Suzanne Morrison, YOGA BITCH
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[1:00]Zibi Owens.com. Today I face time with Suzanne Morrison, who's the author of Yoga Bitch,
[1:05]which was an indie-bound bestseller, a cross-cut, best northwest book of 2011,
[1:10]and has been translated into seven languages. Yoga Bitch had it start as a long-running,
[1:14]one-woman show of the same title, which played in New York, London, and across the United States.
[1:19]A recipient of four culture and artist-trust grants. Her fiction and essays have appeared
[1:24]in American short fiction, pop-shot UK, Salt Hill, Washington Square, the Chicago Tribune,
[1:29]and elsewhere. She teaches memoir and fiction at Seattle's Hugo House, and at veteran centers
[1:34]through the red badge program. So welcome, Suzanne. Thanks so much for coming on mom's. Don't
[1:38]have time to read books. Thanks for having me. Of course. So can you please tell listeners
[1:43]what Yoga Bitch is about? Sure. So when I was in my mid-20s, shortly after graduating from college,
[1:50]I started doing yoga, I just sort of popped into this yoga studio in Seattle, kind of on a win,
[1:57]and there was this really extraordinary woman running the class. She was beautiful,
[2:01]she was smart, and she kind of had worked everything out in her life through yoga. This is what I
[2:07]came to learn the more time I sent to her yoga studio, and she ran the studio with her partner,
[2:14]Lou, and they were just these sort of spectacular movies. And this was kind of like old school
[2:20]Seattle yoga. So kind of on the heavier end of the spectrum, not like the, you know,
[2:26]posh sort of more corporate power yoga style that are prevalent today. This is a bit more
[2:31]brutal. But anyway, they taught these yoga teacher trainings that were like two and a half months
[2:37]in Bali every year. And on a total win, I just decided to go, and I didn't know if I wanted to be
[2:43]a yoga teacher or no, I just knew I wanted to spend more time in the crisis of this woman. Her name
[2:48]was Ingrath, and that's my color in the book. And I just kind of wanted to learn everything she knew
[2:52]because I felt like my life was a total mess at 25. I didn't really know where I was going,
[2:58]I was about to move to New York since September 11 just happened. I was like, is that crazy?
[3:03]And I was in this relationship with it. I really loved, but I wasn't sure that it was going to
[3:07]really, you know, go anywhere. And here was a woman who had figured everything out through
[3:12]yoga. And so I was like, well, maybe that would work for me too. And so that's what I did. And
[3:17]there were the experience resulted in in this book. Wouldn't it be nice to just be able to
[3:22]find something you love to do like yoga and then think that that makes you have everything in life
[3:26]figured out? I think that's a lot of spiritual practices. And that's what I mean when I say that
[3:33]this yoga practice was more old school because it was very much a spiritual practice. It was
[3:38]physical. We were doing hospital as well as meditation and things like that. But it was without
[3:42]question, a spiritual practice. And I think that that is why people convert Christianity or Judaism
[3:48]or Islam or any number of religions because or spiritual paths because there is this idea that
[3:55]if you can find a way to sort of train yourself to see the world and to see yourself that you're
[4:01]going to then have better instincts and then be able to trust yourself for it as a result of like
[4:06]better decision as a result of that, be happier. And I think for some people that might be true,
[4:10]it wasn't probably me. I like how you say upfront that you were reading all these spiritual
[4:18]memoirs but then hiding that from everybody as if it was like a shameful activity. And yet here
[4:24]like you're writing this book, I mean it's like sort of the, I mean not the antidote to a spiritual
[4:29]memoir but like an offshoot of a spiritual memory. Some would say it is one, but yeah it's kind of like
[4:35]an anti spiritual memoir. It's not, it's not, I think it is a spiritual memoir. I mean I think that
[4:41]the term is sometimes unfairly maligned and perhaps I think that now because I've written one,
[4:47]but yeah it was super embarrassed to be reading them in my 20s. You know there were all sorts
[4:50]they were like, you know, Buddhist memoirs and Christian memoirs and you know pretty much any religious
[4:58]experience I read about it. And in Seattle this like really secular city. This is not a very religious
[5:06]place, especially in the city itself. If we get around to the outskirts it changed a lot. But the
[5:11]really deeply skeptical city, pretty atheist is probably think of it. And so it seemed even
[5:16]cheesy or like really corny to be reading these books. And then to find myself writing one after
[5:21]you know a few years later I was like wow well I've really tipped over to the other side here.
