Catherine Belknap and Natalie Telfer, CAT AND NAT'S MOM SECRETS: Coffee-Fueled Confessions from the Mom Trenches
[0:01]Hi, this is Ziggy Owens, and you're listening to the award-winning podcast.
[0:05]Moms don't have time to read books, and speaking of books, I have two of my own books
[0:10]coming out this spring and summer.
[0:12]Princess Charming is a picture book which debuts on April 19th, and bookends.
[0:17]A memoir of love, loss, and literature comes out on July 1st, and it is truly a labor of love.
[0:24]I hope you'll pre-order, order, and join me on tour as I go across the country.
[0:28]You can find out more at zibbyowens.com or bookendsmemoir.com, and you can follow me on Instagram at zibbyowens
[0:36]because I always post about everything.
[0:38]Enjoy the show!
[0:40]Katherine, Belknap, and Natalie Telfer are co-authors of Cat-Nats mom secrets, coffee-fueled confessions from the mom trenches.
[0:49]With seven kids between them, Cat-Nats know just how lonely an isolating motherhood can be,
[0:54]so they set out an admission to bring women and moms together
[0:57]by hosting dinner parties and events with wine and without babies.
[1:00]The events garnered huge success in Toronto and were talked about all over,
[1:04]leading Cat-Nats to take things to the next level and break into the online world to reach more people
[1:08]and connect women and moms everywhere.
[1:10]Cat-Nats rapidly exploding community of like-minded moms tune in every day to watch them rewrite the paradigm of the perfect mom.
[1:18]With honesty and humor, Cat-Nats dismantled the unrealistic portrayals of motherhood
[1:22]that are often presented throughout social and traditional media.
[1:25]They're virally famous hashtag momtruths videos, which have garnered hundreds of millions of views,
[1:31]their Facebook live show, and Instagram stories, their best-selling book, and I Heart Radio Award-nominated podcast.
[1:37]Cat-Nats share everything moms think, but are too afraid to talk about.
[1:41]Over the past few years, Cat-Nats have taken their hashtag momtruths on the road,
[1:45]performing over 100 live shows across North America.
[1:48]Cat-Nats is a trusted brand created by these two very candid moms, turned brand ambassadors,
[1:54]YouTube sensations, TV personalities, social media leaders, chart-topping podcasters,
[1:59]and best-selling authors with the purpose of supporting uniting and celebrating women
[2:03]who come from all walks of life.
[2:05]Cat-Nats shine a witty light on some of the hardest topics in motherhood by delivering raw,
[2:09]real uncensored content to an amazing community of women and moms from all around the world.
[2:13]And they were nice enough, by the way, to have me on their podcast hashtag momtruths so you can go and listen to me as a guest on their show if you want.
[2:23]Welcome, Cat-Nats.
[2:24]Welcome to moms.
[2:26]Don't have time to read books.
[2:27]I'm so excited, Cat-Nats to talk about Cat-Nats.
[2:30]Mom secrets, coffee, fueled confessions from the mom trenches.
[2:35]Aw, thank you.
[2:36]You did that beautifully.
[2:37]It was perfect.
[2:39]My two attempts just to say one syllable words, Cat-Nats.
[2:45]It's hard sometimes.
[2:47]We know.
[2:48]We know.
[2:49]We're hidden in a room with seven kids roaming around.
[2:52]So wish us luck.
[2:53]Oh, my gosh.
[2:54]My kids are at school.
[2:55]But yeah, we're away.
[2:57]We're away in Florida right now.
[2:59]And we have texted the husbands to let them know that we're busy.
[3:02]But you know how that can go.
[3:04]Know how that can go.
[3:06]So tell, I read your last book as well.
[3:09]This book is equally hilarious.
[3:11]I was laughing out loud, per usual.
[3:13]I had the section about who's childhood came into the bathroom.
[3:17]And you were like, in what world do we have to live in?
[3:20]That's not OK to film while we're on the toilet.
[3:23]And I know.
[3:24]It's just YouTube channel.
[3:26]I have my kids do that all the time.
[3:27]They're like, like and subscribe.
[3:29]I'm like, nobody's watching.
[3:30]No one's watching this.
[3:32]I know.
[3:33]And they're like four.
[3:34]And like three.
