Elizabeth Castellano, SAVE WHAT'S LEFT
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[1:03]Elizabeth Castellana was the author of Save What's Left, a novel Elizabeth grew up in
[1:08]a beach town.
[1:09]She lives in New York.
[1:10]Save What's Left is her debut novel and it was a good morning America book club pick.
[1:14]Welcome Elizabeth.
[1:15]Thank you so much for coming on momstone.
[1:16]Have time to read books to discuss Save What's Left your debut novel.
[1:20]Thank you so much for having me.
[1:22]I'm so happy to be here.
[1:23]Oh my gosh.
[1:24]I was just saying before this started how much I love and have completely obsessed with
[1:29]your book.
[1:30]It's the funniest book I've ever read.
[1:33]It's so smart.
[1:34]It's so great.
[1:35]I read last night all these portions of it out loud to my husband who was like dying laughing
[1:40]with me.
[1:41]And the two of us, we just haven't laughed at our it was so great.
[1:43]Congratulations.
[1:44]Amazing.
[1:45]So nice.
[1:46]Thanks.
[1:47]No, I'm serious.
[1:48]First, just tell everybody what the book is about.
[1:49]But then I want to figure out like where you came from and I there's like nothing about
[1:52]you anywhere.
[1:53]Like where did you appear from to write this like perfect novel.
[1:56]So anyway, okay, so the book is really about what happens when we build a fantasy for ourselves
[2:03]and then it bumps up against reality.
[2:05]So for my main character, she finds herself at 60 years old in a position where she has
[2:10]to start fresh, get a new start.
[2:13]And so she decides to move to a beach town and she has this vision for a beach town and
[2:19]beach life that is, you know, built on what she sees in movies and in beach read books.
[2:25]And of course she gets here and she realizes it is anything but what she reads.
[2:29]The little house that she builds that she thinks is going to be her dream cottage is really
[2:33]a dilapated oyster shack.
[2:36]There's a giant construction project with a big mansion going up next door.
[2:39]Everyone in the town is fighting.
[2:41]So it's a small town with all the warts and problems and fighting that is anywhere just
[2:45]with a better view.
[2:47]And so it's basically her getting into escalating absurdity and trying to make this life
[2:52]happy for herself and she just digs deeper and deeper and gets herself in more and more
[2:57]trouble.
[2:58]Because causes more chaos and she makes just creates more issues for her.
[3:05]So that's really what it is.
[3:06]It's just kind of escalating problems in this beach town and sort of behind the scenes
[3:10]look at what's going on in a beach town.
[3:13]Wow.
[3:14]Well, wait.
[3:15]My first question is how, I was like, I swear, this is the same woman who I met at
[3:20]the luncheon.
[3:21]But like, she's writing so well from a position from the point of view of a slightly
[3:25]older one.
[3:26]way or 60 years old.
[3:27]Do you know what I mean?
[3:28]Like this woman Kathleen is at a completely different point in her life, right?
[3:32]So like, how did you even do this?
[3:34]Like tell me about the whole thing.
[3:36]Yeah, I just feel like a 60 year old.
[3:38]I think that's it.
[3:40]I've always sort of been surrounded by older people.
[3:44]I'm the youngest and a big family.
[3:46]And so I've always just been around older people.
[3:50]But yeah, I come from the small town and I always thought it was funny.
[3:54]I always thought that people here were funny.
[3:56]And I think that's funny in a lot of small towns because you just have to deal with each
[3:59]other.
[4:00]You just have to, you know, it's one of those places where, well, you know, you're in
[4:05]it.
[4:06]You have to get along somehow.
[4:07]And that's true, I guess, universally.
[4:09]If you're in a condo, if you're in a city, if you're living with anybody, you have to
[4:12]find ways and everybody has sort of arguments.
[4:14]But yeah, I grew up here.
[4:16]I went to Little Red School house that had, but where is where is here on the North
[4:22]Fork of Long Island?
