Shannon Lee, BE WATER, MY FRIEND
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[1:34]Shannon Lee is the author of Be Water My Friend, The Teachings of Bruce Lee, who was Shannon's father.
[1:41]Shannon is the CEO and owner of the Bruce Lee family companies and president of the Bruce Lee Foundation, as well as the daughter of the legendary martial artist and cultural icon Bruce Lee.
[1:51]Shannon's mission is to provide access to her father's philosophy and life through education and entertainment.
[1:56]She is the creator of Camp Bruce Lee through the Bruce Lee Foundation and has spoken at TED, TEDx and Creative Warnings.
[2:03]Shannon co-hosts the Bruce Lee podcast and executive producers, Cinemax's Warrior.
[2:09]Welcome Shannon to Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[2:12]Thank you. It's a pleasure to be here. It's a pleasure to have you.
[2:16]Water My Friend. By the way, this book cover is like my favorite like colors, image. This is like the most soothing, beautiful.
[2:24]I don't know. I love it. Don't you just love it? I do. I love it. And I and soothing is such a great word.
[2:29]And also like the feel of the book is really is really nice. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know how you make things happen like this.
[2:36]It's like the. Anyway, I won't I won't the label. I don't know. It just feels so good, especially because the inside so matches it.
[2:44]Right. It's so perfect for the content and you know, all of the amazing tips and advice and all the rest.
[2:50]So good. Now that I've started off on this train. So it's called Be Water My Friend, the teachings of Bruce Lee, who was your father.
[2:57]Yes. What made you decide to write this book? Why take all of his learnings? Why make it a book? Why dedicate your life to running his whole foundation and business around him.
[3:09]Tell me the whole story. Give you the whole story. I mean, all these things are interconnected. I would say maybe to start at the beginning.
[3:17]The reason that I do what I do is because I am healed by it and because I am inspired by it because I am motivated by it. And by it, I mean, my father's words, his practices, the way he lived in
[3:31]his life, like all of that has helped me in my life. And so even though I run, you know, all the different aspects of the business, I'm not in this for like the cool
[3:43]teachers and posters, although they're super cool. But like for me, it was like when my mom approached me and said, you know, do you have any interest in in helping to oversee this?
[3:54]The immediate answer was yes, because I just felt I just feel like there's so much of value for everyone to encounter him and his message.
[4:04]And I want him to be known more as the deep thinker and personal growth seeker and philosopher that he truly was.
[4:15]I mean, I think you will say after reading the book that he wasn't just an armchair philosopher, like he was really invested in these thoughts and these practices and trying to live them.
[4:27]And so that's why I do all of this in the first place. And then why wrote this book? I have a deep love of reading. I have a deep love of writing.
[4:37]And so I always had this desire to write a book. I just didn't know what book to write.
[4:45]And so I had been doing the Bruce Lee podcast for a number of years and discussing his philosophy and how to apply it and all that.
[4:55]And it caught the eye of a literary agent who was listening and reached out and said, oh my god, I love this. Have you ever thought about writing a book? And I said, well, actually, yes, I have thought about it.
[5:07]But and he said, you know, I feel like putting these teachings in another format, an additional format that can then reach a whole another swath of people is a really great idea.
[5:21]And the be water philosophy of my father's is really one of his best known like a lot of people have heard him say the quote in its made its way into popular culture in that regard.
[5:32]And it's such an expansive quote. It's such it encapsulates so much of him and his perspective and his practices. And so I just thought this is a great sort of entry point in a way to keep it focused because I feel like it's such a vast amount of information like to not have a focal point would be would be really hard.
[5:53]I feel like the book would be like all over the place.
[5:55]So no, it was great because you broke it down into all this different advice, but in highly structured formats that each chapter gave like a little different different take on different advice.
