Stephanie V.W. Lucianovic and Vashti Harrison, HELLO, STAR
[0:01]Hi, this is Vivi Owens, and you're listening to the award-winning podcast,
[0:05]Momstone Have Time to Read Books.
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[0:35]Okay, now back to this amazing podcast.
[0:38]Vashti Harrison and Stephanie B. W. Lucianovic are the co-authors,
[0:43]illustrators of Hello Star.
[0:45]Stephanie is the author of the end of something wonderful,
[0:48]a practical guide to a backyard funeral,
[0:51]and the middle grade novel, The League of Picky Eaters.
[0:53]She has been a contributor to the New York Times motherload blog,
[0:56]The Washington Post Entertainment Weekly, CNN's E-Tocracy,
[1:00]The Atlantic Wire, and more.
[1:01]Stephanie lives in the Bay Area.
[1:03]Vashti Harrison is a number one,
[1:05]New York Times bestselling creator of Little Leaders,
[1:08]Bold Women in Black History, Little Dreamers,
[1:10]Visionary Women Around the World, and Little Legends,
[1:12]Exceptional Men in Black History.
[1:14]She's also the illustrator of Lupita Nyongo's Soulway,
[1:17]and Matthew Cherry's Hair Love, among others.
[1:20]She earned her BA in Studio Art and Media Studies
[1:22]from the University of Virginia,
[1:23]and her MFA in film slash video from CalArts,
[1:26]where she snuck into animation and illustration classes
[1:29]to learn from Dizzy and DreamWorks Legends.
[1:31]Welcome, Stephanie.
[1:32]And Vashti, thanks so much for coming on Mom's
[1:35]and have time to read books to discuss
[1:37]your collaboration, Hello Star, a beautiful, beautiful,
[1:40]children's book.
[1:41]Thanks so much for having us.
[1:43]This is Vashti, how it's going.
[1:45]I'm Stephanie, Lucianovic, and this is my first interview
[1:50]for this book for our Hello Star.
[1:53]Yay.
[1:54]I feel like Publaces put me first because I'm like,
[1:57]so I'm not traditional on interview work,
[1:59]because I really just do this for fun, and I love it,
[2:01]and I'm pretty laid back about everything, so I don't know.
[2:05]Nice, nice, and gentle.
[2:06]Well, tell listeners a little bit about your children's book,
[2:10]and Stephanie, I was wondering as I read it,
[2:12]like, have you been interested in this field of research
[2:15]and science and astronomy and all of that for a long time,
[2:19]or is it just that's what peaks your interest
[2:21]to explain what the book is sort of about,
[2:23]and then how YouTube teamed up
[2:25]and how you came to this topic yourself.
[2:27]Well, so the book is about a girl
[2:30]who has sort of empathy for a dying star
[2:34]that she sees way out in space.
[2:36]It's going supernova, and her mother explained
[2:38]that that means it's dying, and she's worried about it.
[2:42]She thinks the star is going to be lonely as a child,
[2:45]and her interest in the star puts her on a path of discovery
[2:49]and dedication with the dimming light acting
[2:52]as her guide the entire way, her entire journey.
[2:56]And I won't spoil the ending.
[2:58]This is not something that I would have come to naturally.
[3:02]My husband is the space person.
[3:04]My husband's a, he's a math professor,
[3:07]and he used to want to be an astronaut,
[3:09]and he was a physicist at some point,
[3:12]and our oldest boy, Henry, came to me
[3:16]with all of his interest that he was developing in space
[3:19]at the time.
[3:20]He was very space obsessed.
[3:21]He could name all the planets.
[3:22]He could name all the planets moons and what they were made of
[3:24]and everything.
[3:25]And one night he came to me and he said,
[3:28]did you know that stars die?
[3:31]Isn't that sad?
[3:32]And I knew that stars died.
[3:35]I knew what supernovas were,
[3:36]but I had never thought of it as being a sad thing
[3:39]because I'm an adult, and I don't tend to think those
[3:43]in those terms.
[3:44]But after he said that, I started thinking like,
[3:47]what would a child do with that kind of emotion,
[3:49]that sadness, would they take care of it like a pet?
[3:52]Like how would they act on it?
[3:54]And that night,
[3:57]literally that night, I sat down and I wrote the first draft
[4:00]and it was one of those nights
[4:02]where I was at the kitchen table.
