Brandon J. Wolf, A PLACE FOR US: A Memoir
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[1:03]Brandon J. Wolf is the author of a place for us, a memoir.
[1:07]Brandon is a nationally recognized gun safety and LGBTQ civil rights advocate and dynamic
[1:12]public speaker.
[1:13]He currently serves as the press secretary for Equality Florida, the state's LGBTQ civil
[1:18]rights organization.
[1:20]On June 12th, life change for Brandon, he crouched in a bathroom while a gunman opened
[1:25]fire at Orlando's Pulse nightclub, killing his best friends, Drew and Juan and 47 others.
[1:32]Other than be swallowed by the anger and fear of tragedy, Brandon set out to honor the
[1:35]victim's legacies with action.
[1:38]In the immediate aftermath of the shooting, Brandon co-founded the Drew Project, a nonprofit
[1:43]organization that works to empower youth and provide future leaders in the LGBTQ community
[1:48]funding for higher education.
[1:50]To date, the organization is given over $100,000 in college scholarships to rising leaders.
[1:55]He also became an outspoken activist in the gun violence prevention movement, partnering
[1:59]with March for our lives, every town, giffords and others to demand legislative solutions
[2:04]to the epidemic.
[2:05]In 2019, he became the first survivor of the tragedy at Pulse nightclub to testify before
[2:10]Congress.
[2:11]A powerful public speaker, Brandon is a frequent guest on MSNBC, CNN and in print like CNN.com,
[2:18]USA Today and others, weaving his story into calls to action.
[2:22]He has been recognized by HuffPost as one of the 30 modern day LGBTQ pioneers and business
[2:28]equality magazine as one of 40 LGBTQ leaders under 40, and all things Brandon is driven
[2:33]by the reminder that we are obligated to honor those we've lost, not with empty words or
[2:38]hollow platitudes, but with action.
[2:41]Welcome, Brandon.
[2:42]Thank you so much for coming.
[2:43]On mom's, I have time to read books to discuss a place for us, a memoir, which, oh my
[2:48]gosh, is so moving and so good.
[2:51]Oh my goodness.
[2:52]I'm just like reeling from it, having just finished.
[2:56]Thank you.
[2:57]I'm just immensely grateful for the time and, you know, when you put your first work
[3:01]into the world, you're not sure how people are going to respond to it.
[3:04]So I'm thrilled to hear that you loved it.
[3:07]Well, I'm sure I'm not the only one.
[3:09]I know I'm not the only one.
[3:11]Your story.
[3:12]So maybe you should start.
[3:14]Why don't you tell us, Naris, what your memoir is about and the incredible sort of loss
[3:20]and resilience that has gone into your story and then writing about all these painful
[3:25]experiences.
[3:27]Yeah, you know, I, for folks who may not be familiar with me, my name is Brandon Wolf,
[3:32]he and pronouns.
[3:33]I am zooming in from Orlando, Florida, where I've lived for the last on and off about
[3:38]15 years.
[3:40]And I think folks are most familiar with the part of my story where on, you know, one
[3:44]June night in 2016, I went to Pulse nightclub with my best friends.
[3:48]I was lucky to make it out with my life.
[3:51]Unfortunately, we're not.
[3:53]And that part of the story has been sort of the public facing part, right?
[3:58]I think again, most people are, if they're familiar with me, they're familiar with that
[4:02]part of it.
[4:03]But when we were talking about writing a book, you know, you sell the idea to a publisher,
[4:08]you get a proposal together and you talk them through what you want to write about.
[4:13]And the publisher asked me, is this a book about Pulse?
[4:16]Is it a book about your experience that night?
[4:19]If so, why is it not an article?
[4:20]Why is it not an essay?
[4:21]Why does it need to be 200 full pages for a story that you've told many times?
[4:27]And, and my response was that it's a kind of a book about Pulse, but that you can't
[4:32]understand why Pulse, the event mattered to so many people.
[4:36]If you don't understand why Pulse, the space matters to so many people.
[4:40]Why spaces like that are so necessary?