[6:04]I feel like he was so well, I know these concepts are so timeless and they date back to, you know, the beginning, the beginning of like rational thought, but I feel like he was like ahead of time for where we are now with like a whole society focused on mindfulness and breath and you know, like I feel like totally 30 years ago, it wasn't quite so mainstream as it is today.
[6:25]Totally totally and that's what I would say like in one of the hallmarks of my father's life is that he was an innovator that he was ahead of his time and look, he's taking timeless information for sure, like this goes all the way back to Taoism and it goes all the way back to the beginning of, as you say conscious thought, but he interpreted it and represented it for himself and his place and set and setting and his place in moment in time.
[6:50]Now, you know, many years have gone by and society continues to change and I feel like I've taken it now and put it and placed it more in this moment in time.
[7:01]Yeah, yes, even know some of the tips are just so actionable right that you could do right away like journaling or you know getting physical or like owning your own stuff in your head and like, you know, all this stop judging people so much and these are all good they're all it's all great advice.
[7:19]Yeah, it's all things you want to work towards, you know, totally and it's all things that you in some regard already know or already have a sense of, but sometimes you just need to have it like laid out in a particular way for you so that it really grabs you and speaks to you directly and then you go, oh, you know what actually, yeah, I'm going to try that or I'm going to do that.
[7:41]Well, one of the best ways to really not convince people but to get your message across is through storytelling and I feel like that's what you did.
[7:47]Well, especially by starting the book off and talking about the history and even though you're you're only what three or four when your dad passed away or yeah, the legacy he left and your reaction to it and all of that because then you're immediately like invested and the person telling the story isn't really giving the tips.
[8:06]Well, thank you.
[8:07]How did your dad end up becoming a movie star?
[8:10]He was this like cerebral, you know, mindful, you know, then like his life took off in a whole different direction martial arts and everything.
[8:20]Well, it's so interesting because my father was a child actor actually so he was in about 20 films as a child in Hong Kong so very different.
[8:31]It's time to place a very different industry than Hollywood, but you know, so he was already from the from birth like I really, the first cameo that he ever had in a film, he was an infant in the arms of his father.
[8:48]So, and then, you know, it just called to him I think creative outlets really called for to him because, as I say in the book his nickname as a child was most eating, which means never sits still.
[9:00]So he had a ton of energy and I would say as a child in in Hong Kong, you know, he grew up under challenging circumstances even though he was born in the United States.
[9:10]And then back to Hong Kong as an infant was raised in Hong Kong lived through Japanese occupied Hong Kong in World War II, then lived under British rule of Hong Kong and himself was a mixed race descent and he started to get bullied a lot and so he wanted to take martial arts.
[9:31]Things were very prevalent in Hong Kong and there was always a tug on kids to get into gangs. He was certainly no exception.
[9:40]And as a kitty I quite a temper quite quite honestly like he was feisty wanted to get in fights he wanted to do that kind of thing.
[9:48]And at the same time he had this creative side he had this, you know, he was an actor.
[9:53]And he was interested in the teeth.
[10:00]James of his seafood, his teacher in Wing Chun,
[10:03]which he started training in at the age of 13.
[10:06]And there were a lot of Taoist principles
[10:08]passed on to him at that time.
[10:10]And so he had this really active, interested, curious mind
[10:15]and he had a drive to understand things
[10:19]and to pursue things.
[10:22]And so all of that came very naturally to him,
[10:24]but he was getting in a ton of trouble.
[10:27]He was getting in fights.
[10:29]Someone was injured quite seriously.
[10:32]And he was ultimately shipped off to the United States
[10:36]with $100 to pocket by his parents.
[10:38]And we're like, you got to get out of Hong Kong.
[10:40]You should go to the United States
[10:42]because technically you're a citizen.
[10:43]So you should go there.
[10:46]And we know some people will put you in touch,
[10:48]but good luck.
[10:50]And then when he landed in the United States,
[10:52]he very much was like, well, I'm a martial artist.
[10:55]I love martial arts.
