Cathy Guisewite, FIFTY THINGS THAT AREN'T MY FAULT
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[0:34]I'm thrilled to be interviewing Cathy Guiswite, the Emmy winning creator of the Cathy
[0:38]comic strip that ran in almost 1400 newspapers for 34 years.
[0:43]Cathy's book, 50 Things That Aren't My Filed, is amazing and so funny, Cathy currently
[0:48]lives in California.
[0:49]Hi, Cathy.
[0:50]How are you?
[0:51]Hi.
[0:52]I'm Gray Zibi.
[0:53]Thank you for having me.
[0:54]Oh, my gosh.
[0:55]I worked the name of your podcast.
[0:56]Oh, thank you.
[0:58]I feel like I should be your one woman marketing team because I've recommended your book
[1:03]to so many people because I've literally never left so hard at a book in my lifetime.
[1:07]Oh, oh, thank you so much.
[1:10]It was so funny.
[1:11]I loved, I knew from the beginning your introduction if I could just read the first few
[1:14]sentences.
[1:15]I'm standing in the door of my closet on the threshold of what happens next, clutching
[1:18]my last shred of personal power, a great big black trash bag into which I want to dump all
[1:23]my clothes.
[1:24]Nothing fits.
[1:25]I don't mean haha, nothing fits.
[1:26]I mean, nothing fits.
[1:29]So talk to me about how you decided to start your book off this way and how you decided
[1:34]to start your book off at all.
[1:36]I started the book off this way because that's exactly the feeling of the time of my
[1:40]life where I just want to like clear everything out to claim some control over these years,
[1:46]these grown up years where everything feels like a fat of my control.
[1:50]I want to dump everything in a trash bag, start over.
[1:54]that the exact same time because everything is changing and disappearing, I want to keep
[2:00]everything.
[2:01]So it's a push and pull that informs pretty much the whole book and my life at this
[2:06]time, this push and pull between wanting to have some control, feeling I'm losing control
[2:11]and wanting to have some control.
[2:14]I did not set out to write a book.
[2:17]The book came together as a series of stories about little stories about this time of
[2:23]a great big transition, just like I had for so many years dumped all emotions, all angst,
[2:30]all guilt, all shame, all triumph into the little four boxes of the comic strip.
[2:35]I worked all that stuff out on paper when everything started changing in such huge ways
[2:41]after I quit the comic strip, I think it's like I had to process it on paper.
[2:47]I mean, I had to write out what was going on and the act of writing helped me find
[2:53]the humor and situations that were not funny.
[2:57]One of the essays is called Novocaine in the Waiting Room.
[3:00]And this grew from like all the essays did from a real experience of me sitting in the
[3:05]dinner shop with 20 minutes to spare waiting for my appointment time, sobbing over the
[3:12]parenting books in the waiting room, looking at page after page of all the beautiful
[3:18]mother daughter stories in the books.
[3:20]All the things I should have could have would have wished I had done with my daughter
[3:25]and desperately wanting to reclaim that time.
[3:29]If I were doing a comic strip, it would just be like a little joke about that.
[3:33]But in this essay, in the essay form, I could write about all the hopes and dreams I
[3:40]had as a mom and what, you know, like I thought it would be so easy to add an infant
[3:46]to my life, how I could work from home, draw the comic strip with one hand while rocking
[3:51]my baby with the other hand.
[3:53]And the diversity reality of what happened and it was like a way to work out all of kind
[3:58]of the emotion of that on paper.
[4:00]Well, I came through and was so just relatable and you allowed the reader to sort of laugh
[4:05]along with you at some points.
[4:07]And also, you know, some moments were just poignant and sad that chapter you referenced,
[4:12]you know, that like tucked at the heartstrings.
[4:14]So I feel like in addition to doing a lot of about your mothering, you talked about your
[4:20]sort of daughtering, if you could make that a verb, because you, and I'm going to quote
[4:24]you, said I became a full-time mom at the very moment my daughter, who was going away
[4:28]to college, decided to reject all infant from anyone over age 30.