[4:42]And so I went back to the beginning and I talked about what it felt like growing up at
[4:46]the intersections of being a queer kid and also a mixed race kid and a majority white
[4:51]conservative town in rural Oregon.
[4:54]I talked about what it felt like to basically run away from home, you know, to find shows
[4:58]and family to find a community here in Florida that felt a little different, that looked
[5:02]more like me, that loved more like me.
[5:05]And then I talked about what it felt like on June 12th of 2016 to have that ripped away.
[5:12]And, and then how I've sort of navigated since then.
[5:15]At the end of the day, we've been through a lot, I think, as a globe over the last couple
[5:19]of years, immense loss, a terrifying pandemic that shattered all the ways we think about
[5:25]the world exposed fractures in our systems that left people falling through the cracks.
[5:31]And we're at a time where things are more divided than ever.
[5:34]And so I wanted to write a book that not only memorialized my best friends, that not only
[5:39]told the story of why queer spaces are so important, that not only put humanity behind
[5:45]the idea of intersectionality, but also began to talk about the hope and optimism that
[5:50]can come from building a community together.
[5:53]Wow.
[5:54]First of all, you were so articulate.
[5:56]This is, oh, thank you.
[5:57]Thank you.
[5:58]So you start off the book where you talk about the tragic loss of your mom and what it
[6:03]was like being sort of left behind with your, you know, your stepfather and his future
[6:09]kit, your half siblings and how you always sort of felt out of place at that table.
[6:13]Right.
[6:14]You felt out of place at the school, you had the scene with the principal was like with
[6:19]white supremacists and, you know, like, I just kept reading.
[6:23]I'm like, oh my gosh, how could the school of districts not be doing more stuff and all
[6:28]of your advocacy and, you know, you think about people who have like a tough time in high
[6:32]school or, you know, this is like otherworldly, what you had to live through and to have
[6:38]really no support at home.
[6:39]Like, and you wrote about that so well and so like the reader can't help but just feel
[6:45]their heart breaking.
[6:46]Like as if we were in your shoes with your loneliness would be having been really abandoned
[6:51]essentially.
[6:52]And I, and my heart also just really went out to your mom because of course that's the
[6:56]last thing she would have wanted for you.
[6:58]Right.
[6:59]And she would mean to, you know, you'd obviously as nobody means to have to leave your
[7:04]children and some parents worst fear, but even reading this as a mom, like the fact that
[7:08]you were there.
[7:09]Oh my gosh, it's just like on every level.
[7:11]I mean, when you look back even on the high school years and getting through and just
[7:16]getting yourself to college where you can have that awkward and then even the scene with
[7:20]your dad saying goodbye, oh my gosh.
[7:23]When you look back, did you get through it or with sanity intact?
[7:27]Because there are a lot of ways you could have gone right that, putting a lot of people
[7:31]in those shoes, you might not have made it what to be here.
[7:35]You know, I mean, like what do you think that was all about?
[7:38]Yeah, I think, well, first of all, somebody asked me a really poignant question yesterday
[7:43]which is, you know, my mom left me with some very simple tasks, right, to make sure I
[7:48]take care of my sister, to be patient with my dad and never forget how special I am.
[7:53]And they said, you know, that really feels like it's encapsulated who you are that you
[7:56]do those things even to this day, that you're patient with people who disagree, that
[8:00]you try to take care of those people that you love and that you always like stay zero
[8:05]in on the value that you can bring to a conversation.
[8:09]And so in response to that, I think, poignant observation, I said that the best parts of
[8:15]me are my mother, that they're just, you know, exactly who she was when she was on planet
[8:21]earth.
[8:22]She taught me how to be me, even though I didn't have the words for that at the time,
[8:25]I didn't really understand that's what was happening.
[8:28]And so, you know, I would say first, it's just the strength of my mom that allowed me
[8:32]to carry on and, you know, and find a little bit of my way, it obviously took me a
[8:38]while to figure out where I was going, but throughout it all, I think I found bits and pieces
[8:43]of my identity in my way.
[8:45]And the other thing that I mentioned a lot in the book is this power of community, right?
