Jamie Lee Curtis, LETTERS FROM CAMP
[0:08]Hi, I'm Zibi Owens, and you're listening to the award-winning podcast, Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
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[0:53]I don't know about any of you, but I am still obsessed with Mindy Kayling after her amazing appearance on the office.
[1:01]She is also an author for those of you who don't know. This is her third work.
[1:05]It's called Nothing Like I Imagine, and it's an Amazon original story.
[1:11]It's a collection of short stories, six of them about how she juggles life as a new mom, actress, and Hollywood Power Benture.
[1:16]And her story collection is actually the sponsor of this episode.
[1:20]It was written and narrated by Mindy, and it's great to listen to on the go available in audio and e-book format.
[1:27]Prime members can listen and read it for free. So you can download this today at Amazon.com
[1:34]slash Mindy Stories. That's Amazon.com slash Mindy Stories. It's absolutely hilarious,
[1:41]and just you will not want to stop reading. So check it out today, Amazon.com slash Mindy Stories.
[1:49]I was so excited to interview Jamie Lee Curtis. Oh my gosh, she has been one of my favorite actresses
[1:55]for so long from the time of watching her in trading places to freaky Friday. I mean, she's just
[2:01]such a superstar. It's amazing. I also love her children's books. She's written more than
[2:06]it does in so far, all of which are fantastic. And now she has done an audible original
[2:12]called Letters from Camp, which is fantastic. And she also is part of the narration of that.
[2:16]She's a beloved American actress and talent from the time she started Halloween.
[2:22]And she's still busy producing so many different things. She's also recently started
[2:27]My Hand in yours, which we're going to talk about on the podcast, which is a non-profit that
[2:32]benefits children in the hospital. So listen and enjoy it. Welcome Jamie. Thank you so much for
[2:37]coming on. Don't have time to read, folks. This is such a treat. Well, apparently you do because
[2:42]there are a lot of books behind you. There are a lot of rainbow organized books behind you.
[2:49]Yes. Well, I try to make time and share what I can read with other people who might not have as much
[2:54]maybe. I understand. This is how we do it, isn't it? We share with other people. You have contributed
[3:01]so much in so many different areas in the artistic world. And your latest endeavor is Letters
[3:06]from Camp, an audible original, which came out this summer. So I just wanted to talk a little bit
[3:11]first about that. Tell me how the idea for an audible original came about and particularly this show.
[3:18]Okay. Well, it's it's funny because it's it's such a wonderful story that the show was born from
[3:25]such a beautiful moment. So I am the proud godmother of three New York raised children. My
[3:33]friend Lisa Bernbach lives in New York and her three children obviously lived there with her and
[3:38]were educated in New York. And I'm the godmother of all of them. And my middle-godchild,
[3:43]Boko wrote me a letter from camp when she was 12 years old, which she never sent. You know,
[3:50]she wrote it and then put it in her shoebox of cards and then obviously didn't send it.
[3:55]Had my name written on the outside of the envelope. And in November of last year,
[4:01]I got a letter in the mail from Lisa. And inside that letter was the letter from Boko unopened.
[4:09]And I opened it up. And it was a letter from a 12-year-old saying,
[4:13]Dear godmother, Jamie, I made a mistake. I got into trouble, blah, blah, blah.
[4:18]I wish you were here because you would know what to do, blah, blah. And I immediately called
[4:24]Boko, who's 26 years old and a comedy writer here in Los Angeles. And I said, Boko, I got your letter
[4:29]from when you were 12. And I said, you know, it's fantastic. And there's a TV show here.
[4:34]So originally, we were going to do it as a TV show. And as we started talking about it,
[4:39]we found out that the audible idea doing a podcast, doing a scripted podcast with characters
[4:48]and sound effects, just like old radio plays. They call it TV for your ears. It feels like a TV show,
[4:55]but it's audible. And they bought it and loved it. And we made it this summer during COVID,
[5:01]everybody was remote. It was written in about a month. And then we performed it. And then it was
[5:08]out August 4th. Wow. Crazy. That's the way to do it, right? Well, and it's a new world for me.