[4:23]Okay, I thought so.
[4:24]Okay.
[4:25]Yeah.
[4:26]So Little Red School house, it had one point we had nine kids, grades K through six.
[4:29]And so that's, you know, we had K through three in one room and four through six and the
[4:34]other.
[4:35]And it was sort of an idyllic childhood, but odd, you know, and when you're in a school
[4:39]with that many kids, you have to be friends with everybody.
[4:42]You know, everyone's going to your birthday party, everyone's friends.
[4:44]So it is that sort of, you have to find a way, you know, to be friends and to get along.
[4:49]even if you're fighting at lunch, you have to make up by the end of the day because this
[4:52]is all you have.
[4:53]You know, these are your friends.
[4:55]And so that I think plays into it a big part, even in this little community, even though
[5:01]they're disagreements in this little fictional town, they're, they're, they're there
[5:06]for each other.
[5:07]If there's any issue, if anyone gets hurt, if anyone has any problem, they're always there
[5:10]for each other.
[5:11]So that's how I love it.
[5:13]I know in the book, you had talked about how this was on the way out to Long Island and
[5:17]has sometimes people just called it West.
[5:19]And so I was trying to figure out is this West Hampton, like, if she had quack, because
[5:22]I didn't recognize any of the streets or the communities, and I was getting Google, like,
[5:26]are these actual places or did you make them up?
[5:28]Are these real places or did you make them up?
[5:30]I made them up.
[5:31]Yeah.
[5:32]Yeah.
[5:33]Yeah.
[5:34]Like any, I mean, it's sort of meant to be any small beach town.
[5:36]Yeah.
[5:37]Yeah.
[5:38]And yeah.
[5:39]So there's something a little similar happened to me with a McMansion, and I, you know, dipped my
[5:43]toe into sort of town politics and just went to a couple of meetings.
[5:48]And I just, once I found out what was going on, I just thought it was so funny.
[5:53]I just thought, you know, this is, and people probably don't know that this is going
[5:57]on that, you know, there's the side, there's the beach read side where everyone is, you
[6:02]know, this is a beach read, really, with like no kisses, no sunsets, you know, locked in
[6:07]windowless rooms, arguing about, you know, where the beach sticker goes, should it go on
[6:10]the front bumper or the beer bumper, you know.
[6:13]That's, that's the other side of beach life is all these conversations.
[6:18]So do you still live in the north, do you still live in the same town?
[6:20]So I'm here.
[6:21]I'm here for now, but, you know, looking to make a move after the book tour and everything,
[6:27]but while I'm doing this, I thought, be good to be here.
[6:31]Awesome.
[6:32]Yeah.
[6:33]What can you explain your life to me?
[6:35]So you grew up in the Little Red School house, in Little Red School house, and what happened?
[6:39]So then I went to the bigger school, which had about 80 kids in the grade, and I went
[6:45]to Bates College in Maine.
[6:47]I studied theater, and I wanted to work in television.
[6:52]I thought I just want to work at NBC, and I want to work at 30 Rock and be like Liz
[6:57]Lemon.
[6:58]And I just thought that'd be great, and I'll get to go into that building, and they just
[7:02]wouldn't have me.
[7:04]And so I started writing, I've always sort of been writing, and then the story sort
[7:08]of fell into my lap, that I just thought this is probably something that hasn't been
[7:13]done, and hasn't been looked at.
[7:15]And it's just, I thought it was just a funny, funny idea to show the other side of beach
[7:20]town life.
[7:21]So that's really, you know, that's, so you just wrote it.
[7:25]You just like sat down, like, and just wrote the whole thing.
[7:27]Yeah, I mean, one other things before that didn't go, and this was the idea that I was
[7:32]like, this is probably correct.
[7:34]This is probably the idea.
[7:36]So yeah, that's what I've been doing for the last, you know, a couple of years is working
[7:41]on this.
[7:42]Wow.