[8:48]So when we started taking the proposal and fleshing it out, making it, you know, giving
[8:54]it some meat on the bones, one of the things that was most important to me was to capture
[8:58]this idea that safety, that, you know, safe spaces, that places for us to belong are not
[9:04]simply physical places, they're not just places like pulse, they're not just places like
[9:09]college, but they are, they're community spaces, right?
[9:13]They're the relationships we build with each other.
[9:16]And I think sincerely that community probably got me through all of that.
[9:21]It got me through my high school years, I had a group of friends that we would sneak
[9:25]off to the, the local gay bar.
[9:27]That was my community that got me through high school.
[9:30]When I got to college, I had, I talked a little bit about my, my hallmate, who would
[9:35]sing musicals with me.
[9:36]He actually posted that he got a copy of the book.
[9:39]So I'm excited to hear what he thinks he's an English teacher.
[9:42]So I'm excited to hear what he thinks, but, you know, it's, it was those moments of
[9:46]community that created the opportunity for me to find myself in all of that.
[9:51]Wait, what happened to your roommate?
[9:53]You said he left school.
[9:54]Do you?
[9:55]Yeah.
[9:56]Yes, how you in touch?
[9:57]Do you know what happened?
[9:58]I have never been in touch with him after that.
[9:59]And that brings...
[10:00]makes my heart.
[10:01]That's one of, you know, there are some stories
[10:03]that I've told a lot, the Paul story is one I've told a lot.
[10:06]And so I know how to tell it in a way
[10:08]that sort of guards my emotional well-being,
[10:11]but there are other stories that were really difficult
[10:13]to write about.
[10:14]And many of them I've not talked about publicly before.
[10:17]My relationship with my college roommate
[10:19]is one that I've not talked a lot about.
[10:21]And I still carry a lot of regret about that situation
[10:25]and how it went.
[10:26]I certainly hope he's doing well and all of that.
[10:29]But I've not stayed in touch with him.
[10:32]Well, speaking of things that you wrote about,
[10:34]that you hadn't written about before,
[10:35]and I hate to even gingerly tread
[10:37]on these horrific memories of yours,
[10:39]but the scene with Ben, Ben was his name, right?
[10:43]The scene, Ben, where you go to the stranger's house
[10:46]and he does terrible things to you
[10:48]and you're so shamed and cracked open inside
[10:50]and not feeling able to talk about it or process it,
[10:55]or get external help,
[10:56]and that you then say to us in the book
[10:58]that you're literally now writing about it and publicly
[11:01]and talking about it probably for the first time,
[11:03]something like that traumatic,
[11:05]I mean, that could be a book, by the way.
[11:07]You know, like some people have written books
[11:08]just about like the effect of something like that happening.
[11:11]How did you feel getting it out and onto the page
[11:13]and now having it really out there?
[11:16]That was one of the hardest parts of the book to write
[11:19]because, you know, as you mentioned,
[11:20]and as I noted in the book,
[11:21]I've never told that story out loud before.
[11:24]I had actually never told my family before
[11:26]that that happened, I never told my parents.
[11:28]And so one of the roadblocks that I experienced
[11:31]while trying to figure out how to write that part of the book
[11:34]was knowing that my parents would read this book
[11:36]and read that for the first time
[11:38]and how they might process that,
[11:40]what they might be thinking about, you know,
[11:42]this happened while I was still, you know, living
[11:46]in and around my hometown.
[11:47]I was still basically at home.
[11:49]And so that was really, really difficult
[11:52]and it was difficult for me to relive it
[11:54]while I was capturing it in the pages.
[11:57]But it was also so important because, you know,
[12:00]I didn't want to, there's a lot of queer memoirs
[12:02]and I love queer memoirs because I'm a queer person
[12:04]and I love reading about other people's lived experiences.
[12:07]But there's so many queer memoirs that center on sex
[12:11]and they feel very sexual in nature
[12:13]because, you know, part of the queer existence
[12:16]is that your sexuality is the defiance, right?
[12:20]It is the political statement.
[12:21]And so so many queer memoirs focus on sex.