[4:31]I became a full-time daughter, the moment my parents announced they would barricade the
[4:35]front door if I tried to bring in anyone or anything to a system.
[4:39]So I wanted to know what this moment in time has really been like for you aside from
[4:43]the fact that now you have to eat chicken that's been in the freezer for like 12 years
[4:47]from your mom's house.
[4:49]Yeah.
[4:50]It's been a great big tangle of emotions that felt like everything is spinning out of
[4:56]control.
[4:57]You know, I read about it feeling like the Panini generation was squashed between my
[5:02]parents' generation trying to care for my aging parents and trying to care for my aging
[5:06]daughter and kind to figure out my own aging body squashed in the middle and not having
[5:11]time to do all the things in life that I thought I could do.
[5:14]And also reflecting on those things like in an essay called The Attack Mom, it's the very
[5:22]real experience of missing my daughter, you know, desperately wanting to talk to her, express
[5:28]all the pride and love and encouragement and support when she went away to college.
[5:34]And then waiting in the airport ready to dump all of that on her when she gets off the
[5:38]plane.
[5:39]And I see her, you know, I criticize her here.
[5:43]I criticize her, you know, the bumpy clothes.
[5:46]She's wearing the stuff pouring out of her bag.
[5:48]I'm like a one woman home security squad, you know, criticizing everything, seeing all
[5:54]the wrong things that she bought off the airplane with her.
[5:57]The book is a lot about the complicated emotions that we have at all times of our life.
[6:04]And it's a lot about like there is some of the essays that are looking back and thinking
[6:09]about the ways that my generation thought we were changing the world for women that
[6:13]aren't changed at all.
[6:14]Some ways the world has changed that we did change, that I think make it even more complicated
[6:19]for young women.
[6:20]Like one of the essays is called The Build the Boo Bork Shop, where I talk about the difference
[6:26]between my generations where I'm on so many books and all of our clothes.
[6:31]So the horror of a white brush strap showing wouldn't ever be seen versus my daughter,
[6:38]shopping with my daughter who rushes in, you know, toward the magenta, push-up power
[6:45]bra with the matching song that is meant to be displayed, you know, it's meant to be shown
[6:50]on the outside.
[6:51]The essays gave me the freedom to write about the complicated feeling of being part of the
[6:56]generation that liberated women from feeling restricted in how they felt about their bodies.
[7:02]And then now seeing our daughters take that freedom and us feeling like me feeling that
[7:08]it makes the next generation more vulnerable in a way, literally more naked and more vulnerable.
[7:15]Not right or wrong, it's just complicated.
[7:17]And it was great how you were able to weave in that layer of, you know, parenting in different
[7:23]decades, you know, different eras with all the just moment to moment, you know, crises
[7:28]about parenting and also about, you know, just being a mom yourself, you were talking
[7:34]at one point with a bunch of your fellow mom friends from when your daughter was in kindergarten
[7:38]and you were all sitting around commiserating about taking care of your parents, which I
[7:43]thought was such an interesting moment, you know, an interesting vantage point.
[7:48]Can you talk about how it's been trying to, you know, deal with them at the same time or
[7:52]how it was at the, when you wrote the book?
[7:56]As you'd like, like helicopter daughter, like that, as he is about trying to get the car keys away
[8:01]from our parents and literally the challenge where at this age, it feels like we're raising children
[8:07]except we're being parents to children except now we're being a parents to our parents and there
[8:12]aren't instruction books and there aren't guides for this time and there aren't all those books
[8:17]saying this is normal at this stage. And it's the sadness of watching all the developed milestones
[8:23]go backwards, you know, mom and dad could run, now they can walk, then they can walk slower,
[8:27]then they're walking with a walker, et cetera, et cetera and it's the person and it's very comforting
[8:33]as it always has been to have the support of other women and know other women are going through
[8:38]the same things and, you know, kind of reaching out, reaching out with a hand to each other.
