Raakhee Mirchandani + Holly Hatam, HAIR TWINS

[1:39]Zibby Owens: Hi. This is Zippy Owens, and you're listening to the award winning podcast, Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. I'm also the host of Moms Don't Have Time to Lose Weight, and I'm the editor of the anthology, which you should run out and buy, called Moms Don't Have A Quarantine Anthology. All proceeds of that book go to COVID nineteen Vaccine Research. And I'm the editor in chief of Moms Don't Have Time To Write, a new publication on Medium, and we're accepting submissions. So please send your personal essays there. And if all that isn't enough, you can follow me on Instagram at Zibby Owens, My website is zibbyowens.com. Okay. Now back to this amazing podcast. I am so thrilled that Ferity brand is back being my sponsor again because as many of you know because I talk about them a lot and I post about them a lot, Ferity is like my favorite clothing brand right now. It is fashionable enough that I always feel good wearing it, super comfortable, very forgiving, and just really cool. So I'm so excited they're my sponsor. You can get a discount with feritybrand.com/zippy and you'll get 20% off. Again, that's feritybrand.com/zippy. Get 20% off. And a few other things that you should know about Ferity aside from the fact that I'm living in their dresses for this summer is that they're a family run brand fueled by purpose and optimism. They make high quality, sustainably minded, feel good favorites that you'll be proud to wear. I certainly am. They believe in family, quality, sustainability, and community. Summer is in their DNA, and they've created many staples for the summer, sustainably minded with the highest of quality, comfort, and versatility, and all are made for life, which I can 100% attest to, and you should definitely go check it out. So again, fairetybrand.com/Zibby for 20% off. Go try it out. I recently did an Instagram live with Rocky Mercandani and Holly Hadham for the book Hair Twins. And I wanted to release it as an episode, and I hope it makes sense when you hear the different voices because their book is adorable. And also, I have so much respect for both Rocky, who is an awesome award winning writer and editor, and also Holly Hadham, the an amazing illustrator. So a quick bio about both of them. Rocky is an award winning writer and editor and the author of Super Satya Saves the Day. When she isn't writing, Rocky is either organizing her bookshelves, running races to raise money for kids with cancer, or styling her very curly hair with new potions, she lives in Hoboken, New Jersey with her husband and daughter, the inspiration for hair twins. She invites you to follow her on Twitter and Instagram at rockstarwrites, r a a k, by the way. Anyway, Holly Haddam is the illustrator of the number one New York Times bestselling books, Dear Girl, Dear Boy, and now also Dear Teacher. She also illustrated Unicorns Are Real made by Maxine and Jack, not Jackie. And Holly and I are collaborating on a really fun project that we can talk about at some point. She loves hugging trees, drinking tea, sniffing books, music, animations, and most importantly, unicorns. Hey, Rocky.

[4:47]Raakhee Mirchandani: How are you? I'm so good. How are you? I'm good. I saw you all over Barnes and Noble, by the way. Oh, that's so exciting. That is so cool. So what what happened? Wait. Wait. Hold on. Here's Holly. Let me let her in, but I wanna hear about Hi, Holly. Hi. How are you guys? Hi. How are you? So exciting. Wait. I was just saying to Rocky, I saw her all over Barnes and Noble. It was so cool. Oh, really? It's so exciting. I have, like, I keep like cruising the aisles at bookstores and Target like a creep and then watching people look at the book and then trying to casually be like, wrote that book. It is so awkward. I it is so absurd, but I keep doing it. I brought my daughter to Barnes and Noble when I saw it, like, actually out on a table and that was, like, buried on a top shelf with, like, one copy at a random bookstore. Anyway, and I, like, dragged her there and everybody who walked nearby was like, this is my book. Yeah. It's really good. And then I was like, wow, I can make a big difference if I just stayed here all day. All day. All day. Like sitting there, like organizing the shelves. They're like, lady, you work here? I mean, maybe? Yeah. Get a little badge. I highly recommend this. This is flying off the shelves.

[6:19]Raakhee Mirchandani: Whatever. That's okay. People bad. Yeah. They'll feel bad saying no to your face. You know? I'll I'll take your your sympathy book buy. You go for it. Oh, yeah. I'll double my sales at Barnes and Noble, that one book.