[3:35]And they're like, you're like, am I a bad parent in this?
[3:38]Or like, is this the new norm that no one's talking about that our kids are
[3:42]all YouTubers walking around?
[3:44]Because they used to play like Cinderella and like fictitious like Disney characters.
[3:49]And now they're all YouTubers.
[3:50]I'm like, are we good as a society right now?
[3:53]Like are we all OK?
[3:55]You know, Kat and I are coming from.
[3:57]We had to go to LA and New York to work.
[3:59]And so the dads flew with the seven kids here.
[4:02]And all the kids let us know that we call Baby Cocoa,
[4:05]because she's the youngest of them all.
[4:07]Our two are called the babies.
[4:08]Like the babies need a towel.
[4:09]The babies need a towel.
[4:10]And they're seven and six.
[4:12]Yeah.
[4:13]But anyways, apparently Cocoa was taking her iPad and vlogging.
[4:17]The whole like journey in the airport.
[4:19]We should probably watch that.
[4:20]I have it on my phone now because we're thanks.
[4:22]So now I have a vlog for a full life coming down.
[4:26]But that's the other thing too is like one of my kids.
[4:29]Like, well, do you watch my vlog?
[4:31]Because I have her like share made like an album on Apple.
[4:34]You know, where you share.
[4:35]Yeah.
[4:36]You know, subscribe to just the album.
[4:37]And I'm like, when is the time in my day going to come
[4:40]for me to watch the 17 hours of you doing skincare?
[4:44]Yeah.
[4:45]Not that I don't adore her.
[4:46]I love her.
[4:47]And then I'll watch it.
[4:48]Make it down to a minute because your life now consumes a 15.
[4:51]Like, you know, 15 one second clips is what we all want.
[4:54]That's all we watch now.
[4:55]50% of your video is up your nose or the ceiling.
[4:57]So let's get it together.
[4:58]And do this.
[4:59]Let's do this right.
[5:00]Oh my gosh.
[5:01]So funny.
[5:02]So of course what makes you guys so funny is that you are just
[5:05]really, really funny, but be just so relatable.
[5:08]Right.
[5:09]The things you're talking about are things we're all kind of going
[5:11]through and maybe not taking the time to write about and certainly
[5:14]not writing about it.
[5:15]And it's funny away as you two do.
[5:16]And you just like cut to the chase.
[5:18]And you were like, our kids have access to all the information
[5:21]known to men.
[5:22]And yet they choose to go on TikTok.
[5:25]Yeah.
[5:26]It's so funny.
[5:27]Yeah.
[5:28]Yeah.
[5:29]You know, it's fine.
[5:30]Every time you mention the book, it's like, because those
[5:33]stories were ignited by in the book, mom secrets, they were
[5:37]ignited by anonymous confessions from our audience.
[5:41]But then we build on the chapter to say how, you know, how we
[5:45]can relate our personal stories about it.
[5:47]And honestly, when we're writing the book, you don't write the book
[5:51]thinking that it's going to be there for the public to read.
[5:55]You just write it kind of for yourself.
[5:57]And you just like the two of us just we tell our stories
[6:00]and we don't stop and think, wait, who's going to be reading this?
[6:03]What should I have said that?
[6:04]And then all of a sudden, everybody, you know, you get the
[6:07]editor, you get the book and the editor.
[6:09]So that's right.
[6:10]And you're like, we're like, this is really great.
[6:13]Is that kill?
[6:14]Did we say too much?
[6:16]We just, we just don't know how to, we don't know how to just
[6:19]tell it exactly how it comes to our minds.
[6:21]We're missing that filter.
[6:22]So that's great.
[6:23]That, I mean, that makes the consumption of it even easier.
[6:26]Right.
[6:27]We don't have to.
[6:28]You know, it's like drinking coffee without one of those lids.
[6:31]It's just like, you know, whoosh, just come on.
[6:33]Sure.
[6:34]You have been cryptic about our stories.
[6:35]It's pretty blatantly odd.
[6:36]Yeah.
[6:37]I liked the question that came in that you based a chapter on about
[6:41]should your husband be your best friend, basically.
[6:43]And you're like, I'm out here at this nice dinner with you.
[6:47]And like, I actually washed the bra that I happen to be wearing.