[5:17]The audible world and audible as a company has been fantastic as a partner to really
[5:23]understand that there are people who want content, who want things. And this was just a wonderful,
[5:30]it's super funny. They have been fantastic partners, audible in the creation of it. And the
[5:36]whole world of audible, I didn't know about it. And it's just been so fun. And we had such a great
[5:43]cast. It's got songs in it that are like earworms that get in your head. And then you can't get it
[5:48]out of your head. And it's just been an absolute joy, kind of crazy experience and super fun.
[5:55]And they think I heard it. And I was listening to the introductory theme song. I spent many years
[5:59]at Sleep Boy Camp. And it just like took me back to all that time on the bus and singing the camp
[6:04]songs and all the rest for you at Sleep Boy Camp, girl yourself. I was. I am, as you can maybe tell,
[6:11]you know, I like to compartmentalize. I like things to all work well. And for me, crunks at camp
[6:19]or like your own fiefdom, like I, you know, I know some kids hated the idea of a trunk,
[6:25]and they had to keep it clean and thing. And everything was all messy. I loved it. I loved
[6:30]you could roll your t-shirts and line them up. I loved the little soap box. There was like a
[6:37]plastic soap box. I loved every aspect of camp. I love lanyards. I love the group activities. And so
[6:47]this show just spoke to my heart and made me remember how wonderful that is experience is for people.
[6:55]And honestly, if people have the opportunity to go to camp, I think anybody who had that opportunity,
[7:01]obviously not everyone had that opportunity, but the privileged people that were able to go to camp
[7:06]have that nostalgic feeling of creating like a new version of yourself and kind of learning who you
[7:13]are. And I think that's the great benefit of camp. So true. I actually, my son is like very into
[7:19]how his room looks. And now he's growing up. He's five. And he's like, I don't want to have a
[7:22]step stool as my side table. So literally yesterday, I was like, you know what, I think I'm going to get
[7:27]you like an old-fashioned camp trunk. And I could put it here and you could store all your little
[7:30]treasures. So anyway, trunks have been on my mind. I'm sorry. You just said something about your
[7:35]son is very specific about the way his room looks. Yes. I might ask you to turn over your left
[7:41]shoulder and look at your bookcase. I see where it comes from. But yeah, he's my only one or four
[7:46]who actually cares. So there you go. Who knew the fourth time? Well, letters from camp is absolutely
[7:53]fantastic and at home. Thank you so much. And fabulous to listen to. But I also wanted to talk about
[7:58]your over a dozen children's books because I've been reading them with my kids, the oldest or
[8:02]13, and so I've been reading them for years. And I'm so impressed with the output and the content
[8:09]and the cleverness and the way you make different concepts from self-esteem to the out of it to
[8:13]everything and being brave and all of it accessible and fun. So tell me about how you started writing
[8:19]children's books. Well, I thank you, by the way, thank you. They are my best thing. They will be the
[8:26]best contribution I make to the universe besides raising my kids. For sure. I never thought I'd
[8:32]write a book. I barely got out of school. I am an well-educated uneducated woman. I am, I spell
[8:39]so poorly. I count on my fingers. I did not receive schooling at all. I was just.
[8:47]So it's a miracle that I survived my youth. I never thought I'd write a book and my four-year-old daughter
[8:55]walked into my office one day. Apropos of nothing. And I was sitting at a desk and she was down
[9:01]the hall and came marching into my room. And I remember she stood there and kind of was delicious
[9:06]in her four-year-oldness and she went, when I was little, I was, but now I use a body. And then
[9:15]she marched out of the room and I thought, oh my goodness, that's amazing. And I wrote down on a piece
[9:23]of paper in front of me when I was little of four-year-olds memoir of her youth. Which just made me
[9:29]laugh because she was talking about when she was little the way I talk about when I had long
[9:34]hair and wore it in a shag. Or, you know, when I wore bell bottoms. Like the good old days that I
[9:41]remember fondly. She was reminiscing about because she had a past. Even though I only looked at her
[9:52]having a future. Because she was so little. I never thought that she would look back. I only
[9:57]thought she would look forward. And when you have small children.