[7:43]Wait, so, because I love hearing stories of like, this was rejected, and then I tried
[7:46]this, and then this, so like, give me one of those inspiring stories.
[7:50]Like, did you write an entire other novel, or what happened?
[7:53]I wrote an entire novel about a 22-year-old who couldn't find a job, very on-topic.
[8:02]And so that, a lot of people were a little interested, but, you know, I guess nobody really
[8:07]wants to hear about a 22-year-old, I can't get a job, which I understand now, fascinating
[8:11]to me.
[8:12]I wrote a couple of other things.
[8:15]I tried writing a little middle grade, because I love children's literature.
[8:19]And so then I wrote this, and my main agent, my top pick for an agent, got back to me,
[8:27]and she called me and said, you know, gave me some direction and said, okay, this is,
[8:32]what's working, and this is my idea.
[8:35]And it was really, that was all the difference, was like this 20-minute phone call with
[8:38]this agent that was willing to speak to me and say, you know, here's an idea, and here's
[8:45]where, you know, here's where you're going wrong, here's where you need to go.
[8:48]And that was like, you know, changed everything really for me.
[8:51]And so then I went back, I changed it, I edited it.
[8:54]It was always about the beach town, it was always this character, and it was always
[8:57]to say, what's left, but it needed, you know, parts taken out and things.
[9:02]And so then she became my agent, and we sold it, and it was just really, you know, when
[9:06]you hear nothing back, it's so hard, when agents don't write back or tell you anything.
[9:11]And so I didn't know anybody in publishing or I've never been to a writer's conference.
[9:16]Well, I went to one, I went when I was 16, I went to Alice Hoffman has a little writing
[9:22]program at a Delphi, and I went to that when I was 16 years old and met her, and I just
[9:26]thought she was great.
[9:28]That was like a big moment for me that I was, you know, to meet a real author and somebody
[9:32]that I heard so much.
[9:34]Yeah, so that was the big thing was I was having somebody say, okay, here's what's going
[9:40]on.
[9:41]And that really changed everything.
[9:43]I actually just had lunch with Suzanne Gluck, is that who you were talking about?
[9:47]Because I read that in your acknowledgements, because I went to a lunch for Jean Quack,
[9:51]who wrote The Left Everyone Now is coming out, I love Jean, and I don't know, we've been
[9:56]new friends for a couple of years.
[9:57]Anyway, so they had like a little lunch in France.
[10:00]And I got to know her.
[10:01]And she's so nice.
[10:02]Yeah.
[10:03]Well, I heard her speak.
[10:04]I haven't met her.
[10:05]But I've heard her speak.
[10:06]She has some fascinating story.
[10:07]Yeah.
[10:08]Yeah.
[10:09]Oh, but I met Suzanne was also really good.
[10:10]Yeah.
[10:11]I mean, she was funny and funny too.
[10:12]I could totally, you know, so then is great.
[10:15]She is like the dream dream agent.
[10:17]I can't believe she's my agent.
[10:19]It's so cool.
[10:20]It's awesome.
[10:21]So yeah, so we bond over beach town, beach town life.
[10:25]Yeah.
[10:26]Can I just read a couple of parts that I thought were so funny.
[10:28]I kept like texting myself as I read.
[10:30]Wait, let's see if I can find them fast enough.
[10:33]Let's see.
[10:34]You said, oh, this one killed me.
[10:37]You were like, things like this happened to me.
[10:39]I think I have one of those trustworthy faces and says,
[10:41]I'll listen to anything, which is true.
[10:43]I will one time Tom and I were waiting for the cross town bust on
[10:46]E 79th Street.
[10:47]When a woman with a cast on her walked over to me and asked if I could
[10:50]please ever fly.
[10:52]Tom was horrified.
[10:53]I don't I kneeled down without hesitation.
[10:57]Oh, my God, you're so funny.
[10:58]That is that happened.
[11:00]Did that?
[11:01]That happened.