[6:50]Like, I don't want to hear that you think I'm your best friend.
[6:52]Like, why do we have to be best red?
[6:55]Honestly.
[6:56]And like, that's one of the chapters that I'm like, because
[6:59]it makes to not a lot.
[7:00]It makes to me a lot because I really do think that I do think
[7:03]that I am his best friend kind of.
[7:06]And he's not mine.
[7:08]And I don't know if I've ever told him that before.
[7:11]So yes, you have.
[7:12]But not really.
[7:13]Like, I mean, I have.
[7:14]Oh, got it.
[7:15]I've always kind of say in a joking way.
[7:16]Yeah.
[7:17]I'm sitting down and let him know.
[7:18]OK, got it.
[7:19]You know what I mean?
[7:20]Like, this is kind of a new tip.
[7:21]And if I have said it, it's like, you know, maybe I've had a
[7:23]a popular too.
[7:24]You know, but when you put it in a book, it's like, I was dead
[7:27]sober when I wrote those words until that story.
[7:29]You're going to have to get over it.
[7:30]There's no surprise who my best friend is.
[7:32]You know what I mean?
[7:33]That's just get your own best friend.
[7:36]Oh, you know, I know.
[7:41]I mean, it's funny how you say it.
[7:43]But I do feel that it's a lot harder for men to just be as
[7:47]open.
[7:48]I don't mean to generalize.
[7:49]Obviously, there are many of very close relationships with
[7:51]friends, but for them to trust as much.
[7:54]I feel like I tell personal stuff to so many girlfriends.
[7:57]Yes.
[7:58]In a way that men don't tend to do.
[8:00]I don't know if it's trust or just the way they're wired or
[8:03]whatever.
[8:04]I don't think they put as much weight into their thoughts.
[8:07]Yeah.
[8:08]Women do.
[8:09]And I think that they move through things.
[8:11]Not all of them.
[8:12]Some of them.
[8:13]You know, a little faster than we like to process in a
[8:16]different way than they do.
[8:17]They like, it's interesting.
[8:19]Sometimes they have the same interest in the topics that we
[8:22]talk about.
[8:23]To be honest with you, like, I don't think it's there that
[8:25]that's why they relate on actionable items versus, you know,
[8:28]these in-depth conversations that they're kind of bored of like,
[8:31]oh, it's really hard.
[8:33]They're like, then fix it.
[8:34]You're like, that's not what I want to do.
[8:36]We like to talk about our inner feelings.
[8:38]Our husbands literally will stare at each other.
[8:40]Like, what are they even talking about?
[8:42]Like, they're not even making any sense.
[8:44]But to us, we're making perfect sense.
[8:46]Yeah.
[8:47]I have to say sometimes with my daughter, with one of my
[8:50]daughter, I have four kids, but, you know, with one of my
[8:53]daughters, it distresses me so much when she's really upset
[8:56]about something that I do try to like fix it in a way I
[9:00]wouldn't do with a girlfriend.
[9:01]A girlfriend, I love the time in the world.
[9:03]I'll sit there and like, you're out and commiserate or give
[9:06]calm advice.
[9:07]But if it's my daughters and times, which I shouldn't do,
[9:10]but I'm like, okay, well, here's what you can do.
[9:12]Like, you know, why do I, I don't know.
[9:13]Do you do that?
[9:14]Well, we don't want to watch our, we don't want to watch our
[9:16]children have to go through pain when we know the answers.
[9:19]So, so easily had to fix it or often they'll give you like,
[9:22]they'll find every problem and then you could do this.
[9:25]Well, they just, they just want to, okay.
[9:27]I'll just listen, but you're ignoring me.
[9:29]No, if I give you advice, you don't want it.
[9:31]But if I, I just, I hear you.
[9:33]I don't know what to say to you.
[9:35]I hear you.
[9:36]Oh, man.
[9:37]Story of our lives.
[9:38]But.
[9:39]So, what has it been like this tour that you went on?
[9:43]Right.
[9:44]And you write so funny about the tour itself and finding
[9:47]mail strippers and, you know, the unglamorous parts of, of
[9:51]touring and making everything right.
[9:54]Yeah.
[9:55]How much of that went on before the pandemic disrupted it?
[9:58]Like, are you going to go?