[10:55]I guess I need to get my GED.
[10:58]He worked as a bus boy and in a prep cook,
[11:01]in a restaurant, he enrolled in the University of Washington.
[11:05]He started really delving into philosophy.
[11:08]And then he was just training and teaching,
[11:11]started teaching some people very casually in the US
[11:14]with no desire to be a movie star,
[11:17]with no desire to any of that, right?
[11:20]But it was through these passionate pursuits of his
[11:24]desire to pursue everything with a certain amount of quality
[11:27]and a certain amount of thoughtfulness.
[11:30]And he had an extremely diligent work ethic
[11:33]that he caught the eye of a Hollywood producer
[11:35]and then all of a sudden his whole life to the turn.
[11:38]So crazy. Yeah.
[11:39]And quite interestingly, as I talk about in the book,
[11:43]like he suddenly realized like, oh, this is an avenue
[11:46]actually for me to reach even more people
[11:49]with the same thing I want to reach them with right now,
[11:51]but in a bigger format and in a bigger way.
[11:54]And in the book, you talked about how when you were younger,
[11:56]you weren't always so quick to say, like,
[11:59]guess what, Bruce Lee's my dad.
[12:00]Yeah.
[12:01]Yeah, it's like your whole life.
[12:03]So you're like owning it to the fullest.
[12:06]Tell me about what happened in between
[12:08]or how you used to feel.
[12:09]Yeah, you know, it's been, it's hard.
[12:11]And like when you say, oh, now you're owning it,
[12:13]I'm like, hi, owning it.
[12:14]I guess I am.
[12:15]I mean, do you still not feel like that?
[12:18]Oh my gosh, it's funny.
[12:19]You know, I mean, I do, but it's sort of this thing
[12:23]where I have to own it.
[12:24]It is true.
[12:25]It is my life.
[12:26]And as you stay in the beginning,
[12:28]my mom would tell us when your kids don't tell people
[12:30]that Bruce is your father, just let them get to know you
[12:33]without that information.
[12:34]And then at some point they'll find out
[12:36]and then they'll already either like you or not like you.
[12:39]And you'll kind of know where you stand and all of that.
[12:41]It was great advice, but as I came into adulthood,
[12:44]I started to feel like I was guarding a secret
[12:48]and that there was some part of me that it was not okay
[12:50]to share and I proceeded along like that for a long time.
[12:58]And then when I was older, I started to go,
[13:01]well, why can't I share that?
[13:02]You know, as we do, right?
[13:04]Like, well, what's wrong with that?
[13:05]Why can't I?
[13:06]What's it?
[13:06]And so then I started to experiment with sharing that
[13:09]and then I realized like, oh, this isn't at all
[13:11]or nothing thing, just like with everything, by the way.
[13:14]nothing is ever an all or nothing proposition.
[13:18]And it's like you actually have to show up
[13:20]to each moment with like all your sensors on,
[13:23]your intuition and play, feeling into the other people,
[13:26]feeling into the situation to say like,
[13:29]is this instance where it's safe to share this information
[13:33]or I feel empowered to share this information or not?
[13:37]And I've experimented with it my whole life
[13:40]and I would say that it got even harder
[13:43]when I decided to start looking after his legacy
[13:45]because now this is also what I do for work.
[13:49]And you know, so all those conversations,
[13:51]so what do you do for work?
[13:52]Well, you know, because I'm not instantly recognizable, right?
[13:59]As a person out in the world.
[14:01]So I think it then I've questioned my own identity
[14:06]my whole life, which I think quite frankly,
[14:08]we all do anyway.
[14:11]It's just I have a little bit different lens on mine.
[14:14]And that's what I mean.
[14:15]It's like I do feel like I am finally coming
[14:19]into ownership of myself, quite frankly.
[14:23]And Bruce Lee as my father is definitely a part of who I am.
[14:28]And yet it's not all that I am.
