's just a fun, fun, fun book to read. And it is very funny. So anyway, we will continue with that.
[19:17]But I tell you what I have this year, a little later, which is in June, is a Michael
[19:22]Creighton's estate approach name. And Michael, who, who I loved this book, she held from, from West
[19:28]world. I don't know if that was a book actually, but Jurassic Park, etc, etc. It's a disclosure
[19:33]on a drama and a strange. And he had started a book and only wrote about 70 page or whatever
[19:40]number of pages was. And they say, came in and said, would you like to finish it? And I said,
[19:45]well, I don't know. Let me read, let me read what he wrote. And I read what he wrote. And it,
[19:50]it starts with this volcano, which is threatening to destroy the island of Hawaii. And then
[19:57]there's something even worse than that, which.
[20:00]involved in those pages. And I went, yes, I want to try to do this. I want to try to complete this book.
[20:06]And I love the challenge of writing a book that you've been not put down, hopefully. And I don't
[20:12]think you can with this book. It's called eruption. But also a lot of science, which I've never done
[20:17]before. And Michael graduated from Harvard Medical School, but never practiced, which is really
[20:24]fascinating. He decided that rather be a writer.
[20:27]Well, at least you got the degree. There you go.
[20:30]You got the degree. Yes, he did. Yes, he did.
[20:33]That's amazing. So what advice do you have for authors who are trying to become the next you?
[20:41]Don't do that.
[20:46]You know, you know, the advice of real estate, you know, location, location, location, location,
[20:52]I think in terms of popular fiction or popular nonfiction, it's story story story.
[20:58]And, you know, and people don't have a lot of time for things. That's that's the whole purpose
[21:03]of your podcast. And so they have to, you know, they have to select, which is hard. And you need
[21:09]to be aware as a writer that for a lot of people, they don't have the time that they'd like to have.
[21:15]And their attention span is slow anyway. When I was out with President Clinton, he talked about
[21:22]how the attention span of a butterfly was nine seconds. And the attention span of a human is eight
[21:29]seconds. So you just have to be aware of that. And my notion, which I've said before is that I
[21:37]pretend I'm sitting across from somebody. I'm telling them a story and I don't want them get up
[21:42]until I finish. And that's a good thing to think about if you want to ultimately make money doing
[21:50]this, that, you know, you try to your readers' time when you're writing it. Don't get caught up in
[21:56]your words and your stuff that nobody cares about. I mean, yeah, it's a certain kind of book. The
[22:03]book that's, it's harder if you just go off and you're just going to write a thousand pages that
[22:09]you want to write. And you may be a wonderful crafts person. It just, you're taking a big chance in
[22:14]terms of one, getting published and two, as good as it might be. And secondly, being able to make
[22:20]a living doing it because that's people mostly don't, that's harder for a lot of people. A thousand
[22:26]page. Oh my God. You know, and no paragraphs. Yeah, a thousand pages, no paragraphs. There's something
[22:33]out right now. I can't remember the name of it and I won't publicize it, but no paragraphs. Okay,
[22:39]I'm sure it's good, but you know, I'd like paragraphs. I like to reward myself. I finished a
[22:44]paragraph. Oh, I finished a chapter. What fun. Yeah. Yes. Well, you also keep all of your chapters
[22:50]quite short. All of your things are, are quite short. So you definitely even the little books that
[22:55]you have, you know, the little book visuals you have in this one to get you to the end of a
[23:00]section so you can feel that accomplishment. Yeah. Well, that's okay. That's a nice thing for people
[23:05]like within a reason. You know, the Creighton book, some of the chapters are a little longer
[23:10]because once again, it's a Michael Creighton James Patterson book and it shouldn't just feel
[23:15]like a Patterson book. It should feel like a really a collaboration, good collaboration.
[23:20]And do you just enclosing have any favorite libraries or bookstores that you want to highlight?
[23:26]All of them. New York, my hometown man, where my mom was, they still library is still there.
[23:33]Actually, they just opened a bookstore in town. I don't remember ever when I was,
[23:38]I'm sure they were, but I don't remember anyone I was a kid, but they've just opened one and
[23:42]the name escapes me right now, but you'll be able to find it because it's the only one in town.
[23:47]So I'm going to, and in Palm Beach, where I am classic books, we'll give them a shout out to
[23:53]good people. But they're all good. They're all, it's, it's a noble thing to do. It's hard work
[23:59]and for the most part, there's not a lot of money in it. So God bless all of them.
[24:03]Amazing. Well, congratulations on your latest release and all of the great things that you do,
[24:09]of course. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you. This has been good. Thanks so much.
[24:13]All right. Have a great day. You're good at this. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Bye.
[24:19]Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[24:23]Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at Zibi Owens and at Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[24:28]Also sign up for my newsletter at Zibi Owens.com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet
[24:32]lots of authors on Zoom every other week. Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound for
[24:37]the Sound Editing. And thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and
[24:42]now trim music.