[5:27]And I just think it was so great that you actually went on one of those retreats because I feel
[5:31]like I hear about these things all the time and I always wonder like what would that be like
[5:36]if I just picked up my life and tried it. And then that's what you did for like the rest of us.
[5:43]Yeah I mean I've always loved to travel. I have never planned that part of the world. I was
[5:47]really thinking naive about it. I really didn't know what to expect from Indonesia. And Bali is
[5:53]so unique within Indonesia. You know it's the practice ball of these Hinduism there whereas
[5:58]Islam is the biggest religion in Indonesia otherwise. But I've really had no idea where I was going.
[6:05]And I didn't do really any research either. I was just kind of in this book post-college like
[6:11]days I think. But I will say like having talked to people who've gone to other types of yoga
[6:16]retreats, I think this one was kind of unique. It wasn't in the sense that we did a lot of yoga.
[6:22]We meditated. We did Pranayama which is the breathing exercises. We studied yoga history. But
[6:28]there was also it was pretty hardcore. And we did yoga like eight hours a day and did so much
[6:35]meditation. And then as you discover they're like you know on page 30 of the book or something
[6:39]a lot of these people were drinking there in Europe. Yes you are definitely allowed to say that.
[6:45]And by the way I mentioned that to my kids I was like you're never going to believe what's going on
[6:49]in the book I'm reading right now. And they were like actually I told them first when you were
[6:54]debating whether or not to do it. I was like the girl and so then they kept asking like did she do
[6:58]it? It's like the question I get from everybody. I'll never live it down. But yeah I mean that
[7:05]was sort of shocking. I was like wow these people are so hardcore. But I didn't really just
[7:10]have hardcore. They really weren't until I understood that they were doing that. And there's
[7:13]this whole like spiritual reason for doing it according to them. And I've read a bunch of books
[7:17]about it. Like when I got home from Bali I bought all these books. What on earth were they doing?
[7:23]And yeah there's there are all sorts of theories esoteric sort of theories about why that's
[7:29]for you both physically and spiritually. But that's just like how tipped over these people were
[7:35]into the wood right? Like there were just doing things that were so outside the mainstream. And certainly
[7:39]outside of like what we think of as yoga now you know like yoga is so mainstream these days.
[7:45]You were like poking so much fun. I feel like at your roommate Jessica. And then by the end
[7:51]you had successfully sort of corrupted her back to the land of cynicism and like you know I
[7:57]don't know breaking the rules and all the rest of it. Yeah we had a lot of fun. We were so different
[8:02]like so completely different. And you know I was like a smoker and I you know like to drink and eat
[8:10]meat and she was very pure by comparison. And by the end I think we were both kind of rubbed
[8:15]off on each other in ways. But I think we're really good. And you know we've a friend who stayed
[8:20]in touch. I haven't really talked for very much lately. But she she actually posted me when I
[8:23]was on the book tour. And they run my event and yeah she's really a wonderful person. And she runs
[8:29]her own yoga studio. She's really got involved in activism and thinking like that. She's really
[8:35]a great person. But we were so completely different. So it really could have we could have just like
[8:40]really hated living together. But we ended up having a lot of fun. And I feel like you tapped
[8:46]into the whole sort of forming your identity and as an offshoot of that like am I dating the
[8:53]right person sort of adjective that plagues many in their twenties when you're trying to figure out
[8:59]all the big answers in life. And I feel like you're doubting over and over like sometimes when you
[9:04]you were writing this diary within the book everything was fine. And then next day you were doubting
[9:08]it. And then it was fine. And I was like I've so been there. And that's like everyone has been in
[9:14]that moment. And you captured it really well. Oh thank you. Yeah being in your twenties is so hard.
[9:19]You know I mean like 40s now. And you know every decade has its challenges you know. But your
[9:24]twenties are so challenging. They're so hard. It's so hard not to know like how you want to live yet.
[9:30]You don't really know you know kind of what your daily rhythms are even. And how important
[9:36]those things are going to be in terms of who you partner up with if you do partner up.
[9:41]And I think for me and I think I put this in the book that when I went to Bali I was just my head
[9:48]was so confused about where I was going to my life. And so I made a vowels for myself because
[9:53]what I had noticed was that when I wrote in my journal I was lying to myself. Like
[10:00]really hardcore.
[10:01]You know, like I'd be full of all this doubt about my relationships, but on the page I would be like,
[10:05]things are great.