[12:24]I didn't want this to be a book like that.
[12:26]I wanted it to be more maybe welcoming
[12:29]to people who don't want to read something
[12:30]that is so sexually charged.
[12:32]But there has to be an element of confronting
[12:36]the relationship between gay men and their sexuality
[12:39]and the ways that that shows up in violent fashion,
[12:43]in, you know, in insecure fashion,
[12:46]the way we use sex as an outlet to seek validation from men
[12:50]because we didn't get it from our fathers
[12:52]or, you know, all of these things are very complex.
[12:54]I wanted to approach it
[12:55]and it felt like the Ben story had to be in there.
[12:58]So as much as I wrestled with how to tell it,
[13:02]I, you know, grappled with the idea
[13:03]that my grandma's gonna read that
[13:05]and she's never heard that story before.
[13:07]It really felt like it needed to be in there
[13:09]if I was being honest about my journey to where I've gotten today.
[13:13]How did your family handle it when they read it?
[13:15]So we've not talked about that particular story in the book
[13:19]but the reception for my family has really blown me away.
[13:22]I think, you know, again, you put your first work
[13:25]into the world and you don't know how people are gonna respond.
[13:27]You don't know if anyone's gonna read it first of all.
[13:29]You put it out there and you hope we'll read it.
[13:31]And so there's all of those things
[13:33]but I think if no one else read this book,
[13:36]the fact that my family has read it
[13:38]and given me glowing reviews
[13:39]is probably the only thing I needed out of this process.
[13:43]My stepmom was so like enamored
[13:46]and overcome after she read the book
[13:48]that she actually flew here for the first time
[13:50]and spent a week with me here in Florida
[13:52]just to like rekindle our relationship.
[13:54]My dad, who you know has a really interesting arc
[13:58]in the book sent me a beautiful note
[14:01]that essentially said I'm proud of you.
[14:03]I don't know if you use those words.
[14:04]Those are very rare words for him
[14:06]but it basically said I'm proud of you.
[14:08]And then the one that really struck me
[14:10]is the one that I posted on Instagram
[14:12]which is that my grandmother read it
[14:14]and I've never come out to her before.
[14:16]And so this was my coming out to my grandmother
[14:19]and she said a lot of really beautiful things
[14:21]but the words that hit home for me were we loved you then
[14:25]and we love you now.
[14:26]So if I get no other reviews on this book
[14:29]I think my dad's review, my stepmom's review,
[14:31]my grandma's review, those are the ones that matter most.
[14:34]This literally makes me want to cry this whole thing.
[14:37]I'm so glad not that it matters
[14:41]what our parents ultimately like we're all adults
[14:45]in the world now and that's searching for sort of validation
[14:49]but the fact that you're dead in particular
[14:51]after like so letting you down in different situations
[14:55]and oh my gosh, could even come around to anyway.
[15:00]He's been on such a journey
[15:01]and I am just, we still don't agree on a lot of things.
[15:05]We probably never will but I am so proud of him
[15:07]for the amount of growth that he has had
[15:10]over the last 10 plus years.
[15:13]He's really a totally different person than the person
[15:16]I grew up with.
[15:18]The fact that you're so generous and can say that
[15:20]and be proud of him and oh my gosh, you're just,
[15:23]that's amazing.
[15:24]Wow.
[15:25]So in addition to all of the things that sort of happened
[15:28]to you and your search for place and home and all of that
[15:32]then to talk about sort of not just losing your friends
[15:36]in this very public thing
[15:37]and I lost my college roommate and best friend on 9.11
[15:40]So I've been sort of a part of when something so personal
[15:44]to you becomes also a national thing
[15:46]that like everybody talks about all the time
[15:49]and how do you sort of reconcile
[15:50]being a part of a national crisis situation
[15:53]and yet protecting those individuals
[15:57]and making sure that they get their due
[15:58]like so that we get to know people like Drew
[16:01]and we get to experience your relationship
[16:03]and your deep love and where that came from
[16:06]and yet also you give us this inside look
[16:09]and to something we've heard about
[16:11]but of course it'd never been on the inside of.