[14:31]And I think that writing this book was a way for me
[14:33]to say like, oh, even though I'm gonna focus on
[14:37]what his teachings have in them that are so great
[14:40]for everyone, and for me,
[14:44]I'm also gonna put some of myself out there.
[14:46]And I'm gonna write this book, right?
[14:50]Like there've been a lot of books written about Bruce Lee
[14:52]and about his writings, but never by me.
[14:54]And so it is a way for me to start stepping more
[14:58]and more into my own identity.
[14:59]I wonder how you're gonna feel
[15:01]with this book out in the world.
[15:02]I hope it goes on.
[15:04]Gabriel, are you ready?
[15:05]Thank you.
[15:07]I hope so too.
[15:08]I guess we'll find out.
[15:11]Oh my goodness.
[15:12]But that's such a natural thing to do when you're younger.
[15:14]And I know yours was inspired by your mom,
[15:16]but just like, I feel like there was a point
[15:18]at which everyone's a little embarrassed by their parents.
[15:21]And then you grow up and you're like, wait,
[15:23]there's actually some cool stuff about my parents.
[15:25]Or there's not, you know, and then, right?
[15:27]So yeah.
[15:28]Yeah.
[15:29]And it different times like I have to abandon my parents.
[15:31]And then another time she's like, no,
[15:32]I need to own my parents, you know?
[15:34]It's like you, you're striped for your individuation
[15:37]and you strive to be different.
[15:38]You strive to learn from the mistakes that you feel
[15:41]like have been made.
[15:42]And then you, they ultimately come into this understanding
[15:45]like, oh, everybody's just trying to do their best.
[15:48]Like, nobody knows the secret formula here.
[15:51]And, and you know, and then you're like,
[15:53]oh, so I have to try to do my best also.
[15:55]I don't know.
[15:56]Yeah.
[15:57]And I think sometimes my dad can be like pretty vocal
[15:59]politically or like make statements.
[16:02]And people might assume that I have the same ones,
[16:04]but then I'm like, why do most people share
[16:08]the same use of their parents these days?
[16:10]I mean, like, I mean, maybe, but maybe not.
[16:13]Like, we all have so many differences
[16:15]from who our parents are, I think.
[16:16]Sorry, there's certain things here.
[16:18]Yeah, I mean, you know, welcome to modern times.
[16:21]I know, I know, I just, there's sort of this lingering thing.
[16:23]Like, oh, you're Bruce Lee's daughter.
[16:25]You must have all the same beliefs.
[16:26]You must, you must feel the same way.
[16:29]And you might totally not.
[16:31]And that's why it's so great that you could include
[16:33]your thoughts and feelings alongside it
[16:35]and share things that shaped you like, I'm so sorry.
[16:38]I didn't know about your brother.
[16:40]And that part was so sad.
[16:41]I mean, that alone could have been the beginning.
[16:44]You know, that could have been the trajectory
[16:47]your life takes a different turn because of
[16:49]and I know that very well, but you know what I mean.
[16:51]I mean, that part was like heart wrenching.
[16:52]And you wrote after that, you said,
[16:54]I knew how to go, this is the aftermath.
[16:57]You said, I knew how to go through each day,
[16:58]but I no longer knew how to live.
[17:01]And that is like the best quote on grief I've heard
[17:03]in a long time.
[17:04]I mean, yeah, that's just it.
[17:06]Like your world is different, right?
[17:08]Totally, totally.
[17:10]And and that's it exactly.
[17:12]It was like when I think back to the aftermath
[17:14]of those times, I was like, oh my God.
[17:17]I was, I had moved to LA.
[17:19]I started pursuing and acting career of all things.
[17:22]I was on autopilot.
[17:23]I got married in the mouth like, and I was just like,
[17:28]well, this is like, this is what I'm supposed to be doing.
[17:30]And inside I was just like, help me.
[17:34]I like what?