[10:06]I love my voice.
[10:07]I'm so much.
[10:08]Things are hard.
[10:09]But hard is good.
[10:10]Our challenging is good in our relationship.
[10:11]You know, I had all these like series that I would sort of use, you know, I think all
[10:15]young women do.
[10:16]Probably a lot of young men as well.
[10:18]We were like, no, it's good if we don't get along all the time.
[10:21]We challenge these me or whatever it is.
[10:23]And so I made this vow that I was not going to lie in my journal and it made a huge difference
[10:27]in my life.
[10:28]And I think that just that one decision to be honest in this one place, this journal
[10:33]is mine.
[10:34]You know, when I knew, I knew I wasn't going to burn it when I got home, but I told myself
[10:39]I could put it or that I could just leave it in the nation and some dumpster or something
[10:42]like that so long as I was really honest.
[10:44]And I think that was a game changer for me both in terms of learning about myself and my
[10:49]tendencies.
[10:50]But also I think it's what made me a writer and I know it's been a writer, but I think
[10:53]this is the first time I was like, if I'm going to be a writer, I have to actually be
[10:58]willing to face what's true for me.
[11:01]So how long after you got home and you kept the journal, did you think to yourself, maybe
[11:06]I should try to publish this?
[11:07]Well, the book is definitely not my journal, my journal is a lot more boring.
[11:12]Actually, when I got home, I noticed New York a few months later.
[11:16]And then originally, I didn't know that it was going to be a book.
[11:19]I mean, I think I thought it might be, but I need for sure I wanted it to be a one-woman
[11:22]show.
[11:23]Because my background was in the theater and I was moving to New York to pursue solo
[11:28]performance.
[11:29]Mostly, I didn't really want to be a traditional actress and basically just play a bunch
[11:33]of girlfriends and wives and mothers.
[11:35]I wanted to tell my own story, I wanted to write and produce and perform my own shows.
[11:40]And here all of a sudden, I had this story.
[11:41]It was like crazy.
[11:42]You have a retreat and all of this inner turmoil.
[11:46]And so that's what I did in New York.
[11:47]I spent a few years putting the show together and then performing it in New York.
[11:52]And then I moved back to Seattle.
[11:54]And by the time the show was up on its seat, I knew I needed to write it as a book.
[12:00]Because what I found was that the ethical writing for the stage and writing for the page
[12:05]are really, really different in terms of the sorts of things you can do.
[12:10]Because it has all this like spiritual stuff in it that I wanted to explore that really
[12:14]didn't perform well on stage to really get into the complexity and the sort of inner
[12:21]contradictions of a spiritual path or an attempt at faith that it just really didn't
[12:27]work on stage.
[12:28]Like all of those things back cut from the show, but they were in many ways the thing
[12:32]was the most important to me.
[12:33]And so I started writing it as a book and then that took me years and years.
[12:39]And originally it was I wanted to be like a comic novel and it really didn't work very
[12:45]well.
[12:46]I was trying to improve the main character so much, like me, I was trying to make feel
[12:50]like really like way smarter and like cooler and she had like amazing racks, like a little
[12:59]like body.
[13:00]And then she just went vulnerable now and so my agent at the time sent it out as a novel
[13:06]to a bunch of publishers.
[13:07]It was roundly rejected and then one thing that the editors was like, this really should
[13:12]be a memoir.
[13:13]Obviously a true story led and she just write it as a memoir and the time memoir was
[13:17]like kind of huge and publishing and I was like, absolutely not, I'm definitely not going
[13:22]to do that.
[13:23]I've written it as a show, I've written it as a novel, like how many more ways am I going
[13:26]to write this story.
[13:27]And so I kind of sat on it for a year and then I woke up in the middle of the night and
[13:31]I had this epiphany and I was like, oh, I should write the memoir as like diary entries
[13:37]from where I have like no perspective so like your thrust right into the middle of the
[13:41]experience in Bali.
[13:42]And then interspersed that with perspective from today, like, I don't know, eight years later,
[13:48]five years later, a camera board is now.
[13:50]But once I had that realization that that could work, then the memoir, I won't say I wrote
[13:54]itself for the devil and didn't, but then it happened, I guess.
[13:58]Awesome.
[13:59]And then what happened?
[14:00]Did you send it to the same publisher who said that or did you end up with a different
[14:02]one?
[14:03]We ended up with a different one.
[14:04]It was Random House and I had a really great experience there.