[16:13]Just tell me more about that
[16:14]and how it felt to write this
[16:16]and like what people should know and you know
[16:19]just I don't know anything you want to say about that.
[16:23]Yeah, I feel like one of the things I've said
[16:26]over the last seven years that it took me a while
[16:29]to realize was that I'm not the protagonist in my story.
[16:33]I think Drew is the protagonist in my story
[16:36]and I'm just the messenger.
[16:38]I'm just the person who gets to share the best parts of him
[16:41]with the rest of the world.
[16:43]And I came to that realization because you know
[16:46]when you lose someone that you love that much
[16:48]that is really truly family to you,
[16:51]you go through a lot of emotions,
[16:52]you go through grief and anger
[16:54]and there's a moment that I have with God in a church
[16:57]that is very like you know cuts at the core
[17:01]of everything that I believed as a child
[17:03]and so there's so many things you're going through
[17:05]but the most unexpected emotion for me was fear
[17:10]and you know you're afraid you're gonna forget them
[17:13]so you've saved old voicemails.
[17:14]So you remember how they sounded
[17:15]when they picked up the phone,
[17:16]you've saved old t-shirts,
[17:18]you remember how they smelled when they walked in the room
[17:21]but I was also deeply afraid that they would be reduced
[17:24]to that Drew and his partner one would be reduced
[17:26]to names on a wall somewhere,
[17:28]that they would just be part of this public spectacle.
[17:31]They would be two more names on America's list
[17:34]of gun violence victims
[17:36]and that people would never really get to know them
[17:38]that they would just be oh,
[17:40]two more queer people that were killed in that bar.
[17:43]And so part of the last seven years has been me setting out
[17:47]to make people understand what they meant to the world
[17:50]not just because of how they died
[17:52]but because of how they lived.
[17:53]So that for me was the most important part
[17:57]of telling the Paul story.
[17:58]I think I have to take you into the club that night.
[18:01]I have to help walk you through the truly like horrific
[18:04]circumstances that surrounded the shooting
[18:07]but the most important part was helping people understand
[18:10]who was stolen from us,
[18:12]giving them real humanity and depth
[18:15]so that you can almost hear their laughter
[18:17]or see their smiles.
[18:19]I had someone tell me today that after they read
[18:22]the Drew chapter, they actually googled him
[18:24]so that they could see what he looked like
[18:26]because they were so interested to know more about Drew.
[18:29]That for me was the most important part
[18:31]of telling the Paul story
[18:33]and perhaps if it's not grandma's review,
[18:35]I think the best review I've gotten was someone saying,
[18:38]it's interesting that though it's a memoir,
[18:40]it doesn't really feel like it's about you
[18:42]at the end of the day, it felt like it was about Drew.
[18:44]And that, I mean, that's the best review
[18:47]that someone could give me
[18:48]because that's the hope of telling the Paul story
[18:52]is that people get to know Drew the way I knew him.
[18:55]Well, I do think he is a central character.
[18:57]I would argue it's about you and that,
[19:00]but he is definitely like a central,
[19:02]a central cast member and we do get to know him.
[19:05]And I did the same thing I went on your Instagram.
[19:06]I was like, oh my gosh, let me see these guys.
[19:09]Like who is everyone?
[19:10]Cause you just want more once you read it,
[19:13]and you give us this introduction.
[19:14]And yeah, capturing the life of those that we've lost,
[19:18]there is this compulsion I feel.
[19:20]It's like, no, but here's who they are specifically, right?
[19:24]Like, and who else but us to tell the stories, right?
[19:29]The stories going if, you know, so,
[19:31]well, I'm so sorry that you lost Drew and Juan,
[19:34]even though you were a little jealous of him and whatever,
[19:35]but no, I mean, clearly the importance
[19:40]and the huge place he had in your heart.
[19:42]And you know, you don't get over that.
[19:43]It you just find a new way to live with it.
[19:45]And I'm really, really sorry.
[19:47]I bet he would be so proud of this,
[19:48]I'd be for writing this book too.
