Natalie Portman, NATALIE PORTMAN'S FABLES

[1:25]Zibby Owens: Hi. I'm Zibby Owens, and you're listening to moms don't have time to read books. This thirty minute podcast features a new author interviewed by me every single day, three hundred and sixty five days a year for about thirty minutes. Am also the publisher for Zippy Books, which publishes 12 books a year in fiction and memoir. Our books are already out now. You can check it out on zippybooks.com. And we have a magazine called Zippy Mag where we have lots of wonderful essays and lifestyle features. That's at zippymag.com. We have classes at zippyclasses.com. And I recently opened a bookstore in LA called Zippy's Bookshop at 1113 Montana Avenue at 11th Street in Santa Monica. I hope that you are able to enjoy some of our other offerings, but this here podcast is the basis of all of it and started in 2018. And no matter what I do, this is basically my favorite thing. Enjoy. I'm re releasing my episode with Natalie Portman today. For anyone who may have missed this episode, it was such a dream of mine to get to interview Natalie, who I have idolized for a long time. And she really did not disappoint. It was wonderful talking to her about motherhood and life and all the great things. So I really hope you enjoy listening to us chitchat. Oh my gosh. I had the best time interviewing Natalie Portman, who I have been a fan of for as long as I can remember. She is one of my favorite actresses of all time. And now she wrote a children's book, and it was just beyond a thrill to interview her. And she was so real and awesome. And I just loved it. Natalie Portman, born in Jerusalem. Natalie Portman is a graduate of Harvard University. She's an Academy Award winning actress, director, producer and activist whose credits include Black Swan, Jackie and the upcoming Marvel movie Thor four: Love and Thunder. What you may not know is that Natalie fluently speaks six languages, English, Hebrew, Spanish, French, German, and Japanese, and was also a trained ballet dancer explaining her brilliant work in Black Swan. Natalie's debut children's picture book, Natalie Portman's Fables, is a modern take on timeless life lessons told through insightful retellings of classic stories like the tortoise and the hare, the three little pigs, and country mouse and city mouse. My kid's favorite, by the way, was the three little pigs in case you were wondering. A lifelong fan of books, Natalie runs her own book club and shares her favorite reads on her Instagram feed using the hashtag what nat reads. Welcome, Natalie. Thank you so much for coming on moms don't have time to read books. Thank you so much for having me. Okay. I read Fables to my kids. They were obsessed. They loved it. And I don't say that all the time. I have lots of children's books and sometimes, you know, your kids just like relate to ones or they don't. And my daughter was like, you're talking to the woman who wrote this new Three Little Pigs? So they thought that was the coolest. Oh, I appreciate that so much. Thank you. So what inspired you to write fables to reimagine some of these classic fairy tales from our youth and do them over. What was that about? Well,

[4:31]Natalie Portman: I was reading books to my kids and I have a boy and a girl. And I realized that, first of all, for my girl, the kinds of presents she would get, the kind of books that were given to her were were often like feminist kind of baby books. And I was like, why didn't my son get any of these? You know, like, no one I was like, the boys needed as much as the girls. So I felt like, oh, I want something that's going to be everyone will read. And the classic books that I had been reading both of them, of course, I started noticing that all of the characters were predominantly were male. And so I thought, oh, my goodness. Well, the books that both of them are reading are telling them to prioritize male character stories over other stories. And so I thought, what if I took some of these classics and just made it more reflective of the world, you know, where there's lots of genders in the animal kingdom and let the stories that are still morally resonant, you know, the morals that really resonate today still, like the tortoise and the hare and the three little pigs and the country mouse and the city mouse, those could still hold up and even have new meaning in today's world.

[5:49]Zibby Owens: So now the bad guys are actually bad women. Is that really a good message? I don't know. The wolf is a woman. Are we happy to be including her in our clan here? What do you think?