[4:03]Dinner had just ended and I had my laptop off out
[4:06]and my husband was like, okay, mommy's writing,
[4:09]and he like took Henry away
[4:12]and they left me alone for us, which was nice.
[4:16]So that was 2015 is when I wrote that
[4:22]and I had it rejected at least 10 times
[4:25]by various editors I submitted to and including my agent
[4:28]who later became my agent.
[4:30]She rejected it at the time,
[4:31]unless she wasn't my agent then.
[4:33]And then I had a new agent in 2016
[4:37]who loved Hello Star like right away, just loved it
[4:42]and by 2017 she submitted it.
[4:45]And around this time in 2017,
[4:48]I became aware of that she's art.
[4:50]I was seeing it on Twitter.
[4:51]I had started following her.
[4:53]I was totally just really taken in by how she created
[4:59]and portrayed reflecting light in her art.
[5:02]And I think anytime I ever said anything on Twitter,
[5:04]it was like the light,
[5:06]it's the way she captured there was,
[5:07]I remember there was these princess dresses
[5:10]that had the light filtering through tool.
[5:13]You could see the tool over the actual dress
[5:15]and I was just like, oh my God.
[5:17]So and then I was following Matthew Cherry
[5:21]and I backed my first and only Kickstarter for hair love
[5:24]in 2017.
[5:26]I got an offer for Hello Star in 2018 from Little Brown
[5:31]and my editor came to me with let's talk about illustrators
[5:35]and she had ideas and I had ideas and I'm like,
[5:38]but I don't know if this would ever happen
[5:41]because she's probably in demand
[5:42]and I said, do you think Fashty Harrison would be interested
[5:46]and she's like, she's a little brown author,
[5:48]that's an interesting idea, you know, we'll see.
[5:50]And then it was a couple of months later that she called me
[5:53]and she's like, you need to sit down.
[5:56]Fashty's gonna be the illustrator
[5:57]and I screamed and all that kind of stuff.
[5:59]So that's how that happened.
[6:01]Amazing.
[6:02]I'm actually really surprised that it was rejected
[6:05]because the writing of this children's book.
[6:08]I mean, it's so beautiful.
[6:10]It's like a literary children's book.
[6:12]The way you write about, you know,
[6:14]the velvety sky and the pillows of clouds
[6:17]and the words that you choose, like this doesn't,
[6:20]this is not like, it's unique and it's voice
[6:23]and it's beauty of the language.
[6:25]And I think like that's sort of like
[6:27]ethereal way of like writing in the sky
[6:30]and then the illustrations to boot.
[6:32]It's like, I don't know, I'm surprised.
[6:34]I would have, if I had read this as a manuscript,
[6:36]I would have been like, yes.
[6:38]Well, that's thank you.
[6:39]That's really kind.
[6:40]It definitely was a book that when I wrote it,
[6:43]I knew I was using lyrical voice
[6:45]but I also worried I was breaking a lot of rules
[6:48]because one of the rules is like,
[6:49]you're not supposed to have adult characters
[6:51]and she grows up.
[6:53]And another rule was that it was over 900 words
[6:56]when I submitted it and they tried to preach
[6:58]to picture book writers that your text needs
[7:01]to be like 500 words.
[7:03]Both of my books that have come out
[7:04]have been over 900 when they were given offers on.
[7:07]So, you know, I do break rules.
[7:09]But it always had my heart in a way
[7:12]that I was not gonna give up on it.
[7:13]I've given up on other rejected manuscripts,
[7:16]but that one, I did stop submitting it to people.
[7:19]I did stop showing it to people after a while
[7:21]but when I had a new age and I was like,
[7:22]well, I wonder what you would think of this
[7:25]and she instantly was like, I love it.
[7:27]Let's do some fine tuning and stuff like that.
[7:30]So, that was amazing.
[7:33]And then the editor Deirdre said,
[7:34]she couldn't stop crying over it.
[7:36]And so, you know, she loved it.
[7:38]And it was obviously validating after the rejections.
[7:44]Yeah, it's a goosebumpe giver.
[7:46]I feel like that should be an indicator.
[7:47]Instead of like, those tomatoes, you know what I mean?
[7:50]I feel like it should be the amount of goosebumps
[7:52]that a book produces.
[7:54]And Vashid, tell me about getting involved in this project.