[14:07]I loved my editor, kind of amazing team there and they took really good care of it.
[14:11]So in the end, I was really, really happy with how everything worked out.
[14:15]That's great.
[14:16]And now you're doing a new memoir.
[14:18]Is that true?
[14:19]I read that somewhere.
[14:20]But maybe it's not true.
[14:21]No, actually, I have, I actually have a couple books in the in-profits right now.
[14:24]I have one that's all that's finished.
[14:26]I just need to kind of tweak some things and that's, it's basically autobiographical
[14:30]fiction and it's called Thinking Like a Girl and it's a coming-of-age story, certainly
[14:37]intellectual and sexual coming-of-age story about how like what I was drawing from was
[14:43]sort of my pretentious youth because I went off to Europe at their high school.
[14:47]There was no money for the kind of college I wanted to go to.
[14:49]So I just raised my own money and took myself to Europe to like do theater and be a writer.
[14:53]And it was super pretentious and I really wanted to explore that like the girl who does
[14:59]the thing like boys have historically done boy artists.
[15:03]I mean, taking herself way too seriously and having all sorts of artistic feelings all over
[15:11]the place.
[15:12]And sort of how, you know, it's another, this one also deals with sort of young love
[15:16]in terms of I think a lot of young women who aspire to be artists think that they need
[15:22]to have a partner who matches that in some way.
[15:26]Like maybe it's a hugely dramatic love story and that's what this one was.
[15:30]And what I write in the book is this love story that is totally terrible, like the worst.
[15:37]But because it's a dramatic, it feels very artistic.
[15:40]And sort of that central lie that I think a lot of young women who are artists have that
[15:46]your life is supposed to be kind of a mess for you to be an artist.
[15:50]That makes sense.
[15:51]Yeah.
[15:52]So I think I've got that and then have a novel.
[15:54]Oh, tell me about that.
[15:57]Tell me about that.
[15:58]It's basically the theater company.
[16:00]You know, I come from the theater, so I'm always going to be about theater.
[16:03]And it's about these two best friends who form a theater company in the booming 90s in Seattle.
[16:10]And it all comes crashing down in the recession in 2008 and 2009.
[16:16]And so sort of about all these characters in the theater company and what happens after their
[16:21]theater company sort of implodes.
[16:24]And it spans basically their entire lifetimes.
[16:27]Like we start when one of the characters is like five and just discover it in a theater.
[16:31]And then it's going to end actually probably like 2050, which is sort of crazy to be trying
[16:37]to think about the future like that because it's not what I've ever done.
[16:41]But I've just been thinking about this sort of like ancient art form, which is theater
[16:46]and how it changes over time as these people have lives changed.
[16:50]So yeah.
[16:51]Anyway, I know that like two thirds of the way through that one and having a lot of fun with
[16:54]it.
[16:55]That's great.
[16:56]Have any advice to aspiring authors?
[16:58]Yeah.
[16:59]Oh my gosh.
[17:00]Well, I think the number one thing is you have to read and read and read, it's the biggest
[17:05]thing.
[17:06]I mean, I mean, a lot of aspiring authors who don't read and oftentimes the attitude
[17:10]is that they don't have time to read.
[17:13]And well, I just don't know how one writes without reading.
[17:18]I always think of reading as sort of like the gasoline in the car, you know?
[17:22]And so you need the energy that you get from reading in order to write.
[17:26]So that's the biggest one.
[17:27]It's the more you read, the better your writing will be.
[17:30]And the more you'll write too, I think it inspires writing.
[17:32]I also think since we've been talking so much about relationships, finding someone who
[17:36]thinks it's great that you want to write.
[17:38]Because I've known a number of people, mostly women, honestly, who have given up on
[17:44]ask for artistic exploration because they're with someone who doesn't support it.
[17:50]So I think that's really important, maybe kind of overlooked when people talk about
[17:55]what helps you write.
[17:56]It really does help to have a whole life that supports it.
[17:59]Do you have that?
[18:00]Oh, yeah, absolutely.
[18:02]Absolutely.
[18:03]Yeah.
[18:04]And really what that means is someone who will leave you alone.
[18:06]I mean, I think it's the same.
[18:09]I want to marry somebody who doesn't want to spend any time with me.
[18:13]I'm so terrible.
[18:15]Like somebody who likes to spend time with obviously, but if you're going to close your door
[18:18]for like a couple of hours and a while, there's no respect that.