[17:36]You know, like I can't, I don't, I don't feel okay.
[17:41]I just really, I don't feel okay.
[17:43]You know.
[17:44]Can you back up and do you mind sharing what happened?
[17:47]Because you were kind of vague about something
[17:50]happened on an accident.
[17:51]And yes, so my brother was killed on the filming
[17:55]of the set, the crow, for the film, the crow.
[17:58]They were almost done shooting.
[18:00]They just had a couple weeks left of shooting.
[18:03]And my brother was going to finish up.
[18:05]And then he was going to take off to go and get married.
[18:08]His wedding was like three weeks away.
[18:11]And because they were just extremely negligent
[18:15]on the set of the film, they just they let the firearms expert
[18:20]go because they were like, ah, we're almost done.
[18:23]We don't need the firearms expert round anymore.
[18:25]We don't have to pay for that great, you know.
[18:27]And then they ran out of certain props.
[18:30]They ran out of these things called dummy bullets.
[18:33]Whenever they need to make a shot of a bullet in a film,
[18:37]they don't use real bullets.
[18:38]They use fake bullets.
[18:40]They looked just like bullets, but they don't have gunpowder
[18:42]in them.
[18:43]So they had to do a shot where a character was loading a gun.
[18:46]So they needed some dummy bullets.
[18:47]And they didn't have any.
[18:48]So they bought real bullets.
[18:50]No.
[18:52]Yeah.
[18:53]So they bought real bullets.
[18:54]And then it attempt to be safe.
[18:57]They pride them open and dumped the gunpowder out.
[19:00]But there was still gunpowder residue
[19:03]in the chambers of these bullets.
[19:06]And I mean, it's a crazy sequence of events that took place.
[19:11]Any one of which, if somebody had been paying attention
[19:14]and doing their job, would have stopped, would have stopped it.
[19:17]So they had these real bullets.
[19:19]They dumped the gunpowder out of.
[19:21]And then they did the shots they were doing.
[19:23]And in that, somebody was dry firing the gun.
[19:27]And because there was like a little residue of gunpowder,
[19:30]when they didn't, this is like things
[19:33]that I never thought I would know about bullets, by the way.
[19:35]But like, you know, bullet has a flat side
[19:39]with a little circle in it.
[19:41]And that's the firing pin.
[19:43]So when the hammer of the gun comes up,
[19:45]it hits that firing pin, which ignites the gunpowder
[19:49]inside, which is what projects the bullet out of the gun.
[19:52]So when they dumped the gunpowder out,
[19:54]they didn't also fire off the pins.
[19:58]So when somebody was playing around with the...
[20:00]gone and firing it. They hit the pin which ignited the residue of the gun powder inside the bullet,
[20:06]which separated the casing and lodged it in the barrel of the gun. Now we have no firearms expert
[20:13]on set and they go to shoot a scene with my brother like a week later or something. And because
[20:20]no one is looking at the gun, no one's checking the gun, they don't know that this piece of metal
[20:25]is lodged in the barrel. And then they put a blank in a gun, which a blank is gun powder,
[20:32]but it just is encased in paper. It's not encased in metal. So they stick this blank in the gun,
[20:38]which in essence makes a bullet because there is a metal projectile lodged in the barrel.
[20:45]And nobody checks it and they shoot the scene and the actor pulls the trigger and shoots my brother.
[20:50]Oh my gosh. Yeah. It's pretty horrifying. It's pretty horrifying.
[20:55]I actually, as you're telling this, now I'm starting to remember this happening like in popular culture,
[21:01]this is like 20 years ago or something, right? It's yeah, it's 27 years ago now.