[7:57]Why did you pick it?
[7:58]Yeah, well, I'm surprised by that backstory as well
[8:01]because I was not aware that they had written it
[8:05]so long ago, I mean, gosh, time flies.
[8:07]So, your son was really little then
[8:10]when he came up with the idea.
[8:11]Yeah, and I, the idea that it was rejected so many times.
[8:15]I mean, that's a great backstory
[8:17]because it's a beautiful book.
[8:18]And I was really excited to receive the manuscript
[8:22]when my agent brought it to me from Deirdre.
[8:27]You know, it's interesting.
[8:30]You're right, I have been super busy working on so many
[8:33]kind of like high profile books.
[8:35]And what's really great about that is, you know,
[8:39]working with big, neat people
[8:41]and having those books out in the world
[8:43]and getting like a lot of attention behind it.
[8:46]But also like they were just on such incredible deadlines
[8:49]and like very narrow, strict opportunities
[8:55]for creativity, you know, like, you know,
[8:58]when you're trying to create a property or build a brand,
[9:01]you want to stay within that brand
[9:03]and something like hair love.
[9:06]I needed to make sure the characters were very, I don't know,
[9:10]clear and specific enough to go along with the film
[9:15]that it was also being produced.
[9:16]And then the other book that I was working on right before
[9:19]that was so away.
[9:21]And that one obviously had like a celebrity attached
[9:25]so there was a lot of like narrow boundaries that I had.
[9:30]And so one of the first things that I asked when I received
[9:35]the manuscript was, can I do whatever I want?
[9:38]And they said, yes.
[9:39]And I said, that's a great selling point.
[9:42]I mean, if anyone is familiar with my artwork,
[9:45]you know that I love drawing stars and people
[9:50]looking up at the stars and journeying into the stars.
[9:52]So that was an easy sell for me,
[9:54]but it was the opportunity to take my time and slow down
[9:59]and really.
[10:00]get to experiment with the art and the art style that sold me on on taking on this project because
[10:07]you know in in the past I had ideas for the middle grade book that I would write about about the
[10:12]stars about about really filling empathy for the earth and taking care of our planet and I'm
[10:18]really grateful that lots and lots of people are writing those books because I don't know if I
[10:23]would have had the time to do it. I'm appreciative of the opportunity to get to collaborate with people
[10:28]who have you know perspective and the words that I don't necessarily have so I was thinking about
[10:35]how I could focus you know some of that creative energy towards this book while you know saving some
[10:41]for for the future while making sure not to overlap with projects that I've already done and because
[10:48]I love drawing girls in space and girls looking up into the sky that well is never going to be empty
[10:56]in terms of creativity for me so again yeah that selling point the exciting opportunity for me was to
[11:02]just slow down so there was a few months probably around last year where I just did sample upon
[11:12]sample I chose a couple of different spreads to try to figure out what kind of art style I would use
[11:18]because every book that I've done up into this point has been fully digital so done completely
[11:23]on the computer in Photoshop and that is I don't know if I should say like my typical
[11:28]idea it's my typical way of working it's not necessarily my preferred way of working but it is the
[11:31]fastest way I've worked and I've had I don't know like 12 9 10 10 books in the last four years so
[11:40]I've had to go really really fast and so everything has been digital and it's just such an
[11:46]interesting feeling to be kind of like a tether to your computer to this like cumbersome drawing
[11:51]tablet you have to stay here you have to wait till the sun goes away and put the sun blocking
[11:58]curtains up and just sit in the dark and for this book I could open up my windows and work wherever
[12:03]I want and do my sketches and in some of like the videos that I shared you guys might be able to see
[12:10]maybe in other places maybe we can send you can put it on your in your blog this would be
[12:16]I just have lots and lots of pictures of all the different samples I did I did one in like color
[12:20]pencils and pastels and what oil pastels and chalk pastels and gouache and digital and colored
[12:29]pencil with digital on top of it so it was really fun to be able to really think about how the
[12:36]medium can help extend and expand on the story and you know provide a different type of texture
[12:44]and feeling for how to you know enter into the story so you know I think it's it's really
[12:53]difficult no difficult not the word it takes a lot of time and care to try to manipulate digital
[13:00]illustration to feel different ways it can often feel the same unless you're paying special
[13:08]attention towards the textures that you're putting on there and and it it is work to do that and
[13:15]so it's just a really amazing opportunity to kind of see how the different media can make the
[13:24]story feel different when you flip through these images I think I did probably like six or seven
[13:29]of the same drawing of an early spread of of the moment where the mother tells the child
[13:36]about the star and so they're reading a book and so you know you can see how that story the tone
[13:44]shifts and and feels different through the different media eventually after all of these different
[13:51]tests I landed on using colored pencil with digital color on top so I did everything I actually did
[13:59]all of the sketches digitally I printed them out and then I on just like really simple printer
[14:07]paper I put chalk pastel on the back and then made a transfer onto my like a smooth Bristol paper