[10:00]You're only looking forward. School, shoes, clothes, food, school clothes, clothes, shoes,
[10:08]food. I mean, it's the you're only looking forward where they can go to grade school, high school,
[10:13]college. And so in the writing of that, I wrote down a list of things that she used to do,
[10:21]but no, that she couldn't do, and now she can do. And I found that at the end of the list,
[10:26]I wrote three things. I started to cry and I realized it was a book. And it was the last
[10:30]thing I thought I would do. And all of a sudden I was moved by it. And I realized it was a book about
[10:36]self discovery, about self ownership. And I realized it was a book for children. And I sold it that
[10:42]day. I've sent it via fax, faxes were new then. That's how old I am. And I remember sending it
[10:49]in a curly cute paper to an agent in New York, who was my mother-in-law's best friend.
[10:55]She sent it to Harper Collins, which was actually Harper Roe back then. And they bought it.
[11:02]Joanna Cutler, who was the head of children's books, bought the book. And that began my career as an
[11:08]author. And I had had a book that my daughter Annie loved. We loved the way parents and children
[11:15]love books called Annie Banani. And it was written by Leia Kamiko. And it was illustrated by
[11:21]Laura Cornell. And so I said to Harper Roe, who had published Annie Banani, I would like Laura
[11:28]Cornell to draw the pictures. And she and I have been partners since then for whatever 13, 14 books.
[11:35]Oh my gosh. That's amazing. Last thing in the world, I thought I'd do. Last thing in the world. And
[11:41]I don't write them. They come to me. I wait for them. And then they pop into my head almost
[11:47]fully formed. And I can barely get them down on the paper. That's how fast they come. Wow.
[11:52]And you're most recent one. Me, myself, and I, that was hilarious. The mom, outside, like taking
[11:58]the selfies in the snow. Well, it's, you know, obviously the, as I get older and the children get
[12:06]I'm no longer seeing the world from a young child's perspective. I'm seeing it from our perspective
[12:12]of how we relate to young people and the poison of social media and our self obsession and
[12:20]our self altering nature. And I mean, even here, I'm sitting here and I have a light over here.
[12:26]And I have a light over here. You know, because if I didn't have those lights, it wouldn't be
[12:32]at all good. And so it's not like I will tell the truth on myself. I do it too. But I don't
[12:38]alter photographs. And I don't throw up 100 filters and all of a sudden try to look like I'm
[12:45]not 61 years old. I think it's a poison. And it was my way of talking about it. Because I knew
[12:51]if I had made it about kids doing it, nobody would have liked it because they would have felt that
[12:56]I was making a social statement about them. And I think they would have been like, yeah, well,
[13:02]F off. You know what I mean? Like just go away. Whereas by turning it on the mom, making the mom,
[13:08]the one who's obsessed by it, who can't stop looking at herself, the constancy of her,
[13:14]you know, the faces we make, it's crazy. But it really was my think piece about self obsession
[13:23]and the opposite of that, which is selflessness, which is what the world needs way more of. And so
[13:30]it was a little bit of a think piece. And speaking of the selflessness, tell me more about
[13:37]my hand in yours, which is your latest endeavor, which as you know, I just got very excited about
[13:42]myself. It's very sweet of you to support it. So I am 61 years old. And I am at that point in my
[13:51]where my motto now is, if not now, when, if not me, who? Like what am I not doing to create
[14:02]love in the universe? Like how selfish is my life? And I have always supported children's
[14:09]hospital of Angeles. And for years, if you went through a bad thing, or a friend of mine went
[14:17]through a bad thing, I would either buy a little gift. And I would send it. I'm a gift giver. I
[14:23]like gifting. And I would write on a card. I'm so sorry to hear about your mother. You know,
[14:30]I hope she recovers. Remember through it all my hand in yours is what I would say. It was a phrase
[14:37]that I put those four words together to say, I'm not with you. But imagine what it would feel
[14:44]like if you felt my hand in yours. And that's what I want you to feel when I'm not there with you.
