Allison Winn Scotch, THE REWIND

[2:18]Zibby Owens: Hi. I'm Zibby Owens, the creator and host of the award winning podcast that you're listening to right now, thank you so much, called Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. It is a daily podcast three hundred and sixty five days a year, and each day we talk to an author about all of the things related to their career, their book, their life, and more in thirty minutes or less because who has time? I am now an author myself, although I wasn't when I started this podcast, and you can get my new memoir, A Memoir of Love, Loss, and Literature wherever books are sold starting July 1, and my children's book, Princess Charming. You can learn more about me at zibbyowens.com. But really, you're here to learn more about the authors, and that is what we're going to do. Also, be sure to check out all the other podcasts in the ZCast Podcast Network. You can learn more at zcastnetwork.com

[3:08]Allison Winn Scotch: and definitely check out those shows as well.

[3:14]Zibby Owens: Alison Winscotch is the author of The Rewind. She's already been on this podcast and now she is back on, this time guest hosted by Alicia Fernandez Miranda, author of My What If Year, which is coming out February 7 from Zippy Books. Preorder now. Alison Wynn Scotch is the New York Times bestselling author of eight novels, including Time of My Life in twenty Years and Cleo McDougall Regrets Nothing, a cum laude graduate of the University of Pennsylvania where she studied history and marketing. She currently lives in Los Angeles.

[3:45]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: Oh, guys. See, we're already having fun, and we've just started because I am here with Alison Winscottsch, the author of The Rewind, which I just loved. I read it at the perfect time of year. Right? So like, it's a book that takes place on New Year's Eve. So reading it in kind of the lead up to the holidays was like very, very good. I loved the nineties throwback. I just Thank you. I really, really loved it. I just I have like a huge smile on my face even talking about it because I enjoyed it so much. And this was my first of your many books that I have read, so now I can't wait to dive into But the back

[4:24]Allison Winn Scotch: it's just was great. Thank you. I mean, that genuinely means so much to me. Like it just, you you just love it when a reader loves a book and whether you're an interviewer or not, you know, well, you will find out soon. It's just, I don't know.

[4:39]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: It's genuinely like sort of emotional that people read your stuff who you don't know and actually enjoy it. So thank you very much. I love that you don't feel jaded after having written so many books that people really love, because I do sometimes wonder when you get to your like, you know, sixth, seventh, eighth, ninth book, if it starts to feel a bit kind of rote.

[5:00]Allison Winn Scotch: You know, I think there are aspects I mean, you guys have done a gazillion interviews and I think there are aspects of the publishing industry that I am quite cheated about, but the reader connection never loses its magic for me. So I think there is, I think a lot of people who have been doing this for a long time, you know, do have a little bit of a hardened shell about the business aspect of it, but it is such a difficult business that we wouldn't keep doing it if there weren't, you know, the pot of gold at the end. The pot of gold is making readers fall in love with your writing or resonating in some way or, you know, with this book, honestly, hopefully just giving people something to enjoy because when I wrote it sort of in the middle of COVID and I just wanted to write something enjoyable and that's a win. That aspect will never lose. You know, people email me or leave me a comment or whatever. That I try to reply to everybody because that aspect of it, somebody enjoying the, you know, year long work that you've done. It's the best part. That's amazing. So, yeah. You know, as you know, I know you know Zibby and,

[6:08]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: you know, her kind of ethos behind Zippy Books was sort of taking things about what she didn't like about the publishing process and trying to change them. I mean, is there anything sort of specifically that you would highlight that really drives you crazy?