[14:16]and then did colored pencils to do all of the value I actually ended up doing them all in red
[14:21]so if you ever see images of those originals they're all red because I wanted something that was
[14:27]like a medium value that wasn't if I if I use black I would go too black if I use something too
[14:33]light it wouldn't get dark enough so I used a medium I could have used a medium gray but I had red
[14:37]so I did and so I once that's all done I scanned that and put it into the computer and
[14:45]manipulated the color and added all the other colors on top of it so you're looking at the cover
[14:50]of the book behind Stephanie that original sketch and that original sketch was just red
[14:58]here I'm going to share my screen so we can look at the cover real quick here yeah yeah
[15:03]so again this looks like LA by the way is that what this is based on just you know I was
[15:08]going for a mix of like LA Houston you know there are not too many hills in Houston but I was
[15:14]trying to give that sprawl of the city oh my so both my kids think it's LA because well we live
[15:20]in the Bay Area it's very cinematic LA but I was like I always click I'm like no she lives next to
[15:29]the ocean we have that picture of her in the house there's an ocean there right isn't that
[15:33]so I was convinced that that was actually the sparkling sea maybe I'm wrong that she lives next
[15:40]to the ocean maybe that's actually the city I don't remember the ocean it's the
[15:45]yeah so for me that's the city but but I wanted it you know in my head sometimes I build up a
[15:51]whole backstory so I was like well you know there are some some hints of like you know space culture
[15:59]like maybe mom is like working at the base maybe live in Houston maybe then you're living
[16:05]the Johnson space center like you know in my in my fabricated world it's some some cross between
[16:12]like us falling Los Angeles with hills and and like nearest space center and the ocean
[16:18]so Derek came to me our editor came to me at some point and was like so Vashty has some
[16:23]questions and it was all about where do you see this character living what's her background
[16:29]where did her parents work where does her mother work and see when you're a picture book writer
[16:33]you're told you don't have any of that in your head you're I mean you're not supposed to because
[16:39]that's all what the illustrator brings to it like you're not supposed I mean you can have
[16:44]a backstory but the true backstory of this to be completely honest besides my son's interest who
[16:52]was in first grade at the time and he's now going into seventh my husband is because he's the
[16:58]space fanatic was like you know I asked him has there been a supernova that we could see
[17:02]and he's like yes it's called supernova 1987 or SN 1987 and he said it was seen
[17:09]in 1987 and people wrote about it in the paper you can only see in the southern hemisphere you
[17:14]couldn't see it where he lived in the DC area and so that's how I took like the core of truth and
[17:19]then obviously made it completely fictional because well I mean supernova 1987 you can still
[17:26]actually they're still seeing remnants they still see life stars continuing to happen post
[17:32]the supernova but only with telescope so for me I was like oh okay well the true backstory is
[17:39]this but you know I kind of felt like she could be anywhere and had a parent who had an interest
[17:46]in looking up questions for her like a parent who's like well you know I don't know that answer let's
[17:50]look that up now we did on the internet but you know back in the day it was newspapers or books or
[17:55]something like that encyclopedia just to date myself here a little bit yes in my parents like you know
[18:04]office place pulling out the like magic yeah well this is just gorgeous yeah I love that you
[18:11]can't tell if it's a city or the water here it's so cool I'm actually in LA as I'm doing this
[18:16]interview and gotcha I have a view sort of similar to this of the city sort of because we're up
[18:21]on this hill so I'm gonna vote for a city but you know I mean one thing that I do and all of my
[18:27]work in my books is kind of you know build the house that I won't live in so the space that doesn't
[18:33]exist the view that I want so it's a little bit of a oh it would be so cool to be the little kid
[18:41]being able to climb a tree and seeing this incredible view in front of you so it's that aspirational
[18:47]quality to just you know make up the world that doesn't quite exist next time you are in LA
[18:53]you are coming over here if I happen to be down and you go we can have a little like you know
[18:58]city viewing party or something that's awesome well what an amazing collaboration I mean
[19:05]how exciting and how does this definitely like dovetail with your previous work so it only had
[19:11]one picture book come out and it was I mean it was very different in the sense that some point
[19:19]I got the sketches I got the character sketches from my editor and pretty much immediately
[19:24]the illustrator George sent me a direct message and he was like have you seen them yet
[19:28]I can change anything you want and I was like oh we're not supposed to talk
[19:32]but there's this whole like yeah unwritten rule of keeping I mean this I know it doesn't
[19:37]happen all the time I know plenty of illustrators and authors do talk but for me they're with
[19:42]the rules and the rules where you don't you're not supposed to really communicate in case you
[19:48]influence or say something wrong so I remember just responding saying like I haven't seen them yet
[19:54]I had and I love them but I wanted to be very careful I was like but thank you I mean I did
[19:59]love them I
[20:00]I think there was a few things that got changed,
[20:03]but it was something the editor had already noted
[20:05]to be changed.