[9:59]You're going to go.
[10:00]back on tour like what's the what's the latest first of all during the pandemic we realized
[10:06]that we couldn't connect and go on tour we actually started these virtual late night lies even
[10:11]before that for people women who were not able to come to the event and we were full on
[10:15]in tour when the pandemic hit when the pandemic hit we were like in New York and we were
[10:22]supposed to go out and I mean we just did LA that was two years delayed from the pandemic so
[10:27]we were in the midst of it all and it was like and there was like a short window where things
[10:32]were open in September and November as September so we went out in the fall before
[10:41]before that again and we really we really locked in like I don't know like 10 20 30 shows in the
[10:47]fall so and we are now just having you know conversations about what we're about to release a whole
[10:53]bunch of new dates but it was really hard and that's why our virtual like evenings were the
[10:57]closest thing we could do to be able to like we still had our strippers come on virtually we still
[11:02]had special guests and all of that because we knew that we needed it but it really I mean the whole
[11:07]thing the whole entertainment industry I was like sadly taking a massive hit and just when they
[11:12]thought they were getting back you know like round two has come around and we feel so hard for
[11:18]a lot of the the workers in the theaters who it's their livelihood and they've really been
[11:23]disrupted for a lot of years and it's been like I mean in the fall we were a lot of first people
[11:28]shows to go back and after two years and that they hadn't even this whatever this thing is
[11:35]hasn't even come back hadn't even started again in December it hit again and I was like oh my gosh
[11:40]this is so like this is so right good consistent dancers that have survived through the pandemic
[11:48]not an easy feat they've retired and moved on well no it was pretty intense it's been a pretty
[11:54]intense ride to just when you think you're getting your feedback it's like and next and you're like
[12:00]ah you know because everyone it's a it's a lot of work to book shows and then to have them move
[12:05]or canceled or you know people nervous to go it's it's been a it's been a very interesting time
[12:12]and so when did this book come to be was this a part of it was this partially a reaction to that
[12:18]like okay well let's do the book so we asked before the pandemic it was it was kind of yeah
[12:23]started before the pandemic and then during the pandemic I feel like the world actually did
[12:27]stop for a little bit never was like then we had to make a decision to either write about the
[12:31]pandemic or not include the pandemic because that was it's sort of an interesting topic and
[12:37]when the before if anyone knows when you write a book it's not like let's write it next month
[12:42]release it it's a long process so you're looking sometimes at years from start to finish when it
[12:47]actually happens so they were nervous about it not being years still when the book was released
[12:54]so we don't really have the pandemic included in the book although it's a very big reality for a
[12:59]a lot of people yet you know it was it was during it was before it's been it's been again like
[13:06]I guess there was shortages and some like something like it's just been a never ending
[13:10]but it also took us a while to get the book going I mean books aren't easy to easy to write
[13:17]and we feel like the first one was like it was it was smoother and then and then the next one
[13:21]because of so many disruptions in life it took longer so we are beyond excited that March 2022
[13:28]March 20 2022 I think yeah it comes out and we're just so excited that it's finally going to be
[13:35]birth to all the moms who and women who need to have this kind of laughter again yeah it's been
[13:41]an interesting time well I sincerely appreciated the laughs myself so I will tell you that isn't it
[13:50]so you know and where we're from it's still locked down like the kids just went back to school
[13:55]and the restaurants are still closed so I mean it has been a long it has been it's been one of the
[14:01]longest times ever yeah is there something aside from the fact that you two have each other and
[14:09]have your community right at your back and that you can always be creative to get yourself through
[14:14]is there anything else that has really helped you know some secret I don't know have it or something
[14:21]that you're like okay now this is just my stick I feel like I you know a lot of people said
[14:26]we got them through like a lot of dark times which actually surprised me because I felt like
[14:30]we weren't having our best like we usually have a ton of fun wherever we get like we have a lot of
[14:36]fun but because the kids have been home for so long it wasn't as easy to always just get together
[14:40]and for a lot of the time it was illegal like it was it was literally illegal for us to walk into
[14:45]each other's houses and people were calling the cops not enough you heard of these like tickets
[14:49]and stuff and so when we when we were like that we're like what and I think that part of it was
[14:56]just you know moving like each day just doing it like each day just doing it and I think that
[15:03]that's what kind of moms are super heroes at is like getting through the day and even when you