[6:21]Allison Winn Scotch: Sure. How much time do we have? I'll say the one thing that I find very difficult and look, I have been my first book came out, I honestly can't remember. I want to say fifteen years ago. So I have been doing this for a long time. I have dear friends who are on the publishing and editorial side of it. I love my editor. The team at Berkeley is amazing. So I have had very positive experiences where my second book took off in a way that nobody expected, hit the times list, blah, blah, blah. I've had really demoralizing experiences and I'm pretty open about sort of all my ups and downs because I think it's important to be transparent that this is it's a difficult industry. So, but the one thing that to pinpoint your question that really upsets me is if a book does not do well, I feel as if not I feel. An author is almost always blamed for it. I find that really frustrating because all we can do is write the book that a publisher or editor has asked for, and it has been vetted and it has been edited probably, I don't know, five, seven times. That's how many drafts I usually go And you know, a dozen people at the publisher have signed off on it. So if for some reason it doesn't sell, I find it really frustrating when the author is blamed for that because we have delivered the book that has been asked for. And I can't be responsible for sales. Like I can, particularly in the early days when there wasn't social media, but even now more so the onus is placed on the author, go, you know, post a pretty picture of it. Right. I hope there's more marketing than that. I just find it upsetting when either I've been blamed or friends have been blamed and they've written beautiful books that just for whatever reason have not received the sales figures that they deserve. And then some people find it really hard to get another book deal. And I just think that sucks because all we can do is write the book that's been asked of us. So that's my one big gripe. I really I hear you. And I feel the kind of flip side of that. So just today,

[8:36]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: Zibby posted a picture of her holding my ARC. She's publishing my book. It's her first book. Yeah. I yeah. And it really does. And I was just saying to my husband before I got on this call, was like, know, really, our baby. Like, it's my I wrote the book, but it's it's been such a team effort to get it to the point of publication. For sure. That it feels like I am really sharing this with all of them. So Right. Hopefully, we we're gonna share the good and the bad.

[9:03]Allison Winn Scotch: A 100%. And so and and just to piggyback on that, as I said, I love the collaboration. The editorial part of it is my favorite aspect of the whole thing. I feel like I can usually write like a decent first draft. Like I always say, I can take something to a B plus, but I cannot I need the outside guidance to write an A level book. And so I'm not I think what I find frustrating is it is such a collaboration. And then often, at least with traditional publishers, I know Zibby is doing something different. If a book doesn't work and I don't know what goes on internally, if there's like, Oh, you know, we should have done this. But in terms of the career, the author is the one who doesn't necessarily get a second shot at it or, you know, confidence is lost. So that's just, you know, it is such a collaboration and I find that collaboration very joyous. I just, you know, it's hard. It's hard when you feel like, well, what else could I have done? And it's depressing. Totally.

[10:03]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: That's all. So, but there are a lot of positives about it. Yeah. Sorry. Oh, no, no. I love it. No, no, no. Not at all. I wanted to know this. And actually, I think that that's You know, so many people that listen to this listen because they love books and reading, but quite a few people who are writers or aspiring writers listen to So I actually think it's really, really interesting for people to kind of get into what publishing is really like. Because on social media, it does look all glitzy, glamorous. Here's me with my special unboxing video, and here's, you know, just like, doesn't this all look, you know, incredible? And you don't see the rejections and you don't see their challenges. Correct. It's important to a share that stuff.

[10:43]Allison Winn Scotch: Job. And I feel so lucky to be able to do it for so long. But you know, there's a reason that you see authors saying, please go leave a review. Please go tell your friends. It's a lot of authors are sort of white knuckling it to their next deal. I don't want to sound in any way complaining. It's just pulling back the curtain a little bit that if you were a reader and you loved a book, please tell your friends. Like that's how it all snowballs. So that's, you know, and you guys and to be, books are doing such a good job, you know, advocating for authors who might not otherwise get a spotlight.

[11:18]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: It is a team of book lovers. I mean, I think Yes. Like, and book geeks. Like, I mean, I don't I wanna I'll only speak for myself. No one else might consider myself a geek, but like absolutely geeking out about books and stories and being able to guest host these podcasts for Zippy's Podcasts for Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books has been for me, like, the most joyful thing because I get read a bunch of stuff that either isn't out yet or just came out or maybe I wouldn't have seen or picked up. And then I get to talk to the authors about it, which really could not be cooler. And especially when I like the books, I really have liked the books that I read for this. It's been such a joy. So, you know, but I think also a book, so I understand. Good. Yeah. Good. I'm glad you are. And again, I I love I I really do love my like the people I'm working with and I have had

[12:05]Allison Winn Scotch: mostly positive experiences. It's just that I'm not even like expressing this about my own experience, but you know, authors get together and they talk and it's it's a tough industry. Yeah. It is. It is tough out there, but there's a collaboration I