[19:49]And he would be posting on Instagram about it as well.
[19:52]Thank you.
[19:53]Yeah, exactly.
[19:54]I hope so.
[19:55]I really hope so.
[19:56]Mom sent me a beautiful text late last night.
[19:59]Just.
[20:00]congratulating me and saying that she hopes that he is proud wherever he is.
[20:04]Oh, my gosh, that's so heartbreaking, but also hopeful.
[20:07]So I don't want to dwell on the negative,
[20:09]because not the negative, you know what I mean?
[20:11]The sadness, because your story is also one of complete resilience and overcoming
[20:17]and fighting for what's right, and now you've become an activist,
[20:21]and there you are with Obama.
[20:23]I mean, it's amazing.
[20:24]I mean, I know that was at the time, but you're on the news now all the time,
[20:28]and you're fighting, you're fighting the good fight.
[20:31]Like, so tell me about how you see your role now in the world,
[20:35]and you're sort of placed, you know, if that was a place for us,
[20:38]like what is the place for you?
[20:40]Yeah, I feel really honored to be able to do this work every single day.
[20:45]People ask me, you know, what's a typical day like,
[20:47]I'm now working at a quality floor at a full time,
[20:50]and I tell them I have the distinct honor of telling our stories,
[20:54]of making sure that every time LGBTQ people are in a conversation
[20:58]that we're at that table too, that our lived experiences are centered,
[21:02]they get to help people learn how to tell their stories in a compelling way,
[21:06]they get to help shape the way our state and sometimes the country are talking about
[21:10]both the queer community and, you know, the issue of gun violence,
[21:14]and I just feel really honored to be able to do that.
[21:17]I see my place in the world so much differently after Pulse than I did before,
[21:23]because before Pulse, it was really about, you know,
[21:27]finding my sort of lane and my sense of normal,
[21:31]the kind of normal that I believed people like us don't deserve,
[21:34]and we're never going to be afforded in the world,
[21:37]finding that sense of normal, and then just riding it off into retirement.
[21:41]And what happened in the wake of Pulse and discovering sort of this,
[21:46]you know, this new voice or purpose or strength,
[21:49]for me has unlocked a different kind of obligation that I have to the community,
[21:55]that it's not good enough for me to just live that sense of normal and ride it off into
[21:59]retirement, I have to reach back and give other people the next generation,
[22:03]an opportunity to experience that sense of normal too.
[22:06]So that for me feels like the place for me in the world is fighting day in and day out
[22:12]so that the next generation of me doesn't have to run away from home
[22:17]to find a sense of belonging, because home feels like where they belong to.
[22:21]And I feel really honored to be able to do that work every day.
[22:24]So funny, I mean, Florida has been in the news nonstop with all of it's not particularly generous.
[22:30]All of these, how are you reconciling that?
[22:33]Or do you think you're in the exact right place to deal with that?
[22:37]I mean, I feel, well, first of all, Florida has been my home for 15 years.
[22:41]Yeah.
[22:42]They're going to have to pry the white sandy beaches from my fingers,
[22:46]it's my Florida too.
[22:47]I live here.
[22:48]It's my home.
[22:49]And I tell people I moved to Barack Obama's Florida, not run to Santa's,
[22:52]Florida.
[22:53]And they're very different, right?
[22:54]It was a different time in 2008.
[22:56]It was a different vibe in the state of Florida.
[22:59]And things really are very challenging.
[23:02]But where else would I be?
[23:04]But on the front line, right?
[23:07]I couldn't imagine be, let's say, living in San Francisco or Los Angeles and watching from afar,
[23:13]what's happening to my chosen home and not be a part of fighting back and helping build a solution.
[23:20]So, you know, I would say number one, I think in the end, we're going to win the fight for LGBTQ
[23:26]civil rights.
[23:26]We're going to win the fight against gun violence because we're right.
[23:30]I also think that the right wing backlash we're experiencing in Florida is a lagging indicator
[23:34]of where society is.
[23:36]They're fighting so hard because they already lost the culture war and they're trying to
[23:40]scratch back whatever power they can have.