[11:02]And I was just like, sure.
[11:03]Woman with a cast on her arm.
[11:04]She had all these bent.
[11:05]So I am so sorry.
[11:07]Can you please help me?
[11:09]And I was like, absolutely.
[11:11]And so this is I constantly get this.
[11:14]I am the person that people go to for tell anything.
[11:17]Like someone sits down.
[11:18]I get their whole life story.
[11:19]Oh my gosh.
[11:20]But that happened.
[11:21]I also love this one.
[11:24]You said I could have had an exciting life.
[11:26]But I blew it.
[11:27]I had a boyfriend in college.
[11:28]He was smart and funny.
[11:29]And could tell a story.
[11:30]And he liked me.
[11:31]The only problem was that sometimes not all the time.
[11:33]Sometimes he'd tell me things.
[11:34]Like he was adding thoughts.
[11:36]That'll actually give me the bathtub.
[11:38]Or pushing me out to rain flat words.
[11:41]He assured me that he did not want to do these things.
[11:43]Just that he was thinking about them a lot.
[11:48]Oh, my God.
[11:49]So funny.
[11:50]Happened to me.
[11:51]But that happened to you.
[11:52]I didn't happen to me.
[11:53]But that is the thing with OCD.
[11:55]These intrusive thoughts.
[11:56]And you know, that's people don't even know that.
[11:58]But it's just like they're the most harmless people.
[12:01]It's just intrusive thoughts.
[12:03]But I did Tom, the husband in the story, leaves Kathleen.
[12:07]The main character.
[12:08]And says he's had a paradigm shift.
[12:10]Yes.
[12:11]She was also so funny.
[12:12]And so that's my first boyfriend.
[12:14]That's how he broke up with me.
[12:15]Oh my gosh.
[12:16]He had a paradigm.
[12:17]I was 16.
[12:18]He said I've had a paradigm shift.
[12:19]I was like, I see.
[12:22]And then I went with my friends.
[12:24]And it was like, what is a paradigm shift?
[12:26]Because he's had one.
[12:27]So what it is.
[12:29]But it doesn't sound good for me.
[12:32]Oh my gosh.
[12:34]And honestly, the section with the Albania comment.
[12:39]I was kind of dying.
[12:40]I was just dying.
[12:41]Laughing.
[12:42]So hard.
[12:43]All of it.
[12:44]I mean, all of it.
[12:45]So funny.
[12:46]Ending is so perfect.
[12:47]The whole thing was like the perfect package.
[12:48]Start to finish.
[12:49]I couldn't believe him.
[12:50]I just couldn't.
[12:51]You just, it was just so excited.
[12:53]Anyway.
[12:54]So nice things.
[12:55]Yeah.
[12:56]It's wild.
[12:57]It was a wild story.
[12:58]And these towns, I think everybody has that sort of universal
[13:01]thing of having a frustration or seeing a problem and thinking,
[13:06]well, I can change this.
[13:07]I can do something about this.
[13:09]This seems like a probable problem.
[13:11]And then you realize I can't change it.
[13:13]And you think you have power.
[13:14]And you find out your powerless.
[13:16]And that can go for really any problem.
[13:18]It's just Kathleen, my character.
[13:21]It just doesn't know when to stop.
[13:24]She set up.
[13:25]She keeps going and digging herself to the point that, you know,
[13:30]she lands in the hospital, being poisoned by a septic tank.
[13:33]I don't need.
[13:36]I don't need to laugh.
[13:38]Really great.
[13:39]Anyway.
[13:40]It's just so funny.
[13:41]It's just so funny.
[13:42]So are you working on a new book?
[13:44]I hope you are because I have to read now everything you write.
[13:47]I'm working on new books, early stages, working progress.
[13:50]I'm going to do a younger character, which I'm finding more difficult,
[13:53]which is ridiculous.
[13:55]So right now, not sure.
[13:57]It's got like an Ireland element right now, but could change.