[12:17]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: want you to tell us about, which is Frankie, Frankie and Ezra. Good segue. I wanna talk about this book. Just, it's just so just, okay. Let's start by why don't you tell listeners what the rewind is So

[12:32]Allison Winn Scotch: the rewind is about two exes who really had a very difficult breakup and haven't spoken in a decade, but are back on their old college campus for a wedding and have sort of vowed not to interact for the weekend. And then the next morning wake up in bed together with engagement rings on or wedding bands on and have no memory of how they got here. So it's really about retracing their steps from the night before and also retracing what went wrong in their history that led to such a calamitous breakup.

[13:09]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: So you mentioned this was a pandemic book for you. How did you kind of come up with the idea sitting in your COVID COVID hopefully COVID free, but like, you know, COVID protected Yeah.

[13:22]Allison Winn Scotch: It was COVID free. I think I need to be study you know what? I don't even wanna jinx myself. I need to be studied by science because I have not gotten it yet. I'm gonna touch everything wood in my room for you right literally tomorrow. Tomorrow. I'm I'm knocking on everything. Exactly. Or maybe I've had it, but I should say I haven't tested positive. So I stumbled on this idea about nine months into it. Just I hadn't written anything. Again, like, very transparent. I was just dealing with I live in California. My kids hadn't been in school since the lockdown. So it was just was a there was a lot of sort of aggrieved people in my house who were arguing. And anyway, so I had gone out to take a walk as we all did very often. And I was talking to Laura Dave, who's another author who I'm sure everybody listening to this knows, who is a very good friend of mine and one of my first collaboration partners. I was just like, Oh, I feel like I have to start writing something. And I was just sort of like spitting out ideas. And I said like, What if it's like The Hangover, but a romantic comedy? And she was like, Okay, that's a brilliant idea. I mentioned this in the acknowledgment. She's like, but it's gonna be really hard to write. So don't mention it to anybody because they're gonna make you write it. So I was sort of desperate for an idea. So I did mention it to my agent. She's like, great. Now you have to write it. So that was, it was literally just like that seed of a spitballing, you know, I think she and I came up with like four different ideas and I sent them into my agent and this was the one of course that she picked. And so then I started writing it and I would say like every 50 pages I would call my agent and be like, again, this little insider baseball. Was like, please, can you just sell it on a partial? I don't wanna finish this without an editor. I don't know what I'm doing. It's so hard. And she kept being like, send me a few more pages and then maybe we will. And she made me write the whole thing. And then that's when we, that's how it, you know, reached where it was now, not where it was now, because then obviously your editor comes in and makes it better. But that's how we sold it. I'm like kind of amazed actually that you

[15:31]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: wrote it in pieces because of the structure of the story and the kind of working backwards bit. You would think that you would have had it all

[15:40]Allison Winn Scotch: planned out. What was your process like for this book? Yeah, it was that's a great question. And that is what made it so hard that I am a cancer, so I do not outline. I just start on page one and I go. I did outline for one book and I found it really, really difficult. I just like to sort of see where the characters go, like put problems in their way and see how they would react to them. So that is what made it so difficult was that I didn't, I knew how it was going to end, but I did not know how they were going to get there. And I just had to like the characters stumble along the way to figure out where they were going. And so, you know, it was really difficult and I was juggling three different timelines. I was juggling the day that they woke up. I was juggling the night before, and then I was juggling their history from a decade ago. So it was just really arduous. I mean, that's

[16:34]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: which is why I kept calling my agent and being like, I can't write this.

[16:38]Allison Winn Scotch: I want you to sell it, but I can't write it, which is not what your agent wants to hear. So I yeah. It just my life harder for myself by not outlining, but I just had such a difficult experience with that book where I did that I just, I don't know. I always managed to get to the other side. I'm working on a book now that it's I'm like on my fifth draft of it and it's almost good, but it's not really good. And if I had outlined it, it probably would have been better, but this is just my process. Like every time I'm like, oh, why am I doing this? Like, can I go? I actually, when I did a signing at an independent bookstore and I was like, and Zibby listeners will know that she's opening up her own store here in LA. And I was like, I think I came home. I like, I think I just wanna work at a bookstore. Like, that just sounds so much so enjoyable. So

[17:30]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: maybe in my next in my next career. I think is it like is it like having a kid that once you finished it, you forget how horrible it was? A 100. A 100%.