[6:00]Natalie Portman: I think that the more women are seen as human and capable of anything, capable of being good or bad, capable of being smart or not smart or strong or lazy, like the more possibility women have to just be human and be seen as human first and judged by their character, their virtue, their accomplishments, not by their gender, that's where we reach equality. So, of course, I mean, it's like the RBG quote of like putting women on a pedestal is just another kind of cage paraphrasing. Of course, that's not the exact exact quote. But, you know, when people say, oh, women are much better than men or that's that's another harmful stereotype, even like masquerading

[6:44]Zibby Owens: as a compliment. Very true. I feel like throughout your Instagram, you've done such a good job of trying to highlight all different types of women in all different areas and talking about the things that are really important, like everything from Serena Williams, and why are there not as many women tennis matches per day than men's tennis matches to different political candidates to homeschooling, everything. You're just like digging deeper and deeper into every industry. Like it's not even it's not about authors. It's about like really critical thinkers. Tell me about how you started doing this whole interview series as well. Well, I just started I mean, it's really I've just been led by curiosity,

[7:25]Natalie Portman: I guess. And in the things I'm interested in, I thought if I have this way of talking to people directly, then I might as well talk about what I'm curious about, learn things and share what I what I'm learning or the people I'm lucky enough to meet. And so whether it's about food, which is super interesting to me and obviously, of course, the environmental impact of food is really interesting, but making it delicious and fun at the same time, Or whether it's writers because I love reading and it's such a great opportunity to get to discuss books with writers after you read them. It's like the coolest opportunity. Or activists from whom I feel like one, the big change for me on going on social media was like it opened up my understanding of the world in such a new way. I was exposed to so many incredible people doing so much really like world changing, world bettering work. So that's been really wonderful too as an opportunity. And yeah, it's been really interesting. I feel like social media obviously gets a bad rep, but I feel like I've met people from all over the world. Like, can talk to an author in Nigeria about how they're handling COVID and I can talk to someone in LA. Like,

[8:42]Zibby Owens: are no barriers anymore and you can connect with people anywhere. It's really I think it's one of the biggest perks. So, yeah. Yeah. It's

[8:51]Natalie Portman: all how it's used, it seems. And also it is, of course, it can be very addictive. It can be very like, you know, living in a virtual state as opposed to like the real life state. But I think, if you're able to use it in moderation, it certainly is an incredible portal into

[9:09]Zibby Owens: so many different places we wouldn't normally have access to. And back to your cooking, by the way, because now I'm feeling totally shamed. Like not only do you have like your whole professional life, but now and all these great, you know, activist thought leadership type interviews. And you're like cooking all these amazing foods too. Like, my husband and that's fine. I'm like, masa lasagna. That looks amazing.

[9:33]Natalie Portman: Oh, my god. You're so sweet. But please, not at all. Like, my husband is really the cook in the house. He really cooks well. And I'm kind of I'm very amateur, but, like, I really like it. But I think that for me, why I like sharing it is because I'm not very skilled. So I know if I can do it, like anyone can do it. And I'm usually doing it in, like, fifteen minutes, like, holding a child in my hand. So I'm like, okay. Like, this recipe, you can do. Like, any if I can do it, you can do it. Like, it's not complicated. And I feel like those are the kind of mom things we need to share with each other because, that's how we get by. It's those tips that we spread from

[10:16]Zibby Owens: mom to mom. It's true. The whole whisper culture of this is how we do it. Yes. I'm upheld by comments like those and little tips. The messages in fables though go sort of beyond typical kids books, I would say typical, like you have so many things. And I feel like, I don't know if you intentionally put in like all your values and just like shove them in a little children's book. If you like started with the values and like, how can I fit these in? Oh, wait, oh, wait a minute. But there were so many things like, see, you don't need all that stuff. True friends are more than enough. And you have all these things like sometimes more isn't better. A bragger cannot persevere. A life lived attentively is the completest. To have strong foundations, you cannot be lazy. Waking up early is an energy booster. You wanna have friends who will stand by your side. Like, these could be I could be like reading a quote book, you know, at the checkout line with like, you know, little flowers or something. But instead, they're interspersed in the book. It's it's like very clever how you did it. Yeah. That's really nice. Well, I think, you know, when you have a clear audience and here it was like for my children, like I was like, what do I want to give them in tangible form of like what I think is important?