[14:50]And I've been saying that for a long time. And I've been collecting small sculptures by this
[14:56]artist name and rickets who makes little feet, little tiny beautiful feet that I love to send
[15:05]people and say, remember to be where your feet are, meaning get out of your head and be right
[15:10]where you are in the moment. And so I've been buying and supporting and rickets for a long time.
[15:16]And I had this thought, what if we made a sculpture of two hands holding? I don't know if you can
[15:23]see it. And let me get some light on it. Oh my, look at me with my lighting skills. And that it
[15:30]could fit in your palm. You could hold it like this. And that it would be two hands holding. And I
[15:37]went to Anne and asked her if I could commission her to make them. And I explained to her that I
[15:42]was going to donate 100% of the sales to Children's Hospital of Angeles, which is an organization I've
[15:47]worked with. And I was going to call it my hand in yours. And I was going to create a marketplace
[15:52]for comfort items for people during times of crisis. Now, this was last year when I thought I would
[16:00]start this project. And I thought maybe it would be like an Instagram store or something. I didn't
[16:04]really know. And then, you know, the universe changed and COVID hit. And all of a sudden,
[16:12]the need for contact with other people, the need to be able to send someone a gift and say,
[16:17]I am with you during this incredibly hard time, you know, presented itself. And so I started a company
[16:24]and I never thought I'd start a company. I underwrote the company so that 100% of the profits.
[16:29]And that means that Anne Rickards donates all of her time, all of her artistry, all of her
[16:34]sculpting time, all of the preparation. And then they get sent to a foundry where they're produced.
[16:41]And then she makes sure that each one is perfect, polishes each one, bags each one. All of that
[16:47]is done for free so that I can sell them. And the 100% of that sale goes to Children's Hospital of
[16:54]Angeles. And so everybody that has participated Anne Rickards, my friend Kathy Waterman has created
[17:01]this fantastic hand charm. I don't know if you can see it, which, you know, I will tell you from
[17:10]like product testing, I have reached up and grabbed that hand. So there's something so tactile
[17:18]about holding this pendant as I go through my day. So it Kathy created that. That's on the website.
[17:26]And so I have now expanded the website. There are now medallions that you can buy because obviously
[17:33]I wanted to make sure that there were things with different price points. So the medallion is $12.
[17:39]And for $12, you can have it sent to a loved one with a note from you and the money goes to
[17:45]Children's Hospital. And then the sculpture is obviously there are more money that pendant, blankets,
[17:50]soon we're going to have candles, we're going to have beautiful objects. It's objects of comfort
[17:55]in times of crisis. 100% goes to Children's Hospital. And all of a sudden I have a store.
[18:02]All of a sudden I have a store. I like shit.
[18:07]I'm doing shipping every day. It's hilarious because I'm not that person, but yet I've become
[18:13]that person. So I'll look for you at UPS, you know, you will be receiving it. Or USPS, it depends
[18:20]what method you choose or FedEx. You can choose all of the methodology to getting it to you.
[18:26]You might want to add some pictures of the scale of it because I was on the website earlier,
[18:30]like showing up the pendant, like just to show how big or small they are. Maybe I did it in too
[18:36]much of a hurry, but I didn't notice like somebody wearing it or anyway. Yes, I will do so. That's such a
[18:42]good idea. Okay. I will get on it. Let me get my people on it. Yeah, you go and you do that.
[18:48]Why did you pick Children's Hospital as Angeles? Did you have a personal connection? Did
[18:52]something happen? Or did you use it? Or do you just think it's a great thing? Or what?