[17:41]Allison Winn Scotch: A 100%. Or it's like raising kids. Like, you're like, oh, the I have two teenagers. It's a good toddler face. It sounds so delightful. I know. I know. Right? Listeners are like, what is wrong with you? But I have two teenagers. So, you know, that's exactly what it is. That's so funny.

[17:59]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: Now where were you on Y2K on the eve of the millennium? What were you doing? So I was actually

[18:07]Allison Winn Scotch: I had gone through a breakup and I figured we would spend our time that evening together, but we didn't. So my brother I don't know if he had gone through a breakup. I can't remember. But anyway, he was like, I'm going to Cabo and I have a free room for you to stay in. So I went down to Cabo with him. I know my older brother. So that I was there, but I didn't really buy into I was a little like Frankie. I didn't buy into any of that Y2K stuff. I thought it was absurd. It was an early night. Like I remember some of the people who were on the trip with went out and I'm not a big like New Year's Eve person. I don't know if you are, but yeah. So that's where I was probably just very sad and mourning my breakup that in hindsight, like many listeners, I'm sure I was like, oh my God, thank God that I didn't end up with that person. But yeah. That's where were you? Do you remember? I

[19:00]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: was, I was. Yeah. I was in Cabo. I was. So my I used to spend all my New Years in Miami with my family, which is where I grew up. And my uncle still hosts a really big New Year's Eve party. But I think we skipped it that year. I have a vague memory of being in the back of someone's Jeep with my best friend and her sister. And Tyson Beckford, the male model, was, like, riding behind us. We were, like, on Ocean Drive. That's such a Miami we're college is such a Miami story. And he was, like, on this motorbike behind us, and we were, like, trying to get his attention. -BRANDON: So

[19:34]Allison Winn Scotch: is a very I know.

[19:37]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: Y2K Miami story. I love it. I'm, like, thinking about that now. I'm like, Oh, God, that's, like, such a cliche. You know, Miami is a great place to be for the New Year. Like Cabo, it's warm and sunny. So But now we celebrate Hogmanay, which is Scottish New Year. We usually do it the past few years, we've been on the Isle Of Skye. It's very cold and, like, fires and lots of whiskey and lots of traditions. Like, you have to listen to the bells ring at midnight, and then you have to have a tall, dark stranger darken your doorstep, and you have to offer them whiskey. And that's like your good luck for the new year. But also, my family is Cuban and that's That sounds amazing. Emily is Venezuelan, so you're also supposed to, like, run around the street with a suitcase. I don't know. We've got, like, 6,000 traditions, and you have to eat 12 grapes. So there's a lot to do on New Year's Eve, actually, because we're pretty busy that day. Well, drinking whiskey.

[20:26]Allison Winn Scotch: I love sounds like a lot of stuff to get done. So it's definitely a lot of Today's taste of

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[23:42]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: So if you you set this book in the nineties Yeah. Which was so fun to, like, go back to that time. Why did you is that like a time period that you really loved? Did you just think the story fit there? Like, tell me about that decision. Great question.

[23:57]Allison Winn Scotch: Sort of all of the above. One is I went to college in the nineties. So I have a very sort of nostalgic love of that experience in that time. Part of it is just that time in your sort of early twenties where like anything feels possible and you feel a little bit invincible, even if you're miserable or whatever. Like, it's just like the whole world is wide open. And I have a very fond memory of my college experience. So that was a little bit that. But also I realized very quickly that if I had said it in current time, they would have just checked their phones. Yeah. So there isn't a lot of mystery left anymore because of our phones. So I just had to eliminate smartphones. And so then when I realized, oh, you know, that millennium, New Year's Eve, we were all, it felt, I don't know, sort of foundational. Like it felt like an important moment in your life, even though of course it wasn't, but that's how the media was playing And, it you know, we're never gonna be alive again for a new millennium. So it just felt like a really romantic time where people maybe made heady decisions that they wouldn't otherwise. So, yeah. So it worked out that that happened to coincide with the no smartphone decision. And, I mean, the music and the fashion, it was just it was super fun.