[11:29]Natalie Portman: And so, I mean, it's not all in there, but certainly there's a lot that I care about that I wanted to give to them. Secondly, I find that reading books to kids, it's kind of the only time I read books over and over and over again where I'll read because my kids both have had favorites over the years. And they make me read a book 100 times in a row. And so it really gets into you. And as a parent, like you kind of want that to be meaningful. And so there are certain things I feel like I even wrote for myself, like in the tortoise and the hare that was like honeymoon slowly. But it is the sweetest. A life lived attentively is the completest because it's like the attention. It's so noisy. It's so busy. You're running around all the time. Then, like, you know that when you really pay attention, when you really focus, when you really spend time, when you take things slowly is like a true expression of love and meaning. Like, that's where you're like most fulfillment. And so it felt like both for them and also for myself, I was like, what do I need to remember? And also, do I want to imbue in my children?

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[15:29]Zibby Owens: And how did so I know in the back of the book, you included a portrait that your mom had done of you and your brother's kids. I think it's so sweet and you have this whole big shout out to my her. Kids. Oh, that's your kids. Oh my gosh. My son and my daughter that she drew. Aw, so sweet. So tell me about like how did like what did she do right? What do you think like she did in her parenting to you that gave you the values that you're now passing on to your kids? Or maybe not, maybe it's like a reaction against, but She's

[15:58]Natalie Portman: just the most attentive and the most focused with kids and the most like, I mean, she was like that with me and I'm an only child. And then she's like that with my children now. Like, you know, you couldn't even imagine, like, I feel like I'm constantly running through lists of stuff that I have to do and, like, trying to, like, fold laundry and cook dinner and, like, get the kids homework, like, done at the same time, you know, like, I mean, not get their homework. Can imagine. I can imagine. Yes. Doing it. I mean, him. I only have one kid doing homework right now. He's my little one is in preschool. But really, it's definitely like I feel so scattered as a mother. Like, I feel like that's like the the the central characteristic. And my mother, I always felt that she was just so focused and present and attentive. And like, yeah, so I try and conjure her energy, which I don't have. I'm more

[17:04]Zibby Owens: all over the place. Yeah. I'm the same way. And sometimes even when I'm with my mom, like, she'll be, you know, on her phone or something. And I'm like, I feel so hurt. It's so silly. Right? I'm like 44 years old. And I'm like, but we only had like an hour together. Why are you on your phone? Like, what are you doing? What is so important? And I think it's the same thing. It's like this, this like, let someone occupy 100% of what you're doing. Right? And that's what like great conversation is about. Right? You just pay attention and that's I don't know. There's just nothing like it. And when you don't feel like you're necessarily getting that and I try to remind myself of that when I'm with my kids, like how do I feel when my mom seems distracted and here I am like, do do do do do do. So. Absolutely.

[17:45]Natalie Portman: Yeah. I mean, my husband always says it to me that like the phone, these like smartphones were supposed to make our lives like so we could have more free time because, you know, you could like kind of be portable and like whatever. But then instead it just makes us like work all the time. It makes us like half working all the time, half on our phones all the time, half not present all the time. So it's really I think it's like kind of the one of the biggest challenges of modern parenthood among the other you know 7,000 things.

[18:16]Zibby Owens: Let's pick. Every so often I'm like maybe I'll just try to email on a computer today like let's see how that works. It's actually really good. I've I've done that a few times where I've taken breaks and just take an email off of my phone and it actually makes a huge difference. Yeah. You're cute. You can be so much more productive on a computer with like an hour than all day long. These like little dribble, drabbles of emails that But never not that I will change my behavior, but, you know. And tell me about this new LA women's soccer team. What is that about? That's so awesome.