[21:07]Oh my gosh. Yeah, I kind of I hadn't put two and two together until you mentioned the
[21:11]movie name. Oh my gosh. I am so sorry. So how do you I mean, I know how you came back as I read the book,
[21:17]how do you like, how did you go through? So you got married, your life was sort of on
[21:22]autopilot. And then what? I mean, you know, like I said, I was going through life, but I was in
[21:28]excruciating internal pain. I was in full depression. I was at times like I couldn't I couldn't leave
[21:36]my house. I would drive around in my car, which in LA we do a lot. And I would cry while I was driving
[21:42]and then I'd get to a place and I'd like wipe the tears away and be like, okay, here I go.
[21:46]You know, I mean, just terrible. And I just remember thinking in my head, I need help. I can't
[21:56]live like this. And I had this like consistent mantra just going through my head, going through my
[22:03]head. And what showed up without me actually, like I didn't I was too depressed to even try to
[22:09]pursue like something logically to do like like go to therapy, by the way, you know,
[22:18]I've never been in therapy before. I like many people who have never been in therapy,
[22:22]I've been in therapy not by the way, but like many people have never been in therapy. There's
[22:27]a little bit of a stigma of like you should just be able to handle your own problems and you know,
[22:32]all that kind of stuff and not really understanding the process and the value of it.
[22:37]And so I was just like in this place of pain. And what came to me was my father's writings
[22:46]completely like delivered to me from the universe quite frankly because yes, they were always there.
[22:53]But at the time, my mom was working with someone to organize them into a book. And so they
[22:58]had gathered them all and made photocopies of them. And just as a, hey, this is interesting,
[23:03]would you like to see we happen to have them all photocopies? So would you like to see them?
[23:09]They were given to me and like like a stack like three foot books I have writings. And I started
[23:17]flipping through them and I came across this quote, which I mentioned in the book, which for whatever
[23:23]reason in that moment, it was just what I needed to hear. And it said, the medicine for my suffering,
[23:28]I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within
[23:34]myself, but I didn't observe it until this moment. And now I see that I will never find the light
[23:40]unless like the candle, I am my own fuel. And I was just like, I have the medicine for my own,
[23:49]like it's not just going to, you know, like my suffering isn't just going to magically disappear.
[23:54]Like I think that that's what we all want. We just want to be like, oh, something good will
[23:58]happen in my life. And I'll get so happy that all my suffering will disappear. And it was like,
[24:05]no, you actually, you have to be your own fuel. You have to figure it out. And that's when I started
[24:12]trying to figure it out. And thought the things like healers and therapists and friends and
[24:18]books to read and all these things. And so this book that I wrote is like my way of hopefully
[24:25]they're being some little tiny something that pops out at the reader who is also struggling with
[24:33]something. And they go, oh, because that was my experience. So that's just beautiful. I'm sorry
[24:39]you went through all this. And I'm so glad that you found, you know, the ticket to getting to the next
[24:45]sort of level of processing your grief. You know, people always say, like, go get help, go get help.
[24:50]But you know, as you mentioned, if you're in that state, it's hard to motivate to do anything.
[24:54]And it can feel really overwhelming. I mean, like, what are you going to Google? Like, I need a
[24:59]therapist dot com. And I mean, like, it's just overwhelming sometimes. Like, where do you turn?
[25:03]Who's good? Who's going to click with you? Who takes insurance? Like, I don't know. There's like
[25:07]all these things that prevent people. And it's just so much easier to do nothing and just like
[25:12]wallow and just hope and just hope and just wait for time to pass. Yeah. We'd also, you know,
[25:18]eventually, you know, things change over time. But yeah, for sure. You're so right. And how great
[25:24]that like your own dad's words. Yeah. Are the ones that got you through. I mean, it's amazing,
[25:29]really. Yeah. Most people's dads don't have writing like this, just sitting around.
[25:33]Well, they can use my dad's. So they're like, oh my gosh, well, just like, no, exactly. Well,
[25:41]and I would just say, like, books are a place to go, right? Like, if you can't, like,
[25:46]and they're easy and they're cheap and, you know, like, and you can listen to a book, you don't
[25:52]have to take the time to read a book like podcasts. Like, we're having discussion right now. Like,
[25:58]all these things, like they're, they're an easy on-rump into maybe at some point feeling like
[26:03]you're ready to get a therapist or whatever the next thing is, right? So I totally agree.