[20:06]It had to do with having adults in the story at all,
[20:09]because it's about having factored funerals with pets.
[20:11]And a couple of the spreads had like kind of adult solving
[20:14]the problem, and that wasn't gonna work.
[20:17]And so George came up then with that end spread
[20:20]being something completely shocking to me,
[20:24]but amazing in an amazing way.
[20:26]And I started laughing and crying at the same time,
[20:28]because the way he ended the book was just perfect.
[20:31]And he just, that was great.
[20:32]So for this collaboration,
[20:36]it was definitely me on Twitter being like,
[20:38]ooh, there's something,
[20:39]that actually put something up about stars and space.
[20:42]And I wonder, I wonder if it's gonna be part of the book.
[20:45]And so there was kind of a me looking in the window
[20:48]and sometimes there'd be,
[20:49]that she would do process stuff more recently.
[20:53]You showed that she painted glass table,
[20:56]which like, I've never heard of that technique.
[20:59]I'm so completely fascinated by what illustrators do.
[21:02]It seems like an amazing mystery.
[21:05]And there's all these different medium
[21:08]and things that you guys use.
[21:10]And the glass table with the cat underneath it was like,
[21:13]wow, so that's another way that you can try to evoke something
[21:18]or try to, I don't know,
[21:19]that's a technique other than we look.
[21:22]Well, I was talking about the experiment.
[21:24]So Zivi, really early on,
[21:27]I thought that maybe I could make some of the backgrounds
[21:31]of outer space, of deep space with photographs
[21:34]because I have this highly pigmented
[21:37]and sparkly watercolor.
[21:39]And it looks best when it's wet.
[21:42]So I didn't wanna just like,
[21:44]put it right on the paper and it would stay flat.
[21:47]So I thought, okay, well, you know,
[21:48]I can work on glass or I could, you know,
[21:50]I tried plexi and I painted the back
[21:52]with like really matte black paint.
[21:54]And I was like, well, I could just work on glass
[21:56]and put black fabric or velvet in the background.
[21:59]I was thinking about, so I went to film school
[22:01]and I remember early long before film school,
[22:04]actually an undergrad me and my film cohorts
[22:08]were like little nerdy kids and like,
[22:09]did you see that new movie?
[22:11]So there was, I can't even remember the name of the film,
[22:13]but there is a cinematographer, Matthew Leet-Bateek
[22:16]who made the stars for this movie.
[22:19]I think it's called The Fountain, maybe.
[22:21]He made all the stars and the supernovas
[22:24]for this movie under a macro lens in a petri dish
[22:31]with chemical reactions.
[22:32]So I was like, I could do something like that for the stars.
[22:35]I could film it with my camera.
[22:37]I wanna be able to capture it while it's still moving.
[22:40]So maybe I'll do photographs or I could do high-res video
[22:43]and pull high-res frames from it.
[22:45]Maybe I'll rent like an Alexa camera or red camera,
[22:49]one that does really super high-res stuff.
[22:52]And I was just trying to test out
[22:55]at my parents' house in Virginia.
[22:57]And I used to like a clear glass table
[23:00]and my cats kept coming under me.