[18:49]Natalie Portman: Yeah, we're so excited. So Angel City Football Club is our official name and we're launching in 2022. That's when we'll start playing games. And it's just really thrilling to bring women's soccer to LA. There's two men's soccer teams and we have such incredible players in this country. We have like really the best players in the world and the most popular sport in the world. And it's super exciting to get to celebrate them and amplify their virtuosity because they're extraordinary. So it's really fun. It's an incredible group of people doing it. It's Alexis Ohanian and Serena Williams and a bunch of actress friends I adore. Jess Chastain, America Ferrera, Eva Longoria, Uzua Duba, just countless others. And it's been an end, sports legends like Billie Jean King and Lindsey Vonn and 14 former women's national team players like Mia Hamm and Julie Faudi and Abby Wambach. It's just like insane,

[19:57]Zibby Owens: insane group of people. It's so exciting. So you all like get a box and you can hang out every game, you know? That's Get how I get it

[20:05]Natalie Portman: through this pandemic and then

[20:11]Zibby Owens: Oh my gosh. Actually, was chitchatting with my husband as I was coming down here and I was mentioning your soccer team and my daughter who we were putting to bed was like, Wait, women have soccer teams? And I was like, Yeah, women can have soccer teams. She's like, Can women have football teams? And I was like, No, not football. And she's like, Okay, basketball? And I was like, Yeah, we watch so much sports here. I don't know who is, but I don't know, somehow that was like really inspiring. She's a great little athlete. So anyway.

[20:36]Natalie Portman: Know it's amazing. Think there are for our girls to have professional careers to aspire to if they are extraordinary athletes, to have athletes to look up to and admire. And also for boys, it's the same thing we're talking about with the book. It really had kind of similar impetus that I was inspired to have the soccer team when I saw my son watching the Women's World Cup. And he was looking at, you know, Alex Morgan and Megan Rapinoe in the same way that he looks at Messi or Ronaldo, you know? And I was like, that's changed. That really feels like a completely new world if because I mean, how many male athletes did we look up to as little girls, right? I like I have like a secret sort of

[21:25]Zibby Owens: girl crush on Chrissy Everett, I have to say. The tennis player. Everybody

[21:29]Natalie Portman: else, I feel like, is a blur of men. But she was my childhood hero. Yeah. I mean, we also had female athletes that we looked up to, but I think women are often asked to empathize with or see themselves in men. And And I think a world would be wonderful. I don't mind that. I think it just also should be that young boys see idols in women too, that they don't just have to look at greatness in male form.

[21:57]Zibby Owens: 100%. Totally agree. And speaking of idols, tell me a little bit about Natalie's Book Club and the books that you've been picking and how that's been going and all the rest. It's been so fun to get to

[22:10]Natalie Portman: share and hear people's opinions about books. And yeah, and it's brought me to so many interesting corners. I'm kind of an eclectic reader. So, you know, I'm not I don't have like a genre that people can like, you know, rely upon. So I hope that is okay for people following because sometimes it's fiction, sometimes it's nonfiction, sometimes it's, you know, poetry or and it's been really interesting to get to talk to all these different writers and understand more about their processes and of course, read some great books along the way. Are you reading anything great now? Anything amazing by your bedside? I finally read Untamed, which had I know I'm so late to the game. Some people told me how wonderful it was and they were all right. Like, it's so rare when something lives up to the hype. It really did. I really loved the book club books that I've really like have stuck with me in such a deep way. I would say The Lost Children Archives, the Valeria Luiselli book, is amazing. Like, that's like really, really affected me deeply. Girl, Woman, Other was incredible. New Eleanor Ferrante. And I'm picking all fiction books. But then some surprises too, like the Robin Wall Kimmerer book Gathering Lost was like, I was wrapped. It was so incredible. And Patrice Colors memoir is, when they call you a terrorist, is really, really moving and world changing. Like, it completely changes the way you see the world through one person's story. It's really a wonderful book. Yeah. I mean, so many. Everyone has been an incredible adventure.