[18:57]I have been a supporter of Children's hospitals throughout the country for a long time. I had
[19:04]started when I was making a movie in Pontiac, Illinois. And there was a charity put on by the
[19:11]town of Pontiac for a young woman in Lori told who was the first successful heart transplant
[19:17]recipient as a child. She was 13 years old. And it was experimental surgery. The insurance company
[19:24]was not going to pay for it. And so the town of Pontiac put on a benefit and the movie I was making,
[19:30]we joined the benefit. And she and I became friends. And when she passed away at 19, I made a big
[19:36]donation to Children's Hospital, Pittsburgh, which was a, you know, fantastic institution at the
[19:43]front of that type of surgery. Dr. Starzall, Thomas Starzall was, was, you know, really a pioneer
[19:53]in transplant surgery. And I worked with them for years. And then when I came back home every time,
[19:58]it was felt weird that I would-
[20:00]go to Pittsburgh and work on behalf of people in Illinois.
[20:04]When, in fact, I live in California,
[20:05]and I have one of the greatest institutions in Los Angeles.
[20:08]And so I literally just cold called them one day
[20:10]and said, look, I'm doing this work for other places.
[20:13]I would like to start to support children's hospital
[20:16]Los Angeles.
[20:17]And then I'd ended up that they were doing bond initiatives,
[20:21]to raise money, hospital bonds,
[20:24]and I just became the spokesperson
[20:26]and started doing the commercials for them.
[20:27]And then I've just been involved with them since they're
[20:29]just a fantastic organization.
[20:32]It's my hometown, born and raised here in the city of Angels.
[20:35]And it was important to me that I give back to them.
[20:39]So that's, they get all my support.
[20:41]I can just imagine the person who picked out the phone that day.
[20:44]He was like, yeah, that worked.
[20:46]We'll take that donation.
[20:47]Sure, get involved.
[20:48]Why not?
[20:50]For anybody watching this, you don't have to do big gestures.
[20:55]Like one of the proudest things that ever happened in my life
[21:00]is that one of my best girlfriends,
[21:03]because of my involvement at children's hospital,
[21:05]decided to volunteer as a cuddler.
[21:08]And a cuddler is for all of the premature babies
[21:11]who are in the NICU, who do not have their parents
[21:15]or mother or father or grandparents with them.
[21:18]Volunteers are trained and then vetted.
[21:22]And then you go in and literally sit in a chair
[21:25]and they bring you these babies and you rock them
[21:29]and hold them and sing to them.
[21:31]And one of my best girlfriends made that her commitment
[21:36]to children's hospital.
[21:37]No fanfare, no big TV ads, but hours and hours and hours
[21:44]of her day where she would hold these little babies.
[21:48]That's what I'm saying.
[21:49]To people watching and listening, we have to do something.
[21:54]As human beings, we are not here to look at ourselves
[21:58]on our phones.
[21:59]That is not the reason we're here.
[22:01]We're here to manifest our destiny as human beings
[22:05]and create a loving connection in the universe.
[22:08]That's why we're here.
[22:10]That's just why we're here.
[22:11]And so whatever it is, you can do something.
[22:15]And this is a time in our nation and in the world
[22:18]where we all have to be doing something.
[22:20]I don't care what it is.
[22:22]I mean, look at what that middleer has done in this
[22:24]in New York City.
[22:25]Look at what that middleer has done with her parks projects,
[22:30]reclaiming these old disheveled pieces of property
[22:35]and turn them into local urban gardens and meeting places
[22:42]and transform the city.
[22:44]That's just one person going, you know what?
[22:47]I'm going to do that.
[22:49]And all the volunteers and all the people that joined her,
[22:52]that's what we can do.
[22:54]And I hope that's what we teach our children to do
[22:57]because if we're not teaching them that, it's over.
[23:00]Then it's just anarchy and then, you know,
[23:03]the world will blow up.
[23:04]But I do believe that you can make a huge, huge difference
[23:07]in the lives of other people by shooting up
[23:10]and showing up and trying to help people.
[23:11]So if anybody takes away anything from this besides,
[23:15]I do a lot of hand motions.
[23:17]So then that would be a good thing.
[23:21]This could actually be part of your,
[23:22]my hand in yours, you know.
[23:24]Well, I'm going to tell you a quick story.
[23:27]I'm literally, I've been texting with the person
[23:29]about the picture on the chain.
[23:30]So let me just finish that.
[23:32]This is where we call multitasking.