[15:08]feel like you're not your best self or you're having the best time it doesn't necessarily that doesn't
[15:13]equal how you feel to everybody else because sometimes when you show people you're doing it that's
[15:18]that makes something like they can do it too and I think that that's okay we didn't feel our best
[15:22]selves and I think that that shows that even in your your not best self moment you can still be
[15:27]alike to someone else even even when you don't do that especially when we had the seven kids and
[15:32]like everywhere they turn people were talking about what was the kind of a scary time we were
[15:37]committed to showing them that we could have fun we could do fun things we could get together we
[15:41]could have dance parties and we could instead they could feel like when they look to us it
[15:46]wasn't the end of the world yeah look to the news it was the end of the world but with us we'll
[15:51]always be able to find something to keep them going because I mean they go to school get home from
[15:55]school get sent to school wear a mask don't do this god don't talk to each other don't go and
[15:59]dividers go you know it's been like a really it's been an interesting few years so I think just
[16:05]showing other people that you know you can smile even though sometimes it doesn't feel like you're
[16:09]always smiling yes I totally agree I think now without a sense of humor you're kind of stranded
[16:17]yeah there's no there's nothing else either you cry all day or you laugh and you see both so you
[16:24]see people that are crying a lot in the past while still crying but or both you know yes absolutely
[16:32]so what what were some of your other thing I like I see this whole expansion that you're doing with
[16:37]your brand which I find really interesting right you have so where are we going with this tell me
[16:42]some things that are on the horizon or things maybe you decided not to do or you know some of the
[16:47]people one super random thing that I think is very relatable to your podcast is we're pitching in
[16:53]a rata kabook as we speak I don't even know for a lot to write that to say that but in a fantasy
[17:02]you know I think that fantasy and like dreams and possibilities and like different ways of thinking
[17:10]are just so needed right now because I feel like you know never has something like a fantasy world
[17:15]been so important and I think that that's kind of what kept us going was like you know our whole
[17:20]brand is built on possibility and dreams that no one thinks is possible and when we said we wanted
[17:25]to go on tour one day it wasn't called tour it was like let's just throw one big epic party with a
[17:30]whole bunch of people so we can get together and have fun and it became a tour and I think that
[17:34]as you grow up you begin to lose that possibility of dreams and you begin to you know take on
[17:39]whatever one says is impossible and for us I think that the goal is to have dreams and make them
[17:46]crazy and go as far as you can with them and see what happens and literally I wrote an email one
[17:52]day in the middle of the pandemic to our agent our book agent and I said to him he's a man
[17:58]he's fairly successful and I was like I'm gonna write a radical book is like I'll call you tomorrow
[18:02]let's get let's get this on the road but I was like sounds great and I it was so weird to write
[18:07]it because I don't even real I read I've read it like it's not it's such a random genre for us
[18:12]but I was like it's missing you know like it was in a Howard like the Rodica
[18:17]or like a Rodica like not for romance and fantasy not a lot of actual like when you think
[18:22]a Rodica that's not like it's not like the god it's not like the it's not butter guy on the
[18:28]front of what it was the same he was blonde come on god Fabio Fabio Fabio you know what I mean
[18:36]not like it's like very very different but I just think that a big part of our self exploration
[18:41]for women that have been married for a while that have a half children earn a different
[18:46]phase of their lives I'm speaking this into truth so I'm trying to talk about it so that when it
[18:51]happens we can look back and say remember when we have this wild dream to have this area that is
[18:57]untouched and women and go for it and so we can do it we we we we we we just why we love wine we're
[19:03]like I wish we had our own wine why you know why do we have future never really fun well we can
[19:08]actually create from the bottom up are very even talking about that for a long time too and we
[19:14]launch it February 14th and it is a California Rosé and white and we have it here we've
[19:20]been drinking cases of it here in Florida cases and it's nice and light and crisp and it's sort
[19:26]of like a crowd pleaser it's like nothing you know you don't have to be too fancy to like it it's
[19:31]or you know too much about it yes easy wine to drink sipping wines perfect for it that's amazing
[19:37]what's it called I want to buy it it is coming out there very 14th and it's called twin truths
[19:42]love it's been truths because it's actually good I know I say that I'm not supposed to but a lot
[19:48]of people will just put their name on something no we created we went to the winery we tasted
[19:52]thousands of different notes of why we worked with a million I like a really expensive Rosé like
[19:58]really expensive and like third
[20:00]three dollars in Canada.