[8:43]In an essay called helicopter daughter, I talk about chasing my parents around the house,
[8:48]you know, trying to get them to where there's security alert pendants because to keep them safe
[8:54]when my sisters and I aren't there and how fragile they feel to me, how wonderful it is that
[9:00]they feel so independent that they don't want anybody to think they're old or see anything in
[9:05]their house that makes them look old. They're so independent and yet they seem so fragile to me
[9:11]and it's scary, you know, it's scary to be a parent to my parents and it's a little bit sad and it helps
[9:17]me a lot to help my process by working it out in the essays. The humor again was just so,
[9:25]I mean, you were so funny, like this, the chapter when you were helping with the laptop where it
[9:33]was duct taped down to the desk and you were trying to get your dad to move it and he was saying,
[9:38]the battery might not be charged and you were like, it's been charging for three years.
[9:43]Just so funny. I mean, oh my gosh, anyway, it was hilarious. I also like how you have just sort of a
[9:49]commentary on life as it is today in your chapter. I would wash my hands of this if only I could,
[9:55]you talk about how you can't get those automatic sinks to work in the ladies' room and I was laughing so
[10:00]And I had the same thing.
[10:01]I felt like I personally was cursed.
[10:02]Like I'm the only one who can't figure those things out.
[10:05]So I was just wondering.
[10:07]What is that?
[10:08]I don't know.
[10:08]It's crazy.
[10:10]Like, who thought that would be easier?
[10:12]First little moment, stack up on us.
[10:14]You know, when you look around and even the old ladies,
[10:17]even the little tiny toddlers are sticking their hands under
[10:20]the sink and it's recognizing them as human life forms.
[10:23]You know, getting water, they can get soap,
[10:25]they can get the towels.
[10:26]And when I stick my hand under the sink, nothing happens.
[10:29]It's like I don't exist to the automatic and washing system.
[10:34]And there's, you know, and OK, they're frustrating
[10:37]little moments.
[10:38]And it's frustrating to even be bothered by the moments.
[10:41]But I'm saying that those little moments,
[10:43]where the world seems to work differently
[10:45]for everybody else than it works for me,
[10:48]they stack up in us and on us.
[10:50]And by the end of the day, a day that starts out so triumphantly,
[10:53]when all those little things stack up on us,
[10:57]it kind of chips away at your sense of confidence and competence
[11:00]and your sense of yourself.
[11:02]And we need to know, you know,
[11:05]we need to know what's happening for everybody.
[11:07]That's very comforting for me, thank you.
[11:10]You also, another essay that I was crying laughing at
[11:14]was when you were in the sporting good store
[11:16]and you were trapped in the sports bra.
[11:18]In the dressing room, and you said,
[11:20]I've been stuck in the sports bra for 17 minutes,
[11:22]have contorted my body,
[11:23]every way possible to get out of it.
[11:25]Try to wrench it upward, tug it downward,
[11:27]pry it away from my crush rib cage.
[11:28]You just go on and on about it
[11:30]and until you're like imagining you're going to be found
[11:33]in that dressing room and never escape.
[11:35]But it's just like, it's just so great.
[11:38]Cause I mean, how great to shine light on, as you said,
[11:41]these little frustrations that make up life
[11:45]when you're going through these moments.
[11:46]Are you thinking to yourself?
[11:48]Like, oh my gosh, I have to write this as an essay.
[11:50]I'm not thinking I have to write it,
[11:52]but I do, but I, yeah, when I got home from those moments,
[11:55]I did write it and I found comfort in writing it out,
[11:59]exactly like I used to find comfort in writing the comic strip.
[12:03]In that, but I love that I could go on,
[12:05]I could make kind of a bigger point about some things.
[12:09]Like in that essay, I have the time and space in that essay
[12:12]to talk about how sports bras are a perfect example
[12:16]of something that was invented for women
[12:19]that should liberate women to participate in sports.