[25:15]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: It was so it was so great to read. And I just kept thinking of Frankie with her Walkman, like, going around with her Walkman. And I just love that image. Yeah. With, like, the yellow headphones. I mean, remember we carried those clunky things around and then

[25:29]Allison Winn Scotch: transitioned to CDs, which we thought were, like, so high-tech. And yeah. You know, and the, the clothes and the Doc Martens and I have a teenage daughter who dresses exactly like I dressed in college now. It's just weird, right? What is happening? Yeah. So it was really it was very fun to revisit. So and in the middle of COVID, that brought me a lot of joy.

[25:57]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: Yeah. I went into Reformation, which is a store I really like, even though I'm like way too old to be shopping there. I not. I I walked into a store short. It was this was like right before lockdown. Actually, it was in March 2020. And I was like, I I actually owned these clothes. I'm not gonna buy them again. I already owned them once. So there's no way I can buy and it was terrifying actually, because I was like, how have I become so old that my clothes have come back around and they're like, oh, wow.

[26:27]Allison Winn Scotch: I really regret my daughter's about my same size. I really regret getting rid of all that stuff. You know, they're wearing like the massive bag of jeans and some of it is like acid washed, which is even more horrifying and like little tank tops or massively oversized hoodies. And, you know, they go to Urban Outfitters, which we had on my college campus. And I mean, Reformation, same thing. So, yeah, it was fun to write and it is wild to watch your kids make the same fashion mistakes that they did.

[27:00]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: Oh, it really comes around. Now I was browsing It really does. I was browsing your Instagram and I came across adopt a library, which is something you've been doing. And I was wondering if you could tell us a little bit about that.

[27:11]Allison Winn Scotch: Sure. Yeah. Thank you for asking that. So over the summer, I was contacted by a librarian in Alabama. I sometimes mistakenly say Arkansas, but it's Alabama. And she asked me if I could donate some of my books because they didn't have the budget for it. So I was like, of course, you know, I'll send you a full box. And I said, could I also send you, as you know, I, a lot of authors get free books all the time. It's one of the perks. And I said, I have a whole bunch of other books that I'd be happy to send down. And she willingly took them. Then I was like, well, why don't we all send So many authors or readers are in a fortunate position of having full bookshelves and be the books that we've read once and set aside or books we've never read. How about if I try to do this for other places? So I put a call out both for readers and authors and librarians, And it turned out that a lot of people wanted to do it. So we ended up sending about 2,000 books to various libraries and schools. Should say a lot of schools are in dire straits. So that was sort of the start of it. And then I have a friend who runs Lids that had company and they have a foundation. And so they reached out and were like, you know, we'd actually like to give some grants to these libraries. So I just compiled a list of 10 public libraries and they're sending them all a thousand dollars and we're hoping that it can sort of be an ongoing thing. So, you know, I feel like I was really lucky either as a child. I mean, as a child to have books come into my life, my mom was a teacher and I think it really shaped my worldview. And so to be able to help communities that maybe don't have the same funding or households that don't have the same access, it's really gratifying. Know, I would literally, I said to my husband, like talk about the theme of if there's something else I wanted to do. I was like, I would just like to help libraries for the rest of my life. Like it's so I think that if you are in a position where you just have books coming in or you can just go into an independent bookstore and pay money for whatever you want or shop on Amazon. You don't realize that not everybody has that access. So to be able to do that was was and is really one of the most enjoyable things I've done recently. So I think it's awesome. Is there a way for people to get involved

[29:28]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: locally? Like, is this something you Absolutely. People can get their own library and stuff like that?