[6:51]Raakhee Mirchandani: Yeah. That's how I entertain. I'm sorry. The book is Hair Love. I'm not even promoting this. People are asking why we're even on this. I'm sorry. Why do I keep saying that? I'm so sorry. I've done this, like, 500 times. Hair twins. And I just before I got on, said it again. Hair twins. Now, of course. Well, okay. Tell me about your collaboration on this book and how it came to be and all of this good stuff. Rocky, go ahead. Oh, okay. Yeah. So I'm a huge Holly Haddam fan. I give Dear Girl as, like, my ultimate gift to everybody, to girls, to boys, adults, to to children. I love to give Dear Girl. I recently just gave Dear Teacher, but Dear Girl is, like, the book of my heart. And so I'm a big Holly Haddam fan. So when Little Brown I didn't realize, like, it's this collaborative process with finding an illustrator because I'm new. And they were like, how about Holly Haddam? I was like, wait. What? You guys know Holly Haddam? You think I can do this? You're so sweet. And they do. And she did. Aw. I love that. That is amazing. It's true story. I mean, Holly is a she's a legend. Her her illustrations in this book, it's they're ridiculous.

[8:00]Holly Hatam: Oh, and I remember the day she messaged me on Instagram. I still have a screenshot of it. I swear from that first day, it felt like I had known her forever.

[8:09]Raakhee Mirchandani: And she was like, I will be stalking you outside your house. Literally.

[8:20]Raakhee Mirchandani: Yeah. Aside from the restraining order, we would be hanging out.

[8:33]Raakhee Mirchandani: how did it work? Did you have the whole thing written and then Holly got started and, you know, what was it like seeing the first illustrations? And, Holly, what did you think when you first got it? What was your inspiration? Yes. So I had written the whole thing. I had worked with the Little Brown and my amazing editor, Sam, on this book. I wrote most of it at the bar at the court at Court Street in Hoboken, which is a strange place to write children's book, but that's where I did it. And people were watching, like, New York Giants games, and I was, like, on my laptop, and it was such a strange little thing. But it's a great bar, so I wrote a lot of it there. And so I wrote the whole thing, and then they sent it to Holly. Holly, then what happens? Then

[9:13]Holly Hatam: I read it and decide whether I wanna accept it or not. And, of course, as soon as I read it, I had to. I I was just crying and laughing through the entire read, and I knew I had to do it. I was so grateful that I that landed on my lap.

[9:27]Raakhee Mirchandani: How many do you get, Holly? Like, how many books submissions like, what percentage are we talking here? Is this, Harvard or are we in state school? It depends

[9:38]Holly Hatam: on the year. Some year, like, during COVID has been really good. Like, I've been doing well. Like, people are stuck at home, so all they're doing is consuming books and TV, and those are the two areas that I'm in, so it's great. Last year was really big just because I had five books come out. Usually, have five to seven a year, and I've turned down it hurts to turn down books, but I can't do them all, so I have to be really choosy, and I knew I had to do this one, and my schedule was so crazy to begin with. But I just I'm like, nope. I'm gonna fit it in here. I don't care. I'll kill myself,

[10:13]Raakhee Mirchandani: and I'll do it. I think that's the trick to getting everything done. Right? It's like, you you don't, like, evaluate if it makes any sense. It's just like somehow somehow it'll fit. We'll do it. Yeah. It'll get done. I don't care. I knew I would regret it if I turned it down.

[10:26]Holly Hatam: So I just I'm like, I'll just juggle things. I'll just, yeah, put in more hours if I get to do this book.

[10:34]Raakhee Mirchandani: Aw. That must feel good. The best. Making someone work against their will. Holly, I have never seen oh, my dad's here. Hi, dad. I never I've never seen a book like this one in some ways where there's so much magic in it in the illustrations, and there's so much love in in the in the relationship between the dad and the daughter that you can see when they're together. And it every time, every single time I read it to a class or I just happen to look through it to admire, like, what a genius I am. I'm I I am really amazed by things, like, that just hop off page. Like, look at this joy. So awesome. You know? And I I just Holly. Show show a few more pages. I, of course, read this book to the kids when I got it, and now it's, like, lost in all their books. And I was like, I have to find this before my Instagram live. I'm yeah. Anyway, I can see yours. It means it's getting used, which is a good thing. Was there a favorite illustration you have, Holly, or something that, like, a scene that when you read it, you were like, this is is so visual to me just reading the text? Well, all of the ones describing,

[11:49]Holly Hatam: like, her the ones where I got to make it all whimsical, like, the her Rocky's text was so yeah. My brain just I was so happy that I could mix in, like, magical, whimsical things. So those pages are my favorite, but my I have a print on this on my wall because Aw. I have hair envy. I wish my hair was like this. I'm trying.