[14:00]So yeah, something don't really have much divulge at the moment,
[14:05]but working on, yeah.
[14:07]I'm delighted.
[14:08]Yeah.
[14:09]That's great.
[14:10]Yeah.
[14:11]I mean, the point of view, I know I already mentioned this,
[14:13]this sort of sadness over what Kathleen has not been able to live,
[14:18]or even actually like ended up in Kansas City for so long life.
[14:22]It's the notion that like life is passing us all by.
[14:24]Like we don't necessarily have the grand plan,
[14:27]things just happen and you fall into these situations.
[14:30]And sometimes it just takes like the biggest thing to be able to regroup.
[14:34]And then what do you do when that happens?
[14:37]I feel like I don't know.
[14:39]It's just so it's so relatable, but also inspiring that you can just like,
[14:42]you know, perhaps you shouldn't buy us. I don't see it.
[14:45]But I totally understand that too.
[14:47]So it works out in the end.
[14:49]Yeah.
[14:50]Yeah. And she has sort of a new chapter and sees things more clearly.
[14:55]Yeah. I mean, Kansas City.
[14:57]I never really met anyone from Kansas City.
[15:00]And now I meet them all the time.
[15:03]It's like I'm from Kansas, but that was sort of my,
[15:07]I was like, I couldn't get a job in New York.
[15:09]When everywhere I just was like, I mean, I applied to everything.
[15:13]I applied to like give tours of cemeteries.
[15:16]I was a film extra for why still I still get texts that are like,
[15:21]you have like a zombie outfit and can you do this at 3 a.m.
[15:26]in this, you know, the end of the factory.
[15:29]So I'm still on that chain.
[15:31]So I did a little of everything.
[15:32]And I always thought like, well, you know,
[15:34]I kept threatening everybody really.
[15:36]I'm going to move to Kansas City.
[15:38]And I'm going to go work at Hallmark.
[15:40]And, you know, okay, at design.
[15:42]And I'm probably not good enough to do the A holidays.
[15:45]Yeah, I love to have that at the back of the field.
[15:48]I could probably get a job doing the B holidays that like nobody really sends cards for.
[15:52]And so I thought like that's what I'm going to do.
[15:55]And then it was really me imagining like what would I be like in 30 years.
[15:59]If I did that.
[16:00]If I, if I did move to Kansas City and just didn't pursue,
[16:04]you know, what I wanted to pursue and just went with the, the safer option.
[16:08]Not that Hallmark would have me.
[16:10]I'm sure they would have also said no, thank you.
[16:12]So that was it.
[16:13]It was that me sort of imagining what would it be like to just say,
[16:18]like put everything on hold.
[16:20]And could you just, would it just continue when you just stay there.
[16:24]And so that's sort of what happens to my character.
[16:27]She's, she stays and then sort of wakes up one day.
[16:30]And her husband is, you know, having a paradigm shift and he's leaving on a world cruise on the Queen Mary.
[16:37]And, and so she's like, OK, well, what do I want?
[16:40]And, and of course, the beach towns are sold as just magic.
[16:45]You know, you'll move to a beach town and you're going to meet a handsome man and you'll have friends and you're going to entertain.
[16:51]And she doesn't expect to be locked in your zoning board meetings.
[16:56]Even, even when she goes off on this whole thing about the private beach.
[17:00]And I like, yes, what? There are no private beaches.
[17:03]It's just a beach. There are lots of people there.
[17:05]These people with the private beaches.
[17:07]Yeah.
[17:08]Yeah.
[17:09]Oh my gosh, you're observational humor though.
[17:12]I mean, it doesn't have to be about beach towns.
[17:14]You're obviously just like hilarious.
[17:16]So are you writing now?
[17:17]Like I want more, do you do essays or short stories or like,
[17:21]are you going to start contributing more like shorter form as you write another novel?
[17:25]I never really thought I could write a novel.
[17:27]I never thought, you know, I did like a little column when I was in high school.