[20:01]My husband was like, you don't even like drinking,
[20:03]like that, like, you can't have an expensive wine
[20:06]if you haven't tasted a lot of wines,
[20:08]but that's the only one I really liked.
[20:09]There's two or three that I like.
[20:11]So, too.
[20:12]So, I, when I, I would try to million
[20:15]and I was like, this is actually delicious.
[20:18]So, I'm very excited.
[20:20]All right, twin truths, I'm getting away.
[20:22]Yeah, maybe I can do like a giveaway or something.
[20:25]Yeah, yeah.
[20:26]I don't know if you can give away wine though.
[20:28]Oh, shoot.
[20:29]Okay.
[20:30]I don't know if she can, but I don't know if she can.
[20:31]I don't know if she can.
[20:33]And it's gonna be online.
[20:34]So, it's not in the stores.
[20:35]You can easily just get it, get it, ship it online,
[20:37]have it on reoccurring monthly subscription
[20:40]as I do with my wine.
[20:42]And then we have a bunch of like,
[20:44]we'll be going back on tour
[20:46]and Natalie tells us what we're doing.
[20:48]I'm like, wow, we're doing a lot.
[20:49]I think that the, that we have every day,
[20:53]we have a new idea and it just depends on what road
[20:55]we decided to go down with it,
[20:57]but we've kind of taken these past two weeks
[20:59]to like just, just like regroup
[21:02]and we got our kids on a beach in Florida as we speak.
[21:06]And I think we're just sort of like,
[21:08]getting ready before the storm comes,
[21:10]the good storm as Natalie's gonna be the most brilliant storm.
[21:13]This is the 10 day calm before it.
[21:15]I told Kat, I'm like, get ready.
[21:18]Families, get ready.
[21:19]We're scared.
[21:21]We may not be home a lot.
[21:22]No, we will be home.
[21:23]We'll just start, we'll be busy.
[21:25]Finally traveling.
[21:26]That's awesome.
[21:28]I feel like I relate in that I'm like,
[21:30]always having ideas and I have like this whole list
[21:32]of like big ideas I don't have time for, right?
[21:35]Like there are just so many things that sound fun.
[21:37]And then of course the new idea always sounds more fun
[21:39]than just like continuing to execute on the old idea.
[21:42]Yeah.
[21:43]There's a bonus to having a partner, right?
[21:45]Because when you say it to someone else
[21:47]and if you agree it's a good idea,
[21:49]then you kind of can hold yourself accountable to that.
[21:52]We also have a group which is sort of like
[21:54]an extension of our brand
[21:55]and not so much Kat and that,
[21:56]but it's called the common parent.
[21:58]And it's where we bring in experts into the platform
[22:01]who talk about like the topics that are like tangible,
[22:04]not overarching.
[22:05]Because I think a lot of parenting books are amazing,
[22:07]but to get through a whole parenting book
[22:09]often the problems gone by the time you get through.
[22:11]Well, so I have time to read books.
[22:13]And by the time that we bring in,
[22:16]kind of speakers who do quick hit webinars
[22:18]to grasp the topic and give you actionable items to execute.
[22:23]And having been a social worker previously
[22:26]before we started this,
[22:27]I feel like that's what's missing
[22:29]is these items that you can put in your toolbox
[22:32]versus, you know, big concepts.
[22:34]So, and we used to think that it was like so hard
[22:37]having babies and toddlers,
[22:38]but then we realized the issues
[22:40]that we're dealing with as parents are a lot bigger
[22:42]and more important and long lasting.
[22:44]And we don't have time to read 10 books.
[22:46]We just need quick hits of how to handle this stuff.
[22:49]Totally get it.
[22:50]I mean, it's funny because you're on the road
[22:53]and outward facing very fun mom,
[22:57]like always laughing personas,
[22:58]I feel like hide the fact that you're like very shrewd
[23:01]business women building a business, right?
[23:04]It's like the secret truth that it's not in the book.