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[15:25]Raakhee Mirchandani: I'm sure there's something, some flat iron at Ulta that does something like that, but I have to keep searching. Well, that's so exciting. So tell me about the marketing of the book with both of you together. Are you doing lots of events? What's it like collaborating? Like, do you get to strategize?

[15:43]Zibby Owens: Or is it more like I don't know. What what's it been like?

[15:47]Raakhee Mirchandani: We've done a couple together. We did The Swine. We've done that. We did wonderful bookstore event together, but I got to do something because Holly's Holly's in Canada and and I'm in New Jersey. I got to do an event in person at the park in Hoboken at Church Court Park. We had drag queen story hour, harmonica sunbeam. We had the mayor, Ravi Bala, and, like, tons and tons of Hoboken friends and family and neighbors and community folks. And the last year has been so hard to be alone and isolated. And the best part for me about being a children's book author is being together with kids and their families. And I kept thinking, oh my god. This book is gonna come out. This book that is so special to me. That is my literal heart song, and I'm going to have to celebrate it alone. And I was, like, really disappointed by that. But then I got to do something in person, like, with everybody. And it was such a moment I felt like of like, just being in the sunshine and feeling like, you know what? We're in a different place than we were, and we get to we get to do the thing that I think are perfect for, which is getting back together, you know, and and and forming communities. So we've done some things together, but I'm also doing another event at the Asbury Park Co op outside of London, which is so I'm like, anyone who's like, do you wanna do it in person? Yep. Yes. I You should've come here. I've done it. That's so silly. We should've done that. I'm vaccinated. I'll be there next time. Oh my gosh. I I'm forgetting to think about that as, like, even an option. My brain is, like, not even going there, and it should because we can now, I guess. Yeah. But it takes I hope that you want because it takes a minute to, like, retrain ourselves. Right? To, like, hug people, to smile at people, to take your mask down, and then just to, like, invite to, like, invite people back in your space. Mhmm. So true. So true. So this is such a great gift, by the way, for Father's Day. I'm sure you're all over that marketing angle of it, but I feel like it's such a great thing for anyone listening or watching or whatever to put on their list because it's such a sweet story of a father and daughter and that love and that special relationship. I mean, does this take you back to your own relationships at all with your dads? For me, this book is dedicated to my father and to my husband for that reason. I have a really close relationship with my father. I think he's on the sidegy life. And I I see the close relationship that's up there my daughter has with Ugan, and I think there's something really special and beautiful about a father daughter bond. And I've been really lucky and really blessed to have in my life. And I wanted to I really wanted to to memorialize for Satya, but also for my husband, Agen, that relationship that that relationship that they share that

[18:36]Zibby Owens: Oh, no. I can't hear. Oh, I thought it was just me. Okay.

[18:40]Raakhee Mirchandani: Maybe leave and come back. I don't know. This is like the Instagram. Oh, come back. Alright. How did this project compare for you, Holly, to some other ones you've done? Do you do some at a quicker pace? Do you use different materials? Like,

[18:55]Holly Hatam: how did this compare? All the books are digital. So everything I do the same. I use the same programs. This one took a lot longer. We went through, I think, rounds of revisions to just the sketches just to get it perfect just because we did have to be respectful of the traditions. And I had to research a lot on the tradition. So it did take longer than other books for me, but it was worth it. Awesome.

[19:22]Raakhee Mirchandani: Can we hear you now? That was so weird. That was so weird. I don't know. Instagram likes to keep us on our toes, you know. Yeah. Technology is so confounding to me. It's an hour. So I'm back anyway. Awesome. No. I had just asked Holly if this if the process of illustrating this book was different from some of her other books recently, you know, if it stood out. But I saw how you know, I Holly, I know you did some research, but I I wanted to just, like, show this page because I don't know. I think it's very special. But you see the daughter and you see her next to her father, and the father is tying his turban, which is something my husband does every day. And it's a step by step process. And Holly kinda broke it down in this really beautiful way where you anyone who I watch this every day. Right? So I know what it looks like. But anyone who hasn't seen this, like, you understand exactly what this man is doing every single day and how it works and how he ties it and what a turban looks like and what's under his turban, his hair. And I just think it's so special to be able to share this part of our community and our faith with everybody. And I think Holly did such like a perfect job of being able to show that in that in a way that is so easy to understand and to digest. Absolutely. Totally agree. So is Satya, does she just feel like a movie star at this point? I feel like she's like, you know, is her is her head just like floating above the clouds? Yes. Totally unbearable about it. I was like, I her teacher sent me like a photo of her and she was reading the book in front of the like, book wasn't even out yet. It was like gonna come out in couple days. And she did like a reading in front of the class and the teacher's like, oh, and then she answered a bunch of questions. I'm like, what? Did she do it? Did she do the first author bit?