[17:31]It was sort of a humor column, 500 words.
[17:33]And I was like, I'm going to max out at 500 words.
[17:35]That's all I could do.
[17:36]And yeah.
[17:37]So I like to do shorter things.
[17:39]I think this I'm more like an essay person.
[17:42]So I was.
[17:43]But the novel seemed like the right way to do this story.
[17:47]Yeah.
[17:48]So what about translating this to film?
[17:50]Is that in the works?
[17:52]Some of the works yet.
[17:53]I guess there's feelers out.
[17:54]I'd love that because that was my whole.
[17:56]I just I love I love any kind of like form of storytelling really.
[17:59]I love film.
[18:00]I love TV.
[18:01]I love books.
[18:02]You know, I always say that I probably got a lot of humor from like,
[18:05]I when I was a little like very little kid.
[18:07]I couldn't sleep well and I hated being alone at night.
[18:10]I just like hated it.
[18:12]And so eventually my mom was like, aren't going to put the TV in your room.
[18:15]So that's probably, you know, I invented screen time problems.
[18:19]I had my, you know, VHS as of Disney movies.
[18:23]And then when I was like eight or nine, I had all these DVD sets of sitcoms.
[18:28]Just everybody loves Raymond and Seinfeld and all of these.
[18:32]And I would just fall asleep to nations every night and just for years and years.
[18:37]And so I'm like, that's probably just like us.
[18:39]Moses had this like sitcom quality to me and just got everybody loves Raymond.
[18:44]Constantly.
[18:47]Just sleeping through.
[18:48]That's that probably caused brain damage.
[18:50]But so yeah, there's, I'm always been big fan of TV and film.
[18:55]What are the launch plans for the book?
[18:57]So we're doing a lot.
[18:58]I mean, it's great because it got a lot of beach town events.
[19:01]So that's why.
[19:02]Yeah.
[19:03]So I'm doing something to keep cod and the Jersey Shore being the Hamptons.
[19:08]So.
[19:09]I'm going to be in the Hamptons, you know, I can check your schedule.
[19:15]So I want to say the 14th.
[19:18]Oh, good.
[19:19]Okay.
[19:20]Like the, that's a look.
[19:21]All right.
[19:22]Well, we'll, we'll connect on it later.
[19:23]So fun.
[19:24]And now, of course you'll come to LA and do an event.
[19:26]Yeah.
[19:27]I've never been to LA.
[19:29]I've been to San Francisco.
[19:30]Yeah.
[19:31]Yeah.
[19:32]Yeah.
[19:33]Yeah.
[19:34]It's sort of like the ultimate beach town.
[19:35]Like the whole thing is like one big.
[19:37]You can move out there for like the same reason.
[19:39]Except it's like enormous city.
[19:40]So.
[19:41]July 7th.
[19:42]July 7th.
[19:43]Okay.
[19:44]Doesn't work for me.
[19:45]But that's okay.
[19:47]When you read what are some of your, who are some of your favorite authors?
[19:50]Do you like to read humor?
[19:52]Like what's your go to?
[19:53]I do like to read humor.
[19:54]I love Nora Ephron.
[19:55]I always love reading her essays.
[19:57]I like Salinger.
[19:59]I love memoir.
[20:00]first, I love, I guess that's because I always write in first person too. So I love that kind of thing real guilty pleasure for reading like musicians memoirs love, love doing that. So yeah, I'm reading what did I read now read trust.
[20:15]Thought that was great and now I'm reading the plot. But yeah, and so I'm kind of all over the place. I like to read humor. I like Calvin trilling. I think is so funny. He's a book.
[20:26]Tepper isn't going out. That's from like the 90s. That's better than I. Yep, in New York, who's just sits in his car and won't leave the parking space.
[20:35]That's like right up my alley, you know, somebody's with a very small problem that creates and so he becomes like a folk hero.