[26:08]I feel like I've had some recent losses due to COVID and my husband's mother and grandmother
[26:14]within six weeks of each other. And it was like this excruciating six week medical journey. Anyway,
[26:18]I won't go into it. But I keep posting and saying, like, books are getting me through this. Like,
[26:23]books are it. And it not like books, the idea of books, but like getting lost in somebody else's
[26:29]story and knowing that like other people have suffered and that you're going to get through
[26:33]it eventually in some way, it can be like horrible accident. You know, something that doesn't have
[26:38]to be lost, right? It's just that hitting bottom. And so I totally agree with you. I think books are,
[26:44]I don't know. People who don't read books, read books. Or listen to books. How about that?
[26:53]I'll just go to books. Yeah. No, we listen to book this morning. And in a long drive, so anyway,
[26:58]yeah. Well, so going back to for two seconds to the writing of this book, what was that process like
[27:03]for you? Did that get become very emotional? Did it take you a long time? Like, what was the whole
[27:08]stuff? You know, that process like, yeah, I wrote the first draft of the book over the course of
[27:13]a year. I'm busy. So I had to like fit that time in to my schedule, which is why it took a year.
[27:21]I think I probably could have done it faster if I'd had like nothing to do with that.
[27:27]I have lots of other things. But you don't know. I mean, because people have nothing but time
[27:30]also struggle. There's no good way. This is true. This is true. And you know, there were a lot
[27:38]of things going on at the time as well. The writing of the book was a journey. And I have to say,
[27:43]like, I approached the first draft is like, I just have to get this out. I just have to get it out.
[27:52]And I just have to create deadlines and I just have to find a time to write. And so I would work
[27:59]from home two days a week and try to take hours out of those days to write. And on weekends
[28:05]and things like that. And by the way, I'm a single mom. So I also had those duties as well.
[28:13]But you know, catch his catch can. I got a draft out. And I felt good about the draft.
[28:19]And then I sent it off to my editor, publisher editor, and waited a while for their comments.
[28:27]Because, you know, with the timing and everything, and they had some things they were moving
[28:33]offices and all that, it took them a few months to get back to me. And so it was good. I was like,
[28:38]hey, good. I got a draft out of that screen. And I was feeling good about it. But then the notes
[28:46]came back and they were like, this is great. And here are comments. And in that time, you know,
[28:53]look like as humans, especially like for me, I'm a person who's dedicated to continual work, to
[28:59]continue to work on myself to continue to grow, to continue to shift my perspective over time on all
[29:05]sorts of things in life and all of that. And I was so grateful for those months because I continued
[29:13]to learn and grow in those months and go through a lot of things that I was struggling with and
[29:19]learning from. And then I got the notes back and when I started to read the notes, and they were like,
[29:24]we're not sure we understand this or we could use a little more explanation here. And I was reading it.
[29:28]I'm like, oh my God, yes, like this needs to need some work for sure. But I was so grateful because
[29:36]I felt so much more clear to like, I'd had that space. I'd had some time to continue on my journey.
[29:44]And in the edits, I really feel like the book really blooms. And I was so grateful for the
[29:50]for the ability to revisit those thoughts and those chapters and reorganize them chapters,
[29:56]seven, eight, nine really got a lot of work.
[30:00]them which you know are sort of the weightier material in the book and I was grateful for that.
[30:06]And by the time I was like finally like okay this is the last time I'm going to get to ever
[30:11]change anything in it. I felt I felt that piece with it and I was like okay like this is my
[30:17]understanding of this material as best as I can get it for right now for where I am. And I
[30:23]believe there are some good enough pieces in here that it can be of help to some other people.
[30:30]So what advice would you have for aspiring authors?