[23:07]I know, we do talk a lot about it in the podcast
[23:10]in the mom truth podcast.
[23:11]Oh yeah, it's interesting that people,
[23:16]you know what, we work hard in terms of ideas
[23:20]and not being afraid to take risks.
[23:23]So we don't get stuck in a lot of the steps
[23:25]that a lot of people take and get stuck in.
[23:27]We don't think through a lot of things
[23:29]because I think we're not afraid to fail.
[23:30]And if someone wants to ask us
[23:32]what were our biggest failures,
[23:34]I don't know if we can necessarily answer that
[23:36]because I don't think we've quote unquote failed.
[23:38]I think that we've learned from everything we've done
[23:41]because there has been no road before us really.
[23:43]We started this before social media was this epic huge platform.
[23:49]So I do feel like, you know, each day we wake up
[23:53]and we grind and we have some some reasons somehow
[23:57]we have a lot of capacity.
[23:59]So we've got a lot of room for all of the kids.
[24:01]The husbands are extended family, business, travel,
[24:05]like we and we at the end of the day,
[24:07]you know, we still have time to have some fun,
[24:09]which means there's also probably
[24:10]we're not having fun, it's not worth it.
[24:12]You know, if you're not making memories, we'd be out.
[24:15]So I think we're very fortunate
[24:18]that social media did come along
[24:21]and we were able to create, you know,
[24:22]a platform for free without having to invest in a massive,
[24:27]although I just read all about NFTs this morning
[24:29]and that was just a bit much for me at the moment,
[24:32]you know, so hard and fast and furious.
[24:37]And I'm like, yes, just when we almost have a million
[24:39]on TikTok and I think we're good
[24:41]and we've mastered another platform.
[24:43]Guess what?
[24:45]Another one's coming down the book, you know, like,
[24:48]and 3D web and 2D web and I was just like,
[24:51]here we go again, you know, like it's,
[24:54]as entrepreneurs, I'm sure you can relate
[24:55]every time a new platform comes up
[24:57]where like you start hearing the wrong lanes,
[24:58]you're just like, you know, it's another thing to do.
[25:02]And it's not like you get to let go of another one.
[25:05]You have to add another one in.
[25:07]It's probably the hardest part of it
[25:08]is mastering new platforms as they come in
[25:12]and keeping up to date with all of these things
[25:16]as you're making me happy.
[25:18]No, I've been thinking about NFTs.
[25:20]So I'm like, oh, well, maybe there'll be something cool there.
[25:22]Like, what could that be?
[25:23]What would that look like, you know?
[25:25]Yeah, I know.
[25:26]My husband was telling me, yeah, anyway.
[25:28]Yeah, no, I decided I had to start researching.
[25:30]So I did.
[25:32]But, yes, there's always something new coming,
[25:33]but not, yeah, anyway, it's a struggle.
[25:38]Well, so what advice on the writing side at least?
[25:41]How do you write?
[25:42]Like, what advice do you have in writing together?
[25:44]And what would you have?
[25:45]What advice would you have for people
[25:47]who are out there trying to write their own version
[25:50]of their mom truths or mom answers frankly?
[25:53]So, well, for us, the way our book is written,
[25:56]it really has a lot of it is a better conversation
[25:59]between two best friends and being open and honest about it.
[26:02]So for us, our format in both books
[26:04]were sort of like that storytelling
[26:06]are honest, like, are honest stories or real stories.
[26:09]So even though they, a lot of them have happened
[26:12]in the past, it's just about not overthinking the stories,
[26:15]putting them out there.
[26:16]There's so much editing that comes later,
[26:19]but just putting your ideas and your stories and stories
[26:21]that you haven't told yet before anywhere else.
[26:23]And you wanna put them out there,
[26:25]cause you know that it's gonna resonate with other people
[26:27]because if you've been through an experience,
[26:29]you're not the only one who has.
[26:31]So to just share the things that, you know,
[26:34]maybe before you were afraid to share,
[26:36]you realize that other people need it
[26:38]to hear it too, to feel normal and to be able to laugh at it.