[12:23]It's a very freeing, it should be a very freeing piece of clothing.
[12:27]It makes it possible for women to run and play all those sports
[12:31]like the boys do.
[12:33]And yet, if you can get one on, most of us can't get it off.
[12:38]And so it kind of becomes a lot of things invented
[12:44]for women that seem like they're making the world better
[12:47]for us are actually just constricting us in new and differently packaged ways.
[12:52]And, you know, it kind of helps to be aware of that.
[12:55]It's like how my generation burnt up and got rid of girdles that were done.
[13:00]We were free of that.
[13:01]We now can love our beautiful, healthy bodies in all shapes and forms.
[13:06]My generation helped liberate us.
[13:08]I was in the airport yesterday.
[13:09]You know, there's a spanks store in almost every airport I go into,
[13:14]as though a woman can't even get on a plane without buying the new version of the girdle,
[13:19]which is like pretty much just to me, spanks intended to help mold the person's body
[13:27]into a shape that it isn't exactly.
[13:30]And why are we doing that at a time when we're supposed to feel so good about ourselves?
[13:34]Complicated, so I can say.
[13:37]And it links back to all the time you spend writing about food, right?
[13:41]And trying to find comfort from food yourself.
[13:44]And then obviously the After Effects, like the scene you wrote when you were counting out the almonds
[13:48]and trying to measure because, of course, like the 436 grams of almonds.
[13:53]Like what does that even mean when you were trying to portion it out for yourself?
[13:57]I just love your inner dialogue about eating.
[13:59]Well, and there is an awesome essay called My Meaningless Six Minute.
[14:03]My meaningless midlife six minute slang where I write about the experience I've had
[14:08]sadly way more than one time or I'm in the grocery store and realize that the single
[14:14]serving snack bag that I picked up in eight while I was shopping and pending, of course,
[14:19]to pay for it, but I ate it during the course of the shopping.
[14:23]Realizing that it didn't contain one serving, it contained, you know, six servings.
[14:28]And realizing that in my first few minutes of shopping, I've now eaten more calories
[14:33]than I'm supposed to eat in an entire day just because I didn't squint hard enough.
[14:38]And then you cheat on your Fitbit.
[14:40]I cheated on my Fitbit.
[14:42]Yes, I did.
[14:43]That was a powerful moment where I walked out of the house without anything counting my steps.
[14:48]So I'm going back to the food.
[14:50]And I watched my daughter criticize me for my relationship with Cool Whip.
[14:55]I just loved with his part of a long, long list of foods that are not allowed in my house.
[15:01]I'm wondering if you're going to stand for this code, man.
[15:03]I just eat it frozen and solid.
[15:06]Did you say you wanted to go back to talking about the eating or was it about the Cool Whip?
[15:10]Well, the interesting thing about eating, I also make some comparisons with men in the book.
[15:15]And, you know, men don't count their food.
[15:18]And it seems like women, I measure all food.
[15:21]Like the almond essay, but I measure all food.
[15:23]I never have eaten a bowl of cereal in my life without measuring it.
[15:26]I cheat because they always have a little bit extra.
[15:29]And I always congratulate myself with celebratory servings.
[15:34]But when I talk about being married for a period of time and the difference between the relationship with food that women have and the relationship with food that men have and it's just wrong and have a lot more time and a lot more freedom in their lives.
[15:51]That's all I can say.
[15:52]It's among the things that are not our fault.
[15:54]I saw on Instagram that you were at a book signing recently with your mom.
[15:58]And I was wondering how your family feels about all the things that you talked about in the book about them and like adopting your daughter and just all the stuff about your family.
[16:08]Are they happy?
[16:09]I mean, she literally looked very proud.
[16:11]I'm sure she is.
[16:12]Did they feel comfortable with that?
[16:13]Yeah.
[16:14]My mom has always had my mom in the book.
[16:16]I write about her being age 90 now.
[16:18]She's 97.