[30:35]You know look we all face this idea whether you're an author or whether you're anything of
[30:42]there's not enough time with procrastination. I'm a huge procrastinator. Like if I don't have a
[30:48]deadline it's really hard for me to get something done. Sometimes when I would sit down in front
[30:54]the computer to write I would find myself like typing three sentences and then being like I'm
[31:00]going to get a snack. When I come back and like type three more sentences and be like you know I'd
[31:06]have to go to the bathroom. I would watch myself like squirm you know and then there were times when
[31:14]it just flowed. But what I would say is it's great to fight through those moments when you're
[31:21]because they do ultimately lead to times when it starts to flow. And for me deadlines are key
[31:29]like trying to have like these are the days that are right it's on my calendar. I'm protecting
[31:34]this time. I'm protecting this practice. So yes a big meeting is coming up in there requesting
[31:42]this time from me. And if I'm not ready to then okay fine I'll take the meeting but then I'm
[31:47]going to schedule this time and protect it. Like you've got to protect the time and there really
[31:52]is enough time. I mean there's so many things that I am trying to do and I'm running these
[31:58]businesses and I'm parenting my child and I'm you know all of this and it would be easy for me to
[32:04]say that there's not enough time. And a lot of times I use the excuse I'm very busy right. But if
[32:11]this is something that is important to you then there is enough time and you'll find the time and
[32:19]it doesn't matter if it's an hour once a week you know it's like find the time protect that time
[32:25]and just keep going because I use this example in the book but it's like if you just keep dreaming
[32:31]about writing a book and never actually take any steps toward writing it even if it takes you 10
[32:37]years and 10 years you'll have a book versus in 10 years you'll still just have a dream about having
[32:42]a book you know. That's great advice. That's great advice. Yeah and and the other thing too is I would
[32:49]get off of the like the need for the book to be perfect or the need for the book to be
[32:54]immediately publishable like just get the book out. And then you can always work on it from there
[33:02]but until you get that draft out that first idea that's first paid you know like rough idea
[33:09]then there's there's nothing to work with so you know and work with it you will like you know
[33:15]we all have the dream like my first draft I was like check done. I just perfect book in the first draft
[33:23]you know it's like no no you know it's not perfect it needs work and great let's do the work.
[33:29]Well Shannon it was so nice talking to you and learning more about your story and your beautiful
[33:36]mission for why you even want the book out there and I think you are you know from where I said
[33:42]I feel like you're doing an amazing job of upholding the legacy of like your entire family.
[33:48]Now thank you so much. Thank you for that.
[33:53]Thank you so much. Thank you for your beautiful questions for the work that you're doing as well.
[33:58]I hold so much love for you and your process and what you're we're going through with those
[34:04]losses and just as a human. I mean being a human is hard it's challenging it's challenging.
[34:09]I don't want to I don't want to put the thing on it that it's hard because it's not always
[34:14]there there's a lot of joy but it's challenging it's challenging to be with ourselves
[34:19]like when we're in quarantine we are with ourselves. Yeah and that is challenging so I really
[34:28]I hope I get to meet you at some point. Me too. Me too. I would love that. Please let's keep in touch.
[34:40]Okay. Excellent. All right. Have a great day. All right. You take care. Bye bye.
[34:46]I hope you enjoyed today's episode. I know I enjoyed recording it. Don't forget to check out my new podcast.
[34:53]Moms don't have time to lose weight pretty soon. Moms won't have time to listen to podcasts
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[35:13]achieve their goals. Moms don't have time to lose weight. Thanks for listening to this episode of
[35:18]Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at Zebioans and
[35:23]at Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Also sign up for my newsletter at zebioans.com and sign
[35:28]out for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week. Thanks so much to
[35:32]Steve and Ryan at Textures Sound for the Sound Editing and thank you to Morning Moon Productions
[35:37]for providing this fantastic intro and now trim music.