[26:41]I think also, I mean, I know maybe in terms of a book,
[26:45]I think that people can,
[26:46]also there's so many options now
[26:48]where you're not getting so bogged down
[26:50]in terms of like, you know, I think that part of social media
[26:54]you can do micro blogs and books
[26:56]to see what people feel about your content,
[26:59]while you're writing it, so you're not spending,
[27:01]you know, a ton of money investing into a book
[27:03]or, you know, like there's so many ways
[27:05]you can gauge the content that you're writing
[27:07]to see the feedback from it
[27:08]before you put it down onto everything.
[27:10]And I think that's how we started
[27:12]was through our, someone found us on social media
[27:16]our agent mailed us on social media
[27:17]and was like, you guys should write a book
[27:19]and we're like, pardon.
[27:21]So I think that people who have, you know,
[27:23]would really wanna write a book,
[27:25]it's a long process for some of us
[27:27]and it's not necessarily a linear,
[27:30]like it's not one way to do it.
[27:32]You don't always have to pitch a book and write a book
[27:34]to get it to be a book.
[27:36]And I think sometimes take a risk, don't overthink it
[27:40]because social media is a beautiful free place
[27:42]to write things and see how your audience grows from it
[27:46]and then you really do begin to build your own distribution
[27:49]of selling and writing a book.
[27:52]So if you are passionate about being an author,
[27:54]we actually know someone in our life
[27:56]who is a great writer
[27:58]and it's always pitching and writing books
[28:00]but doesn't have a social media platform
[28:02]and I think to myself, if this person
[28:04]just maybe wrote a smaller things
[28:06]and they could grow an audience to see what resonated
[28:08]and it doesn't always have to be a personal diary.
[28:11]It can be, you know, TikTok now.
[28:13]I hate to say it has fictional stories on there
[28:16]that lead to the actual book.
[28:18]So they get their writers to or actors to act out the book
[28:22]and like see more, you get a girl in the story
[28:25]and they're like, it's a book and I'm like, genius.
[28:27]Like, you know, genius.
[28:29]So there's so many creative ways
[28:31]to get out what you want to do.
[28:33]I think look outside the box rather than looking at
[28:36]how it was done, look at how you can do it now.
[28:39]You know, I started my un-publishing company.
[28:41]It's called Zibi books and I'm changing up the whole
[28:44]like trying to change up the way it all works
[28:46]to make it better for writers
[28:47]and to create authors as brands
[28:49]and give them all the tools they need for social media
[28:52]and marketing and publicity
[28:53]because all that is so important to be an author.
[28:55]So yeah, changing daily, right?
[28:59]Yep.
[28:59]And changing daily.
[29:00]Also being able to be prepared
[29:02]that you can't just put a book out there
[29:04]and think you're going to be an everyone best seller.
[29:06]Marketing is so important
[29:07]in how much you're committed to marketing your book.
[29:10]Yes.
[29:11]And it's not over just because it came out two months ago.
[29:13]That's right.
[29:14]I know they give you 30 days and they're like,
[29:17]and you're like, what?
[29:19]It's so funny.
[29:20]It's not a seller.
[29:21]Yeah, it needs time.
[29:23]Like everything.
[29:24]All right.
[29:25]Well, it was so great chatting with you.
[29:27]Thank you so much for spending the time with me
[29:28]and giving the kids a day and everything.
[29:31]But we're looking at us.
[29:32]I don't know if you can see.
[29:33]Oh, wow.
[29:34]I'm so jealous.
[29:35]I guess that's what I've been looking at.
[29:37]I give you see my eyes wandering past.
[29:39]Yeah, I'm just looking at the ocean.
[29:40]I just keep looking at them.
[29:42]You know, because in the four days we're back to snow.
[29:44]Yeah.
[29:45]OK.
[29:46]Well, enjoy your time.
[29:47]Thank you.
[29:49]All right.
[29:49]Take care.
[29:50]Bye.
[29:52]Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms.
[29:54]Don't have time to read books.
[29:56]Don't forget to follow me on Instagram
[29:58]at the BONs and at Moms.
[30:00]I'm time to read books.
[30:01]Also sign up for my newsletter at zibbowens.com
[30:03]and sign up for my virtual book club
[30:05]and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week.
[30:08]Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Textures Sound
[30:10]for the Sound Editing.
[30:12]And thank you to Morning Moon Productions
[30:13]for providing this fantastic intro and outro music.