[23:43]But there's no putting the genie back in the bottle.
[23:45]There's no world where, you know, Gen Z or Gen Alpha don't have access to TikTok and don't know
[23:50]that queer people exist.
[23:51]It's just never going to happen.
[23:52]And so I think we're going to win.
[23:54]I think that is inevitable that that will win the fight for equality.
[23:58]The question is, how can we create moments of oasis and safety for people along the way
[24:03]as opponents to that equality do incredible amounts of damage?
[24:08]And that is the hard work, right?
[24:10]It's getting people access to the healthcare they need when it's being ripped away by the government.
[24:14]It's, you know, giving people access to classrooms that treat them with dignity and respect
[24:20]when there are people banning books left and right.
[24:22]That's the really hard work.
[24:24]But at the end of the day, I think we'll be successful.
[24:26]I think we'll win.
[24:27]And I think we can reimagine not just Florida for everyone.
[24:31]But I think we can reimagine a country that's inclusive of everyone too.
[24:35]Have you thought about running for office?
[24:37]Maybe we'll see.
[24:39]For now, we're going to sell books and then we'll see what comes next.
[24:45]Well, you have my vet.
[24:48]Oh my gosh, you're such a great speaker.
[24:50]That gives me hope, you know, really.
[24:52]Thank you.
[24:53]Exciting.
[24:53]Very exciting.
[24:54]And are you?
[24:55]I don't know.
[24:56]I feel like I can ask this because I know you from reading your book,
[24:58]but I probably shouldn't be praying.
[24:59]But like, are you in a relationship now?
[25:01]Do you feel like you're in a good place?
[25:03]Do you have somebody special?
[25:06]I don't.
[25:06]I'm not in a relationship.
[25:08]But I do have a beautiful chosen family.
[25:10]Many of whom, by the way, are connected to Drew in some way.
[25:14]So we may not have known each other.
[25:16]Before hand, I'm thinking of people like Sarah Grossman,
[25:19]who I note in the credits.
[25:22]Is that what you call it?
[25:22]Where is crediting people?
[25:23]Yeah, acknowledgements.
[25:24]There we go.
[25:25]So, yeah, Sarah is a friend that was really close with Drew in college.
[25:29]And then, you know, she lives in Denver.
[25:31]So we never got a chance to meet while he was around.
[25:33]But in the wake of the tragedy, she helped establish the Drew project in his honor.
[25:38]And we've become really close since then.
[25:40]So Drew's legacy continues to be the chosen family that surrounds me.
[25:45]I feel really honored to have them.
[25:47]They're a great support system.
[25:49]Maybe someone special comes along at some point.
[25:52]But for now, my chosen family is just perfect.
[25:54]That's awesome.
[25:55]That's really great.
[25:56]It's wonderful.
[25:57]Do you have any advice for aspiring authors now that you've written a memoir
[26:01]on top of everything else?
[26:03]Yeah, just right.
[26:05]That's the hardest part.
[26:06]I remember the elation when, you know, my publisher Little A said,
[26:11]yes, we'll buy the book.
[26:12]We want you to write it.
[26:13]We think it's going to be great.
[26:14]I had that moment of pure joy.
[26:17]And I called everybody and let them know.
[26:19]And then the panic said it.
[26:21]And I'm like, oh my god, I have to write a book.
[26:23]And I don't know how to write a book.
[26:24]So I should probably figure out how to do that.
[26:26]I called my friend Joy Reed.
[26:28]I called Chasten Buttigieg.
[26:30]And I started asking people who I knew had written a book.
[26:34]And can you teach me how to write a book?
[26:37]And I think the best piece of advice that came from all of them was just right.
[26:41]If you've been thinking that you have a story worth sharing,
[26:44]if you've been thinking that there's something out there you want to tell the world,
[26:47]just write it.
[26:48]You'll be surprised how many people will relate to the things that you have to share.
[26:54]Every time people hold something from the book and take away some little insight,
[27:00]I'm surprised that they found that part of the story the most relatable.
[27:04]And it's a good surprise.