[18:22]And I'm not going to feel like you're abandoning them.
[18:25]Yeah.
[18:26]Because there's just no way to write without solitude.
[18:28]You need it.
[18:29]And so I think that's probably the other thing is to cultivate a good relationship with
[18:33]solitude because that's where you're going to be.
[18:37]You said I think a lot about people not having time to read since I made that the title
[18:43]of this podcast.
[18:44]I know.
[18:45]People are always talking to me about that.
[18:46]You know, I have four kids and I was having trouble fitting it in and I always do because
[18:50]I love it.
[18:51]And it's sort of like anything you love, you find time to do.
[18:56]Right.
[18:57]It's everything is a trade off essentially.
[18:58]But how do you like, when do you read this on bed or when do I read?
[19:02]Yeah.
[19:03]Well, now I read all the time because I'm like doing this podcast.
[19:05]I used to mostly write.
[19:06]That's a great way to make yourself read more.
[19:08]Right?
[19:09]I know.
[19:10]Thank you for calling me out on my assertive.
[19:14]My motivation to read more now I've looped in like hundreds of authors to make me stay
[19:20]on track.
[19:21]No, awesome.
[19:22]No, I used to just read before bed and a lot of times I would sort of fall asleep and
[19:27]like always on vacation.
[19:28]And I read quickly.
[19:29]I don't know about you, but I could read like five books in a week on vacation and that
[19:33]would sustain me for the next couple months until my kids next vacation, although now that
[19:38]I'm thinking about it, I didn't actually read a lot on my vacations with kids because
[19:41]that's not even really like vacation, but right because you're playing with your kids,
[19:45]right?
[19:46]Yeah.
[19:47]Even more time with kids.
[19:48]But now I read like all day I bring books around with me everywhere and I feel like all
[19:52]those dead times when you could be on your phone, if you read, the page is really add
[19:55]up.
[19:56]That's the biggest thing, right?
[19:58]The phone.
[19:59]The phone's are what is keeping people.
[20:00]for reading. Like, there's that thing on the iPhone, you can see how much screen time you
[20:03]spent on your phone. Yeah. And I took Facebook off my phone when I saw what that number
[20:08]one. I can't remember what it was, but it was appalling. You know, it was probably well over
[20:13]an hour at least that I was on my phone every day. And for some people, that's probably
[20:17]not even that much. But if you think about like, well, like it's been an hour on Facebook
[20:21]or it could read a lot, and I can read a lot in an hour, that makes a big difference.
[20:25]But I think it's really challenging to become a writer today. Especially if you're younger and
[20:29]grown up with this technology, I would think, because I grew up without it. You know,
[20:33]I had to make an email address for 22 or 21. Me too. Right? Yeah. I feel like we're the same age, but
[20:42]probably, yeah, 43. Yeah. Because like everything you were saying about like things going on in the
[20:47]world in your book at a certain age, I was like, Oh, me too. Same for you. Yeah. Same thing. Yeah.
[20:53]We're like this weird sort of past generation, right? Or we like came of age without this stuff,
[20:57]but like adopted it in our 20s. Totally. When do you like to read?
[21:01]Oh, all the time. I mean, I'm just always have kind of like you. It's like you're waiting for
[21:06]a bus or you're, you know, sitting outside the doctor's appointment. But then I also read often
[21:10]in the morning. Like if I have a writing day, I also teach. So if it's a day when I'm writing,
[21:16]I often read first thing in the morning that really helps me sort of get into the right
[21:20]frame of mind to write. Read every night before bed without question and then often for
[21:25]at least an hour, because I'm kind of a night out. But yeah, but definitely just throughout the
[21:29]day. It's all I want to do. I know. I like this. This is pathetic that all I want to do is like
[21:37]sit here and read about things that are not actually my own life. I know I agree. But sometimes I'm
[21:44]like, what does this mean? Some escape this. I don't know. I guess like interacting with people.
[21:52]Right. Exactly. Yeah, who wants to do that?
[21:55]Right. Keep reading and writing. That's, that's, that's my happy place to do that.
[21:59]Yeah. Well, great. Thank you so much for coming on mom's time to read books. And I hope I get to
[22:04]meet you in person at some point. And thank you so much for all your time. Thank you so much for
[22:10]having me. Of course. All right. Take care. Thanks for listening to mom's don't have time to read books,
[22:16]the award winning podcast. Today's episode of mom's don't have time to read books was sponsored by
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