[29:32]Allison Winn Scotch: Absolutely. Well, so what people may not know is most public libraries or even schools, particularly underfunded schools, public schools, accept donations. And if they get, you know, they, I will say they prefer sort of very good condition books. Like don't pull out your books that you've had for thirty years and are like yellowing and dusty. And they it's one less budget, you know, things that they have to allocate for further budget. And I actually do have a big spreadsheet if people wanna find me on Instagram of schools or public libraries that have specifically requested. They told me what they're looking for, you know, whether it's You, middle grade, LGBTQ types of things that they're in need of. So I think I will probably start that drive again, like in the spring. So we'll I'll do a whole another push for book donations, but it's super easy. You just you can send the media mail. So it's like very inexpensive. I really wanted to keep costs low for people who were donating. You just put them in a box and you take them in post office. And I sent like 25 books off to the library in Alabama for like $11. And that's like, you know, several $100 worth of books that they don't either have the budget for that they don't have to pay for that. So I love it. You know, so easy. Yeah.

[30:49]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: It's really amazing. I did not I don't think I did we I can't remember if we had a lot of new books when I was a kid. Don't think so, but I would go to the library all the And

[30:59]Allison Winn Scotch: that was just where I found my love for reading and it was such an amazing place. And so I just love this idea. I thought it was so cool that you started. Oh, thank you. I mean, you know, hats off to the librarian who took a chance to email me and say, can you send in your books? And, you know, very appreciative of Lids Foundation. She was like, we really looked for libraries and communities that are probably not getting a lot of funding where a thousand dollars can make a big impact. And a lot of these towns or small cities, you know, that's like the resource. Like people go there, as you said, like after school or, you know, on their weekends. So we're hoping to, you know, make those communities sort of those libraries and those communities a beacon for them.

[31:42]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: That's awesome. Well, is open for the next drive.

[31:47]Allison Winn Scotch: Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. It's very exciting.

[31:50]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: So what are you reading right now?

[31:52]Allison Winn Scotch: So right now I'm reading the dead romantics, which I'm really enjoying. I've been in like a big rom com reading phase because I feel like it's funny when I was younger, I never read anything in my genre while I was writing because I was so worried that I would like hear that voice and mimic it in my writing. But now there's so many I mean, there have always been great romance or rom com writers, but there's so many women, it's mostly women who are doing it so well that I've been reading them to sort of absorb it to help my new draft. So I'm really liking the Dead Romantics. I loved Funny You Should Ask by Alyssa Sussman. I love the Spanish Love Experiment. No, the Spanish Love Deception. So it's funny. I read on my Kindle. So I like inhale them and then I sort of forget what was on there. I just listened to Rob Delaney's book, A Heart That Works, which I thought was wonderful. And I would encourage people. I really enjoyed listening to it. I think people will maybe be hesitant to read it because it is about the death of the son. But I didn't find it sad. I found it. It was like really written out of love. So he's so he's funny. And I don't know, I just thought it was a very, like it sheds light on humanity. So I would really recommend that as well.

[33:11]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: And so you said you're working on a book. What's up next for you? What's kind of your, on your 20 Yes. So I 20 have three book

[33:19]Allison Winn Scotch: that is supposed to come out around this time next year. I don't know if they've finalized the date for it. It's called The Retake as opposed to The Rewind. Oh, okay. And it is about sort of the world's most famous actress, like a Julia Roberts in her heyday type who blows up her career. She's an she's a rom com actress like America's sweetheart. I haven't obviously honed this hit yet. A mess of it. Anyway, she goes home. She finds an anonymous love letter and her team thinks at her house that it's like the way that she can get back in America's good graces. So she steps out to find out who sent it to her. So it's like a fun sort of rom com road trip,

[34:02]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: second chance, forever. Here for that. I'm so here for that. Yep. Even with my bad pig. You Do know what though? I like that. Actually, oftentimes I ask like, when I've done these, I've asked authors, and a lot of times people do not wanna share what they're working on. I guess for you know, it's gonna change a lot or I guess Oh, I'm not precious. But, you know and I guess they're worried about sharing too much. But I kinda love it because then when this book comes out, people can come back and listen and be like, Is that what this book ended up being? Or

[34:26]Allison Winn Scotch: did she turn into a horror novel? Who knows? It's funny. In the back of the rewind, I think there's a blurb, and it says like she was a romance novelist. Like, is it I understand that, but just go along the ride with me listeners. I don't, you know, I never know what's about to happen. So as I said, since I don't outline, so she is now a movie star and it's actually, it's very fun. It's not quite done to where it needs to be, but I feel like it's finally getting close. So I'm, I think I'm on like the fifth draft now and I'm in the middle of editing and I'm sometimes I'm like, Ugh, this is terrible. But I was reading parts of it yesterday and I was like, Oh, okay. Like, I wouldn't be mortified if if this

[35:11]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: section of it came out. That is a great place to be, I will say.