[16:19]And she not only did the book signing things the other day, but I am the narrator on the audiobook for 50 things that aren't my father.
[16:27]And mom did the mom narrated the mom parts of many of the essays in the 50 things that are my fault, which is just of course unbelievably meaningful things for me to have mom's voice on my audiobook.
[16:41]But also it was a blast for mom.
[16:44]She has always had a great capacity for complete denial.
[16:48]If she doesn't want to admit that it was her in the comedy series and doesn't want to admit that it's her in the book.
[16:55]So she has a great sense of humor about herself.
[16:58]And when she doesn't have a sense of humor, then she just pretends I'm writing about somebody else.
[17:02]And for my daughter, we've, you know, we've been through the worst mother daughter years and we're now I think in the best ones where she and I are a best best friends.
[17:15]And I write more much more than 50 things that aren't my fault.
[17:20]I write because I never had a child cat thing ever had a kid in the comic strip.
[17:25]And this book is much more about the circle of life, about being a mother, daughter, mother, daughter being part of that circle.
[17:32]And my daughter appreciates her part in it.
[17:35]And I think she really appreciates the fact that the essays I wrote about mother, daughter things.
[17:41]I wrote much more from the point of view of me as her mom not who she was and is, you know, the challenges of being her mom.
[17:50]One of the very first essays I did after I quit the strip and after I had this long year of her, you know, being her mom while she went through her last year of high school.
[18:02]She was about to leave for college and I was walking through the house in this, she wasn't home.
[18:07]She was walking through the house of this trail of her belongings through the house, the sweatshirts, the tank tops, jewelry, the, you know, all the stuff that teenage daughter leaves wine around.
[18:18]I was walking through the trail of the house just overwhelmed with grief that this time of life was over.
[18:25]She was about to move to college and it would never, ever be the same with her.
[18:29]I had quit the strip.
[18:30]I'd had this time and now it was done, never coming back and just to profound quiet and loneliness and emptiness of that.
[18:38]And then I realized that she had already left for college two days.
[18:42]It wasn't what she was taking this trail of her belongings was all the stuff she had left in the house for me to pick up.
[18:51]And then I moved from being grief stricken to being irritated, you know, with myself that I'd never taught her, you know, had to pick up how to take care of her stuff.
[19:00]Why was she, you know, she was so spoiled that, you know, that she left it all for mom to do.
[19:06]And I, I wound up just on the bed of her room surrounding myself with stuffed animals and just sort of crying into the complicated emotions of all of that of everything I hoped and dream for her.
[19:19]Everything I wanted for her, everything she is and just, you know, the combination of sadness and irritation.
[19:26]That circumstance became the start of an essay.
[19:30]One of my favorite essays in the book called It Took a Village where I talk about all that.
[19:36]The loss and the happiness and the letting go and the hanging on and what it's like to be a mom.
[19:44]It was just so great that you shared your experience.
[19:47]It was, I mean, one of the best I've read really.
[19:50]Do you have any advice to aspiring authors now that you've made it through your amazing book?
[19:56]You know, I've never made anything up.
[20:00]Paul, you'll say that. I just always sometimes it takes a while to get to the truth of things,
[20:06]but you know, I've always just written honestly from exactly what's going on in my life.
[20:11]And I think that when people do that, that it's, you know, sort of magically relatable to other
[20:17]people. It seems like we all go through a lot of the same things.
[20:21]Well, I would definitely call this book magically relatable. That was a great way to put it.
[20:25]So thank you so much for coming on Momstone. Have time to read books and sharing your story.
[20:30]Thank you so much for having me. My pleasure.
[20:32]Today's episode was sponsored by cereal box. S-C-R-I-A-L-B-O-X.com. cerealbox.com, delivering addictive
[20:40]book content in shortlisten or read installments. Thanks to Ryan and Steve at Texture Sound
[20:45]for the audio editing and mixing. Thanks for listening to Momstone. Have time to read books.