[27:05]So if you're an aspiring author, if you have something to share with the world,
[27:09]I say just write it.
[27:11]The delay is my publisher too by the way.
[27:13]Yeah, that's awesome.
[27:15]Is your editor Carmen or do you have somebody?
[27:17]Is your department was on my original proposal call?
[27:21]And so she was sort of in the beginning of the process.
[27:23]But my editor is Selena James.
[27:25]Amazing.
[27:26]I've just been incredible.
[27:27]Yeah, they've been awesome.
[27:30]They've been so supportive.
[27:33]I couldn't say enough good things about my experience with them.
[27:36]Amazing. Brandon, thank you for talking to me.
[27:40]I'm so impressed.
[27:41]I'm so moved.
[27:43]I can't wait to watch what you do next.
[27:45]How can people who have read your book or heard this episode help you the most decide from,
[27:52]reading the book and following you?
[27:53]Is there something some cause like what can we do?
[27:58]Yeah, first of all, as you mentioned, just share the book.
[28:01]I think, you know, the more people that can read the story and relate to it
[28:05]and hopefully be inspired to find hope in the world right now,
[28:09]that's that's the most important thing.
[28:11]And then, you know, for me, the other important part is finding a cause, finding an organization,
[28:17]finding a lane to be an advocate for the things you're passionate about.
[28:23]So many people come to me and say,
[28:24]well, I don't know where to start or, you know, I need a roadmap.
[28:27]I need a to-do list to help me get started in my fight for advocacy.
[28:31]And the truth is you have everything you need right now.
[28:33]All you have to do is figure out what is the thing I'm most passionate about.
[28:37]How can I add value to the community around me and dive in,
[28:40]feet first, start volunteering.
[28:42]That's what I did.
[28:43]I started volunteering for queer organizations.
[28:45]I started volunteering for gun safety organizations.
[28:49]Just start volunteering, pitch in a few bucks if you can.
[28:52]Buy a t-shirt from your favorite organization and wear it around.
[28:56]Start going to local government meetings, you know,
[28:58]city council meetings and school board meetings, be involved in the community around you.
[29:03]And you'll find, once again, as soon as you dive in with both feet,
[29:07]that that's exactly where you were supposed to be, that your voices needed in that conversation,
[29:11]and that you can make immense amounts of change even just being one individual person.
[29:16]And so, I don't know what that organization is for you.
[29:19]I don't know what that causes for you, but whatever it is, dive in feet first.
[29:23]Amazing.
[29:24]By the way, do you know David Ambrose?
[29:26]That sounds really familiar.
[29:28]You have to meet him.
[29:29]You have to read his book.
[29:30]It's called a place called home.
[29:31]No, it's not, yeah, a place, something like, oh my gosh, this is so embarrassing.
[29:36]It was sort of like my favorite class here.
[29:38]Yeah.
[29:39]Well, anyway, I'm going to put you on email together.
[29:41]Yeah, please.
[29:42]You will love his book.
[29:43]There's a very similar scene as one we discussed earlier.
[29:46]He is now a big advocate.
[29:48]You have to know each other.
[29:50]He's awesome.
[29:50]Yeah, I would love that.
[29:51]I would love that.
[29:52]I would love that.
[29:52]Thank you.
[29:52]And touch.
[29:54]Yeah, place called home.
[29:54]I swear, that's what's called.
[29:55]Anyway, you two could do an event.
[29:57]If you ever come to LA and I have a bookstore in LA.
[30:00]He's he's out here. So I feel like the two of you should be in conversation at my bookstore. Would you have any I would love that. Oh, yeah, I would love that. Okay. Let's let's do that. Only make that happen. Okay. Amazing.
[30:11]Okay, Brandon. Have a great day. And thank you so much. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Okay. Bye bye. Bye.
[30:19]Thanks for listening to this episode of moms don't have time to read books. Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at zibi Owens and at moms don't have time to read books.
[30:27]Also sign up for my newsletter at zibi Owens.com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors on zoom every other week.
[30:34]Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan in fact, texture sound for the sound editing and thank you to morning moon productions for providing this fantastic intro and now trim music.