[23:33]I love it.
[23:34]I make a suggestion.
[23:35]It gets implemented during the podcast.
[23:37]Immediately it should be up on the website before we're done.
[23:40]Okay, hold on.
[23:41]I have to pull this back because all of a sudden,
[23:43]everything just went weird, but now I'm back.
[23:46]So this, you know, here's a funny thing.
[23:48]When I was doing activity at yogurt commercials
[23:51]for a very long time, there were hand gestures
[23:55]that we had to use to demonstrate
[23:58]what the product was helping to achieve.
[24:03]And the first one, and I literally had training,
[24:08]training to learn how to go like this.
[24:12]And see where you go like this.
[24:15]Now it can't be, it's like it's truth in advertising.
[24:19]So it's, again, it's not a laxative
[24:22]and it's not, you know, it's a probiotic,
[24:26]but it's supposed to help you poop better.
[24:28]And so I had the training where I did this,
[24:31]but then there was all sorts of co-fuffling
[24:34]about, you know, what does this really mean?
[24:37]And so then the new, and if you go back
[24:41]and look at those commercials,
[24:42]which I love to doing, by the way,
[24:44]and the fun part of it was actually meeting people.
[24:47]But the second wave of the hand gesture
[24:51]was we couldn't do this anymore.
[24:53]So we had to talk about how it made you feel better.
[24:57]And the new gesture was this.
[24:59]It was like when you take this product,
[25:04]you feel lighter and better.
[25:05]And I had training in that too.
[25:08]And there is a commercial where I'm walking long,
[25:10]talking, talking, talking, and then I go like this, anyway.
[25:14]Hand gestures.
[25:15]Behind the scenes of the, who knew, who knew?
[25:19]My daughter would not forgive me if I didn't ask you
[25:21]at least one question about freaky Friday,
[25:24]which is like her favorite movie.
[25:25]So where they're, I just have to ask something.
[25:28]I don't know, I don't even have a question.
[25:29]I guess how was it filming that movie?
[25:31]And are you gonna be doing any more movies?
[25:34]Are you now like firmly in the children's book might come again?
[25:37]We might do another original, what's coming next?
[25:40]That was a lot of questions.
[25:41]That was like 25?
[25:42]Yes, sorry about that.
[25:43]It's all right, I'll watch this.
[25:45]Watch this most.
[25:47]I'm ready, I'm ready, I'm ready.
[25:50]I still make movies.
[25:51]I just had a Halloween movie.
[25:53]I was in the movie Knives Out last year.
[25:55]We have another Halloween movie to shoot.
[25:57]I may go off and make another movie.
[26:00]So yes, I'm in the movie business.
[26:01]I'm in the TV business as I have now a company
[26:05]that is trying to produce our own work.
[26:07]Part of which is the letters from Camp Podcast,
[26:10]which I believe fingers crossed
[26:13]that we will make more of more.
[26:15]It was always conceived as a three-summer show.
[26:19]We wanted to avoid teenagers
[26:21]because young girls are like, yes, we want to avoid teenagers.
[26:25]So we wanted to set a show in the summer of Mookie
[26:28]who first 12th, 13th, and 14th year.
[26:31]So we're hoping that that happens.
[26:33]And lastly, I loved Freaky Friday.
[26:37]It was a surprise for me.
[26:39]I was in the middle of a book tour.
[26:40]I had a 15-year-old daughter of my own and a five-year-old son
[26:45]and an actress pulled out of the movie.
[26:48]And I stepped on a moving train, honestly,
[26:53]sort of in three days, I was now pretending to be 15
[26:58]and 50 all at the same time.
[27:01]Like it was fantastic.
[27:03]And I think the reason why it's so good
[27:06]and why it was such a pleasure for me
[27:09]is that I had zero time to prepare for it, zero,
[27:14]on a scale of zero to 100, zero.
[27:17]Like honestly, like three days later, I was shooting.
[27:21]And so because of that, I had to just go, okay, whatever.
[27:24]How old am I?