[21:02]Raakhee Mirchandani: just had a busy year. Like, this book is under embargo. Do you not get the memo? They buy her Sharpies for signing books, and then she signed a my dad. They made her sign a bunch of books and then she did a tutorial for me about how to books.

[21:28]Raakhee Mirchandani: Wow. That's so Actually, that's such a good idea. You should like, outsource. You should have her as a resource. So like other authors who don't want to take the time to sign their books, they just be like,

[21:49]Raakhee Mirchandani: Oh my gosh. I don't know. I think there's a future here. It's a business opportunity. Anyway, I'm sorry for joking. Yes, we're getting comments how illustrations are so amazing and culturally authentic and it's so amazing. This is such an important book and it's so wonderful. I know we're just playing, but it is amazing. And it's always great to get a children's book that gives a viewpoint into a habit or a custom that you don't have in your own family and you don't have you know, we're not doing that with our hair, but, you know, all families are all people are alike. We all get dressed in the morning, and I feel like showing all those commonalities really helps, especially at a young age. And it's so important to do just that exposure and, you know, all of that builds empathy and everything that we need in our world so much, especially now. So I think it's very important and amazing. Well, thanks. And I think that's an important point you just made, Zippy, about this book is reflective of Bully, right, and our tradition and our faith. And so it's certainly a window into our life. But I really truly hope that anyone who reads this book, kids and grown up, that they feel like I do. Right? How to share a part of who they are and a part of their family with others. It took me a long time, four years, to be able to share my family with folks. I'm like, I don't want kids to wait that long. I want them to start now. I want them to read this book and be like, you know what? I have something cool about my family that I wanna share with you. I'm trying to think of anything I could share that would that would people might think was cool. Anyway But there's everyday things. It's this it's not it's not the big things. I mean, I say this school visits all the time, and I mean it sincerely. Right? It's not the big stuff. It's the things that we do every day that sort of like that that represent who we are and where we come from or food we eat or songs we listen to or all of those things. Right? So it's everyday moments, and this is an everyday moment for us. Yes.

[23:40]Zibby Owens: Our everyday moments might be inhaling chocolate chip cookies at, like, nine at night.

[23:45]Raakhee Mirchandani: Brings us together.

[23:48]Raakhee Mirchandani: Okay.

[23:50]Holly Hatam: Holly, what's an everyday moment of yours that we don't know about? That's interesting. I really don't know. I didn't say mine was interesting. I just said that it has. An everyday moment that I do every day. Something with your kids or something, you know, something at home or, I don't know, just something that you take for granted. I mean, I don't know. Reading, like, at the end of the night, all three of us just come together on the chaise, and we just sprawl out and read books together while we're, like, literally, we're on top of each other, like, sitting on each other's laps while reading our separate books. That's so beautiful.

[24:25]Raakhee Mirchandani: Yeah. There's, a whole book idea in there. Exactly. It's like reading like a sandwich, you know? It's like Yeah. Oh, yeah. Beautiful.

[24:35]Raakhee Mirchandani: ladies, this is so fun. Hold up your book again so everybody can see. Hair twins. Put your back. Hallie can tell you the front. Please everybody go get this. Get this for Father's Day. This is a great gift or just for now or just whenever or for your friends or whatever. For your school or because you love hair. Or because you have hair. If you have hair, you will like this book. Even if you don't. Even if you don't. And even even if you don't. Alright. Thank you. Thanks, guys. This is so fun. Always a great time. Next time in person. Yes. Bye. I'll be there.

[25:13]Zibby Owens: Thanks so much to Ferity Brand for being my sponsor again. Go to feritybrand.com/zibby for 20% off. Enjoy. Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at Zibby Owens and at moms don't have time to read books. Also, sign up for my newsletter at zibbyowens.com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week. Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound for the sound editing, and thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and outro music.