[23:55]Zibby Owens: I have a whole new stack of books now. I have to like make a new little shelf here for you. Yeah. What are you reading? I recently read The Vanishing Half by Brit Bennett, which like Untamed, like everybody had already read. And I was so late to it. And I was like, almost didn't wanna read it because it had I'm like, you can't possibly be this good. And then it was. I was like, how great is that? So but, yeah, lots of I don't even know. Lots of different books. I'm reading a new book coming out called The Push by Ashley Audrain about a mother who's sort of been a victim of abuse sort of through the generations, right? Like her mother, grandmother, and how she mothers. But it's like a thriller. I don't know. It's kind of it's really good. That's what I'm reading right now. And, you know, fables, right? So Yes. I know. I'm constantly reading a whole variety of children's books. Yes. We just finished Lady Pancake and Sir French Toast. That's really what I'm I was reading that. That's a really good one. Really good one. I love that one. That's good. So do you have any advice, I would say both to aspiring authors, and especially children's authors, but also just people who want to emulate your activism and how to make a difference in terms of advocating for women, especially in getting equal footing? So for books, I mean, I think it's really for kids books.

[25:10]Natalie Portman: You just have to imagine and maybe practice with kids what keeps their attention. I know I need to mention like farts and burp and, you know, like boogers, like anything that's what keeps my children's attention. You know, to to I don't know, not not that you have to do that, but I think that the the silliness always helps with the kids books and practicing on them. Like, I definitely read them the books so many times to find what the, you know, what the parts I needed to change, what they understood, etc. In terms of activism, and I feel like what I've learned the most is to listen to the people who've been doing the work and follow them and like not trying to invent anything yourself. Like find the people who are because there are a lot of people who are doing it really well. Not to put anyone down. Like, obviously, if you want to devote your life to it, go do it. But the thing I think is when you're new to it, the best thing to do is find the people who've been doing it for decades, who've been organizing, who've been leading, and then listen to what they say and go with them. I mean, when you believe in what they're doing and their actions. But that's been I've learned the most.

[26:34]Zibby Owens: Yeah. By listening. I guess that's always true. Can I ask one last perhaps inappropriate question? How do you stay looking so young? Like, you do not age. And are you like skinny? That's so nice. I'm just like looking at your skin. This is like so creepy to me, but I'm just like, what is she doing that I am not doing? All I do is go like, look at all these. Like, I have, like, lines everywhere,

[26:58]Natalie Portman: every day, new ones. But, you know, I'm, like, trying to just embrace it and, like, feel like I earned it. Like, I don't know. My best friend and I were, like, talking last night. We're both turning 40 this year and she was like, 40. And I was like, no, 40? Like, that's like a that's like an achievement. Like, you know how many people don't get to reach this? Like, how lucky are we and how cool is this? And look what we did to get here. And like, this is amazing and you know it's I don't know I feel like you know I don't want to look inexperienced. I'm not inexperienced. I'm full of experience. Am full of joy and wisdom and curiosity. And if that's what my lines represent, then like, great. Let that be a signal. I don't know. I think yeah. Looking young is overrated. Thank you. That

[27:57]Zibby Owens: was just what I needed to hear tonight. Thank you for that. Yes. Looking young is overrated. Waste it on the young.

[28:04]Natalie Portman: Yeah. Forget it. No, let them enjoy it. That's the best part about being young. You don't know anything at that point. So like, I don't know, being young was like so painful for me. Like, I feel like it's such like a painful not knowing, searching, figuring it out, feeling uncomfortable in my own skin time. Give them the clear skin.

[28:26]Zibby Owens: That's true. They can have it. It's the bonus prize for having a deal with all Yes. Good. All clue what's coming next. Yeah. Being settled at all. And every day is a question mark. Now we have everything settled and here on the line. So fine. Or for me. Anyway, awesome. Well, Natalie, thank you so much. Thanks for all your time. I really appreciate it. That was really fun. Thank you. You too. And be well. I hope everything

[28:55]Natalie Portman: yeah.

[28:57]Zibby Owens: Thank you. Stay safe. Okay. Bye Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Don't forget to follow me on Instagram ZibbyOwens and momsdonthavetimetoreadbooks. Also sign up for my at zibby owens dot com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week. Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound for the sound editing, and thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and outro music.