[27:26]I mean, just like immediately release my ego
[27:30]and just be 15, which I was living with a 15-year-old.
[27:33]And I knew many 15-year-olds.
[27:35]And so it was very easy for me to do.
[27:38]And I think if I'd had a lot of time,
[27:41]I might have gotten very self-conscious about it.
[27:44]And in that sense, it was the freest I've ever been in my life.
[27:48]Just was like, okay, what am I doing today?
[27:50]Okay.
[27:51]And because of that, I think it was so successful
[27:54]because I was having the time of my life.
[27:57]Amazing.
[27:58]I love that.
[27:59]You can tell.
[28:00]It's like, it was so fun.
[28:01]It was amazing.
[28:02]And because of that movie,
[28:04]I will actually have put into the world of parenting,
[28:09]a phrase that I had lived, which is not my skill.
[28:14]I am not an improviser, but I did improvise
[28:17]because I was living with a 15-year-old of my own,
[28:19]shooting at the Palisades High School.
[28:22]The opening, my first day of work was at Pali High,
[28:26]very near from where I lived.
[28:27]And when the mom drops her daughter off
[28:32]and the daughter gets out of the car
[28:33]and the mom leans out the window and says,
[28:36]make good choices, out loud,
[28:39]while all of the kids are around her.
[28:41]It may be my proudest moment.
[28:43]And it certainly is going to be my legacy
[28:45]from that movie.
[28:46]It's make good choices, you know, will outlive me, I think.
[28:50]I think that's a good, if I were gonna make a title
[28:53]for this podcast, that would be it.
[28:55]Make good choices.
[28:55]That's like all of what you've talked about, right?
[28:57]In life, in literature, in articles and everything,
[29:01]giving back, it's all about that.
[29:03]But it's also about life is for living.
[29:07]We are here such a short time in the older yet.
[29:10]The time gets shorter.
[29:12]And it's time to really focus on making your moment count.
[29:18]Whatever it is, being, be it planting a seed
[29:22]in one of those gardens, be it holding one of those babies
[29:26]at Children's Hospital, where nobody is gonna be.
[29:30]It's not a glitzy gig.
[29:32]You're not gonna get a bunch of kudos.
[29:34]You're gonna feel it inside you.
[29:36]And I think the more I'm a public figure,
[29:39]the more I understand that all of the outside attention
[29:42]and I get a lot of attention means honestly nothing,
[29:46]that the only that self-esteem comes
[29:49]from doing esteemable things.
[29:51]That's the way it happens.
[29:52]You don't get self-esteem
[29:54]because you get a million followers on Instagram.
[29:57]You get self-esteem because you buy gross.
[30:00]freeze for your elderly neighbor. And you don't even tell them it's you. And you leave them
[30:05]a beautiful planted dahlia on your neighbor's porch without a note. That's how you get self-esteem.
[30:13]You get it from doing things for other human beings. And I hope that we can all live that way
[30:19]until we're not here anymore. And so that's actually my resin debt. My reason for doing it all,
[30:26]it's all boiled down to that. And I'm really happy to meet you. And I hope next time you're in
[30:31]California, you'll let me know. And we'll social distance walk or something. I would love that.
[30:36]Sounds great. Okay. Cool. All right. Thank you for having me. Of course. Thanks for joining me.
[30:40]Of course. Thank you. Tell your neighbor about the dahlias. You know, I'll keep it a
[30:44]couple more. A little secret. Perfect. Thanks everybody. Be well. Bye. Say bye.
[30:51]Thanks so much to Mindy Kayling and her book, Nothing Like I Imagine.
[30:56]First sponsoring this episode, you can get it on Amazon.com slash mini stories. And again,
[31:03]it's called Nothing Like I Imagine. Go check it out. Thanks for listening to this episode of
[31:08]Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at ZB Owens and
[31:13]at Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Also sign up for my newsletter at ZB Owens.com and sign
[31:18]up for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week. Thanks so much to
[31:23]Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound for the Sound Editing. And thank you to Morning Moon
[31:27]Productions for providing this fantastic intro and now trim music.