[23:03]So I was getting these shots that looked like cool
[23:06]deep space and then my cats in the background.
[23:08]When you said, I mean, I think I've heard you say
[23:12]in interviews before that you try to put cats
[23:15]in your book because you're yourself a cat person.
[23:18]And I know there's not a cat in this,
[23:20]I'm a cat person too.
[23:21]But I kind of think of that,
[23:22]that's how your cats got in this book.
[23:24]That would be so nice.
[23:26]I actually, I don't have a cat thing,
[23:29]but I might start adding that.
[23:30]I'm not like the best person at drawing animals,
[23:33]but I've been trying to force myself to do that more recently.
[23:36]But the thing that I do often incorporate
[23:39]is like a hot dad, this is really hot dad somewhere.
[23:43]And I did do a sketch of a potential dad
[23:46]for this book.
[23:48]But I really liked the relationship of just mom and child.
[23:52]And if dad somewhere around,
[23:54]he might be if mom somewhere around,
[23:56]they certainly didn't need it to move the story forward.
[24:01]But in one day, I'll release the sketch of hot dad.
[24:05]Oh, I'd love to see that.
[24:06]Sure, Stephanie's husband will love that.
[24:10]I very specifically wanted this to not be,
[24:12]when I started out, it was about a boy
[24:14]because it was about my son.
[24:16]And getting the information from my husband
[24:18]that I was like, there's too many male-specific Facebooks.
[24:23]And at the time, I mean, we've gotten much better,
[24:25]but this was 2015.
[24:26]So I very specifically wanted to change that up
[24:29]to have it be the mom who was knowledgeable.
[24:31]And it was a girl who was interested in all that.
[24:35]There is a beautiful memoir that came out last year.
[24:37]Maybe last year, her name is Sarah.
[24:40]I'm blanking her last name at this exact second.
[24:42]She's an astrophysicist.
[24:44]And it's Eric.
[24:45]Sarah Mack, is that what we're at?
[24:46]Yeah.
[24:47]It was a memoir.
[24:48]Is it a memoir where she talks about the end of the world,
[24:50]essentially?
[24:51]Or maybe not.
[24:52]Maybe I'm thinking of something else.
[24:53]It's about losing her husband and her relationship
[24:55]with her younger son.
[24:57]I don't know.
[24:57]She might be someone interesting for you guys
[24:59]to do an event with her talk to or something
[25:01]because she's so knowledgeable in this area
[25:04]and has been one of the leaders in the whole field.
[25:06]And her book was super beautiful as well.
[25:09]And I don't know.
[25:10]I think you guys would have a lot to talk about.
[25:12]But she'll definitely point out the scientific
[25:15]and accuracy at the end of the book,
[25:17]the things that are not actually possible to have a metaphor.
[25:22]But yeah, that would be cool.
[25:24]Awesome.
[25:25]Well, I'm so excited for your books to come out.
[25:28]Thank you so much for chatting with me today.
[25:30]Hello, star, September 21st, pub date.
[25:33]So exciting.
[25:34]And I'm so happy for the two of you
[25:37]that you got to work together and that,
[25:38]Bastia, you got to work your brilliant design brain
[25:41]and run through the eight million alternatives
[25:43]to arrive at the perfect medium to capture this beautiful story.
[25:48]And it's just so neat to hear your train of thought
[25:50]as you went through that.
[25:51]And for someone who has absolutely no artistic ability
[25:55]just to hear how you process that information
[25:58]and try and experiment.
[25:59]It's just the coolest.
[26:01]So amazing.
[26:02]Thank you to your son, Stephanie, for asking that question
[26:05]and giving me a great half an hour here.
[26:08]Well, thanks for having us to be my pleasure.
[26:11]All right, well, best of luck with the lunch.
[26:12]Thank you.
[26:13]Thank you.
[26:14]Bye.
[26:15]Bye.
[26:17]Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't Have
[26:19]Time to Read Books.
[26:20]Don't forget to follow me on Instagram, at Zebioans,
[26:23]and at Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[26:25]Also sign up for my newsletter at zebioans.com
[26:28]and sign up for my virtual book club
[26:30]and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week.
[26:32]Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Textures Sound
[26:35]for the Sound Editing.
[26:36]And thank you to Morning Moon Productions
[26:38]for providing this fantastic intro and outro music.