[20:42]So I love those books that are like little moments and a character just falling, you know, man in a hole, like gets into a situation and how do they get out of it. So I'm a real sucker for that.
[20:53]Did you watch? Did you watch in the 80s the movie called the Money Pit? No, I don't think so. Oh my god, you have to go watch it. I mean, there must be streaming somewhere. I don't even know what happens to movies anymore, but it was with Sally Field and Tom Hanks, I think, not Sally Field. Shelly Long.
[21:08]I'm older than you, but anyway, she was in cheers back in the day and they buy this house that they think is beautiful and decided to fix it up and it like destroys everything is wrong.
[21:19]And that's a lot of like situational comedy, but like, you know, it's so funny. I should watch it again. Now that I've actually like renovated a house as grown up, but you know, they like walk through and sort of like fall through and Tom Hanks is at one point stuck in his like Oriental rug.
[21:31]Like hanging down for the floor below, but it's it's I think you'd like it. But yeah, man, I like funny farms and other. Yeah, yeah, funny fun. Yeah. Do you read her my bomb back ever? She's really funny. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She's so funny more more about pair of tickets of housework stuff.
[21:49]Yeah. So yeah, so I read a little bit of everything. Have you reconnected now with Alice Hoffman to happen. I haven't. I haven't. I have her. She signed a book for me. Good luck with your writing. It meant like so much to me.
[22:00]Oh, my gosh, I email with it. I mean, I can put you in touch. If you want, okay, I'll put you in touch. Yeah. So great. So that was that was fun. I it was mostly like poetry driven that little and you know, I'm not a poet.
[22:14]And so we were sitting around and we had to like be in a circle and like, okay, just like let's write a quick poem in 15 minutes.
[22:22]And so I wrote a poem about like a sailboat, you know, something, something very like, you know, and everybody else got up and like dug up trauma, you know, it's like and I, you know, the drugs and this and like so, and so I was like furiously, you know, trying to like add like a sinking of the sailboat or some drowning to keep. I was like, okay, I can't compete with this. I wrote a poem that a sailboat. It's not working. Oh, yeah.
[22:51]So that was that experience, but it was great. It was so fun. It was so great to meet Alice. Yeah.
[22:58]Okay. Do you have any advice for aspiring authors? Do we have any advice? I think probably, I mean, this is like the constant advice, but to writing your own voice and not follow the trends. I did that for a while trying to figure out like, oh, well, what, what will people want and what, what, you know, does the publishing industry want and it turned out, you know, what my perspective was the thing that worked.
[23:20]And the thing that I thought was funny. And so it really was sticking to my view. And so I think that's important to find your perspective and what you can bring that's different than what other people can bring.
[23:32]So I think that's that's one thing that's kind of.
[23:36]In said before, but I didn't think what else. That was good. Yeah. That's that's kind of a, that's the big, the big thing is to just kind of trust what you think is good or interesting and that that really will work more than just going with, well, this person wrote this and that works.
[23:58]So I thought this was funny. I thought that's someone else will think it's funny.
[24:02]And that that's eventually what worked. I wish I came to that conclusion earlier, but, but maybe this had to happen, you know, maybe it I had to wait.
[24:09]I think I also had to get older.
[24:11]You know, I've just kind of been the same since I've been in high school with the same same kind of writing voice, but I think I just had to get a little more mature perspective.
[24:20]And it was that it's just time. It's just the way you see things also. You just need to have some life experiences to go off of.
[24:29]Well, bravo to you. Save what's left. So great. So funny. I'm such a huge fan anyway.
[24:36]Thank you.
[24:38]Thanks so much and I'll follow up about the other stuff on email.
[24:42]Alright, great. Thanks so much to be so good to be here. Bye. Bye.
[24:47]Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[24:51]Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at zebi Owens and at Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[24:56]Also sign up for my newsletter at zebi Owens.com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week.
[25:03]Thank you so much to Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound for the Sound Editing.
[25:07]And thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and outro music.