[35:17]Allison Winn Scotch: Oh my gosh. Allison, I have a crawl under my bed. I wouldn't wanna just let them disappear

[35:22]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: if someone read this one paper. Yeah.

[35:27]Allison Winn Scotch: You know, you're an author. Oh, I know. And you never know how you're gonna feel reading that iteration of it. Sometimes you're like, this is amazing. I'm so awesome. And sometimes you're like, this is

[35:38]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: the biggest pile of dog poop ever. Yeah. So I had all the I had all the emotions. I have all the emotions all the time.

[35:46]Allison Winn Scotch: Exactly. This has been the most fun chat. I feel like it's New Year's Eve and we've, like, had a party. We always end this, as you know, with advice to aspiring writers.

[35:57]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: So what beautiful pearls of wisdom do you have to share with the Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books listeners today?

[36:05]Allison Winn Scotch: It's funny. I probably shared the same time, same advice the last time I did this, but I have a few. And I think my top two are revise one or two more times than you think the stomach for, because having been a writer who thought her first book was done and it didn't sell, a book that you think is done is very often not done. And if you can just sort of dig in and stomach through going through one more time with objective criticism from a trusted reader or your agent and editor. If you're just starting out, you may not have that, but somebody whose guidance you trust. I find that it's sort of those edits the one or two more times that you feel that it's done, but it probably isn't, really elevates the book. As I said earlier, it takes it from sort of a B book to an A book. So don't send it out yet, sit on it, revise it one more time. And then tying into that is I think the biggest mistake that a lot of first time authors make actually even veteran authors is they have an ego about sort of being precious about their work. And I think that ego is the most damaging thing that you can bring to the collaboration. Nothing you write should be so valuable that you can't take a look at it objectively and say, this could be better. And if somebody is giving you constructive criticism, it's only because they're there trying to help. And that doesn't mean you have to take everything they say and apply it, but sort of putting up that wall of like, Oh no, like I'm not willing to hear this. It's so detrimental to the process. And I think I've mostly always been this way, but really going on, you know, this is my ninth book. I still, as I said, go through five to seven revisions. And if I were sort of proprietary about what I was willing to look at and examine and make better books wouldn't be as good, which isn't to say everybody loves the books, etcetera. But I just think putting, having an ego in this process is it's just not good for the work. So try to not take things personally, you know, from people who are rooting for you. Like if somebody tags you in a really nasty review, you can take that personally. Yeah, exactly. But from the people who are working to help you, don't take things personally.

[38:30]Alicia Fernandez Miranda: That is like exactly the advice I needed to hear at this exact moment in time. So I am very grateful for I feel like everybody probably says that. And no, I I feel like that's don't know if that's a common I don't know. Do you know? So I've done 10 of these, and I feel like there's a real range. I'm not sure anybody has repeated advice, actually. Like, everybody's so unique in the but sometimes you hear, like, the thing you need to hear at the exact moment you need to hear it, and that is what I needed. So even if no one else finds that helpful, which I suspect will not happen, you have helped me. Allison, I have loved this. Thank you so much for joining me on the podcast today. Me too. Have an amazing New Year's Eve doing all of your things with the whiskey and the grapes. It's all it's all scheduled to make sure we get it in before twelve. Whiskey, grapes, suitcases. Oh my god. That sounds Dark strangers. Yeah. We're doing it all. That's amazing. Yeah. Dark strangers. Oh, yeah. That too. Okay.

[39:24]Allison Winn Scotch: Yeah. Thanks so much, Alija. Have a great one.

[39:28]Zibby Owens: Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at Zibby Owens and at moms don't have time to read books. Also, sign up for my newsletter at zibbyowens.com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week. Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound for the sound editing, and thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and outro music.